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Other Hunting => Coyote, Small Game, Varmints => Topic started by: TeacherMan on January 01, 2011, 11:16:13 PM


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Title: Wanting a new predator gun, .223, .204, 22-250
Post by: TeacherMan on January 01, 2011, 11:16:13 PM
I've been saving to buy a new predator gun and I wish there wasn't so many options it would make my life so much easier  :chuckle: Two real questions, I have enough saved to buy a new Remington RTV (bolt action) or should I keep saving and wait until this spring/summer and buy a Remington R-15 (AR style rifle)? The other question is what caliber??? I like the availability of the .223 ammo but I like the distance of the 22-250 and don't know much about the .204? What are your thoughts. I would say I like to take shots out to 500 for fun, but that's not commom, most under 250yds. What to do, what to do... I guess if this is the worst of my problems I'm doing good  ;)

Forgot to say mostly for yotes and cats, but possible wolf and or cougar size animals as well. One more question, what type of glass would you put on top???

thanks!

Title: Re: Wanting a new predator gun, .223, .204, 22-250
Post by: Huntbear on January 01, 2011, 11:21:57 PM
Build your own heavy barreled AR in whatever caliber you choose.
Title: Re: Wanting a new predator gun, .223, .204, 22-250
Post by: JimmyHoffa on January 01, 2011, 11:27:47 PM
since you wan't to occasionally shoot to 500....of the three choices I'd choose the .22-250. A little more forgiving on the wind/range error aspect.  but if you practice enough you could get to the same point with the .223.  As for glass, for the long shots, I think I'd want at least a 6-20x50.  I like to start with Leupold, but if you have the funds maybe nightforce or a European scope--Swaro/Zeiss/Schmit&Bender/etc.
Title: Re: Wanting a new predator gun, .223, .204, 22-250
Post by: bobcat on January 01, 2011, 11:38:15 PM
If you want it to work for cougar/wolves, I'd say get a 243.   :twocents:
Title: Re: Wanting a new predator gun, .223, .204, 22-250
Post by: carpsniperg2 on January 02, 2011, 12:17:36 AM
22-250. It will then be a bolt action rifle so there is your cal and gun. If you got the ar-15 style rifle i would get the 223.
Title: Re: Wanting a new predator gun, .223, .204, 22-250
Post by: PolarBear on January 02, 2011, 12:56:49 AM
I'm getting a Remington 700 SPS Varmint in .243 LH for coyotes and deer.  Great long range shooting rigs!
Title: Re: Wanting a new predator gun, .223, .204, 22-250
Post by: 700xcr on January 02, 2011, 06:25:48 AM
I'm getting a Remington 700 SPS Varmint in .243 LH for coyotes and deer.  Great long range shooting rigs!
I have the Remington 700 SPS Varmint in 223rem. and love it. Adjusted the trigger down to 2Ibs. and it is a tack driver. 243win. should make an excellent longer range varmint/deer caliber.
Title: Re: Wanting a new predator gun, .223, .204, 22-250
Post by: boneaddict on January 02, 2011, 06:26:30 AM
I've always been partial to the 25-06.
Title: Re: Wanting a new predator gun, .223, .204, 22-250
Post by: C-Money on January 02, 2011, 07:45:05 AM
If its just for varmints, I think I would go with a 22-250. My Varmint gun is a tack driving Ruger .243.
Title: Re: Wanting a new predator gun, .223, .204, 22-250
Post by: MIKEXRAY on January 02, 2011, 08:06:04 AM
I was an army brat and shot a lot of .223 and it is still what I chose but only because I haven't looked around at these other rounds. I'm sure in the last 20 years some of these kick .223 butt. Funny how I go through life shooting & using the same equipment. I guess I'm not an " experimenter". Mike
Title: Re: Wanting a new predator gun, .223, .204, 22-250
Post by: Rgrady35 on January 02, 2011, 08:09:08 AM
Sticking to your stated needs for this rifle, I would go .22-250. I've had a Remington .22-250 for 32 years now, it has been a excellent rifle.
Title: Re: Wanting a new predator gun, .223, .204, 22-250
Post by: Wanttohuntmore on January 02, 2011, 08:17:32 AM
With your choices, I'd say 22-250 as well.  If you're going to use it on chucks and rats as well, the 223 in a heavy barreled AR, with a 1 in 8 or 1 in 7 twist.  It will allow you to use heavy bullets for the yotes, and 52's for the rats/chucks. 
Title: Re: Wanting a new predator gun, .223, .204, 22-250
Post by: oldschool on January 02, 2011, 08:57:23 AM
Heavy barrel 22-250 ;)
Title: Re: Wanting a new predator gun, .223, .204, 22-250
Post by: satchel3006 on January 02, 2011, 09:57:41 AM
If you don't have an AR then I would say get the R15 just because AR's are fun to shoot
Title: Re: Wanting a new predator gun, .223, .204, 22-250
Post by: TeacherMan on January 02, 2011, 11:15:44 AM
Thanks for all the info guys, I have a 243 that I use on deer and have taken yotes out to 617 yds with (hit him in the spine above his back legs but dropped him). So I'm really thinking 22-250 in the Remington VTR or a Ruger with a bull barrel.

What would a good range be on a .223 in the R15 with 22" barrel. The gun just looks cool  :chuckle:
Title: Re: Wanting a new predator gun, .223, .204, 22-250
Post by: carpsniperg2 on January 02, 2011, 11:25:42 AM
I have shot a lot of yotes over the years with 223's. I have had a lot of runners, with the 223. You knock them down and then they get up and take off. I would say 300 is a good range for that gun. I don't like to shoot my 223's past 200+ yards. Even though they will kill, it can't compare to the 22-250.
Title: Re: Wanting a new predator gun, .223, .204, 22-250
Post by: BlackRidge on January 02, 2011, 10:44:26 PM
I have shot a lot of yotes over the years with 223's. I have had a lot of runners, with the 223. You knock them down and then they get up and take off. I would say 300 is a good range for that gun. I don't like to shoot my 223's past 200+ yards. Even though they will kill, it can't compare to the 22-250.

+1

The 223 can be accurate out to 500yrds under good/ideal conditions, but it wont have much knock-down power at that point, out to 200-250, it still does fairly well. I went with the standard AR15 setup because of how common/inexpensive the 223/5.56 rounds were, theyve gone up a little in price, but its still a fantastic caliber to reload for (plenty of component options to find that perfect round for your gun/barrel). The thing I like about the AR platform is the versatility it brings to the table

The 223 may not be the best varmint round out there, but in comparison to others like the 22-250 & .204, its abundant and inexpensive OTC.

If distance is a deal breakers, the 22-250 is definitely the answer though, well worth the small increase in $$ for ammo for the trade-off in results downrange. That will reach out and touch a yote at 500yrds easy and as carp alluded to, it won't be getting back up to taunt you
Title: Re: Wanting a new predator gun, .223, .204, 22-250
Post by: halfpipe88 on January 03, 2011, 08:25:30 AM
Go with a big caliber.  If you don't hit them square on you will still get your coyote.  I've seen too many coyotes hit good with a .223 that still run forever. I shoot a .270 WSM, haven't wounded and lost a coyote yet :)
Title: Re: Wanting a new predator gun, .223, .204, 22-250
Post by: jackelope on January 03, 2011, 08:40:17 AM
You're talking about possibly needing it for wolves and cats....a .22-250 would be minimum IMO. I'd look real hard at a .243 or .25something or other. A lot of stuff bites back up there where you're hunting so don't mess around.


                                
Title: Re: Wanting a new predator gun, .223, .204, 22-250
Post by: Special T on January 03, 2011, 09:39:03 AM
Thinking man Since you said you already have a 243 I would go with the AR I shot a buddies cold with the Nikon BDC and loved it! If you really need something with more kick then you already own it... It you want relative long rage shooting with rapid follow up shots... Go with the AR Follow up shots with the AR i shot were very nice... greater possibility of a double because it lack the kick the other cal everyone is talking about... You already own a one shot one kill rifle...  :twocents:
Title: Re: Wanting a new predator gun, .223, .204, 22-250
Post by: TeacherMan on January 03, 2011, 03:23:18 PM
Thanks for all the info guys, I'm saving till June for the AR, I went out today and got a nice Nikon 6-24x42 scope for my .243 and some 58 grain vmax bullets Hornady loads. I will turn it into a predator killer for know. Thanks again!
Title: Re: Wanting a new predator gun, .223, .204, 22-250
Post by: Straight Shooter on January 03, 2011, 06:09:26 PM
Thanks for all the info guys, I'm saving till June for the AR, I went out today and got a nice Nikon 6-24x42 scope for my .243 and some 58 grain vmax bullets Hornady loads. I will turn it into a predator killer for know. Thanks again!

I picked up 6 boxes of the moly-coated 58 gr V-Max loads... shooting sub-MOA at 200 yards. 
Title: Re: Wanting a new predator gun, .223, .204, 22-250
Post by: homehunter on January 03, 2011, 06:54:29 PM
Haven't had any problems killing dogs with my 204
Title: Re: Wanting a new predator gun, .223, .204, 22-250
Post by: norsepeak on January 03, 2011, 07:10:24 PM
got a NIB 223 encore for sale if your interested
Title: Re: Wanting a new predator gun, .223, .204, 22-250
Post by: wadu1 on January 03, 2011, 07:24:59 PM
I like 22.250 bolt guns, I run .53 gr Barns TSX-FB on top of 38 gr of H380. Just a simple long range shooter.
 :twocents:
Title: Re: Wanting a new predator gun, .223, .204, 22-250
Post by: BlackRidge on January 04, 2011, 11:20:22 AM
Thanks for all the info guys, I'm saving till June for the AR, I went out today and got a nice Nikon 6-24x42 scope for my .243 and some 58 grain vmax bullets Hornady loads. I will turn it into a predator killer for know. Thanks again!

When you finally are ready to buy one, check out J&S Gun Parts (http://jsgunparts.com/store/) down in Olympia. Best prices/selection I've seen locally, great guys too, they all worked for Olympic Arms at one point, or still do
Title: Re: Wanting a new predator gun, .223, .204, 22-250
Post by: Bofire on January 04, 2011, 04:14:08 PM
 :)For your use go 243 as you have, I say forget 58/55 grain bullets, close in they have good numbers but not at any range.(past 300 yards). I use 80 grain soft points in mine, damn good killer, deer or coyotes, like you already said an AR would be a good new gun!! :chuckle:
Carl
Title: Re: Wanting a new predator gun, .223, .204, 22-250
Post by: 204chucknorris on January 04, 2011, 07:00:50 PM
I am partial on this right now since i have a savage heavy barrel 204 and flat love it! I zeroed it at 300 and have no issues taking shots out to 400. I have not yet had a dog run from a shot! I have shot dogs in the 300 yard range and they dropped in their tracks, I just make sure to get a chest shot! I recently bought a AR in 223 and it has yet to prove itself, but in all fairness I have not had the dog to shoot at yet! Cheap to reload and fast (204) heavier bullets and fast (22-250)! Just my 2 cents! If you get a 204 make sure to watch rate of twist!! 1-10 would be best!
Title: Re: Wanting a new predator gun, .223, .204, 22-250
Post by: MuleySniper on January 04, 2011, 07:11:24 PM
.204 need I say more? I'm a poet and didn't even know it. :chuckle:
MS
Title: Re: Wanting a new predator gun, .223, .204, 22-250
Post by: 7mag. on January 05, 2011, 02:31:52 PM
I know the VTR's are a cool looking rifle, but the they have too short a barrel for a 22-250. With the short barrel, you're not going to get great range with a .223 either. I think they are more of a novelty gun than a good varmint killer.
Title: Re: Wanting a new predator gun, .223, .204, 22-250
Post by: Jerry malbeck on January 06, 2011, 10:17:17 PM
Why in the world would any one want a bull barreled rifle for a calling gun?
to heavy, wont swing fast, and ya gotta pack that anchor around all day . if your not going to be shooting multiple rounds there is no need for a bull barrel , all a bull barrel does is dissipate heat a lil better until they get good and hot , then you have to let them cool for a longer period of time , just makes no sense to me for a gun you will be calling critters with .  :twocents:
Title: Re: Wanting a new predator gun, .223, .204, 22-250
Post by: wastickslinger on January 06, 2011, 10:26:43 PM
I know the VTR's are a cool looking rifle, but the they have too short a barrel for a 22-250. With the short barrel, you're not going to get great range with a .223 either. I think they are more of a novelty gun than a good varmint killer.

My VTR has a 24" barrel. Almost too long for wheeling and dealing.  :twocents:  And mine literally stacks bullets. At the range the first time at 100 yards 509er and Antlerking thought I was missing the target after the first shot. After further inspection I had just made my first hole a little bigger.  :chuckle:  Mine is a .204. I love it.
Title: Re: Wanting a new predator gun, .223, .204, 22-250
Post by: Special T on January 07, 2011, 09:30:40 AM
My bro in law just got a steal on a Rem r15 with the Nikon coyote scope 22 barell... So jeluse... I can't wait to go over there and whack some yotes with him! I'm so happy one of us finally got an AR cus neither one for us can shoot worth a Wooden nickel... Guess I'll be riding shotgun...  :IBCOOL:
Title: Re: Wanting a new predator gun, .223, .204, 22-250
Post by: Everett on January 15, 2011, 04:45:18 PM
The Remington R-25 is supposed to be good, but I'm not sure what the price difference is between the R-15 and the R-25.
Title: Re: Wanting a new predator gun, .223, .204, 22-250
Post by: TheSkyBuster on January 15, 2011, 05:13:20 PM
I like 22.250 bolt guns, I run .53 gr Barns TSX-FB on top of 38 gr of H380. Just a simple long range shooter.
 :twocents:


I tried the 53 gr TSX-FB in my light barreled 700 SPS stainless and they were all over the paper. I figured it was the 1 in 14" twist and/or the lenght of the bullet and quit using them after the first batch.  I could be wrong though I never really revisited that problem.
Title: Re: Wanting a new predator gun, .223, .204, 22-250
Post by: CAMPMEAT on January 15, 2011, 05:22:52 PM
Why in the world would any one want a bull barreled rifle for a calling gun?
to heavy, wont swing fast, and ya gotta pack that anchor around all day . if your not going to be shooting multiple rounds there is no need for a bull barrel , all a bull barrel does is dissipate heat a lil better until they get good and hot , then you have to let them cool for a longer period of time , just makes no sense to me for a gun you will be calling critters with .  :twocents:


How many miles do you carry your gun per day ? I go and sit down someplace, so distance isn't a big deal. :twocents:
Title: Re: Wanting a new predator gun, .223, .204, 22-250
Post by: jackelope on January 15, 2011, 08:42:59 PM
The Remington R-25 is supposed to be good, but I'm not sure what the price difference is between the R-15 and the R-25.

It's not a price difference, it's a caliber difference...kinda like a AR-15 and an AR-10.
Title: Re: Wanting a new predator gun, .223, .204, 22-250
Post by: jackelope on January 15, 2011, 08:44:38 PM
p.s. I took my Encore to the range today and dialed my 22-250 (24" bull barrel) with the cheap 45 grn JHP Winchester rounds and shot about .75" groups at 100  :) . 29.99 for 40 rounds.
Title: Re: Wanting a new predator gun, .223, .204, 22-250
Post by: brew on January 15, 2011, 09:40:19 PM
this is my set up...i bought it about 11 years ago.  It is a Winchester Model 70 "Coyote" 22-250.....it has the laminated stock and the stainless bbl.  As far as scopes I consider myself a Leupold guy but put the Nikon 6.5-20 on it after side by side comparisons...the Nikon was brighter to me (also cost a couple hundred bucks more than the gun).  It's got the adjustable turrets on the scope for windage and elevation.  The only problem I've had with it was the trigger pull...adjusted it down so now it's great. Crazy thing with it is when I'm shooting on the range is that I've really got to time my shots between hearbeats cuz when its in my caldwell rest I can see the crosshairs moving in conjunction with my heartbeats when I'm really zeroed in....shoots like a dream when i do my part...never really shot it past 250 yds but would love to see what it can do......pic is on on of my bear rugs that i've had rolled up for a while for contrast-thats why the hair is all jacked up...just got done moving and need to roll it out
Title: Re: Wanting a new predator gun, .223, .204, 22-250
Post by: tlbradford on January 15, 2011, 09:46:51 PM
Jerry, I'm surprised about your comments on the bull barrel.  They are steadier in windy conditions which we deal with a lot in E Wash, they swing smoother on the long distance runners, and a synthetic stock bull barrel is about the same weight as most of the standard AR's that are so popular now.

Of course, I'm hitting the local stores looking for a used bolt action pistol since I'm packing a camera most of the time and calling for others.  Maybe a Contender.
Title: Re: Wanting a new predator gun, .223, .204, 22-250
Post by: jackelope on January 15, 2011, 09:54:30 PM
My 22-250 critter gitter. 6-18x50 cheap Bushnell scope but it works.
Title: Re: Wanting a new predator gun, .223, .204, 22-250
Post by: Bofire on January 16, 2011, 09:42:17 AM
 :)I used a bull barrel tikka for one season,the tikka bull is lighter than most, too heavy, very hard to swing on runners, harder to adjust as you track a dog coming in. I liked it for Pdogs. My calling rifle is just under 7 pounds loaded scoped and sling. perfect! I do not like AR's either, awkward, most are way heavy, I do not like how the scopes mount, too high. I like 223 and 22-250 equal, 204 is probably OK but not legal for Cougar so I won't use one.
Carl
Title: Re: Wanting a new predator gun, .223, .204, 22-250
Post by: Sidewinder on January 16, 2011, 11:06:46 PM
Since you have a 243 for the larger critters, I would go with the 204. It will easily take prairie dogs out to 600 yards. It cuts the wind better than the .224 caliber due to the better BC. It is accurate and can see the hit in the scope.  8) I have a CZ in 223 and it is too light. I have a tough time keeping it steady off hand. Shooting of sticks they are all good. I have a Savage 12VLP in 204 and it weighs over 10 pounds out of the box and it just got too heavy to lug around. Sometimes you have to walk a long ways to get to all your sets.
Title: Re: Wanting a new predator gun, .223, .204, 22-250
Post by: BlackRidge on January 16, 2011, 11:59:40 PM
My 22-250 critter gitter. 6-18x50 cheap Bushnell scope but it works.


Nice setup  :tup:

Title: Re: Wanting a new predator gun, .223, .204, 22-250
Post by: pronghorn on January 17, 2011, 08:57:37 PM
 I think you need to go with whats most comfortable to you. If you're wanting to go for accuracy, then I believe the.204 may be a little light. The 22-250 would be a good caliber as long as you shoot 52 -55gr bullet. Even then be aware of your wind speeds.
 I shoot a Savage model 12  22-250 with a 6-25x52 Millet scope. It took awhile but I'm shooting out to 500 yards comfotably.
Title: Re: Wanting a new predator gun, .223, .204, 22-250
Post by: CAMPMEAT on January 17, 2011, 09:18:44 PM
My 22-250 critter gitter. 6-18x50 cheap Bushnell scope but it works.



I have to same exact gun and scope.............are we related ?
Title: Re: Wanting a new predator gun, .223, .204, 22-250
Post by: jackelope on January 18, 2011, 07:19:50 AM
damn...that's almost scary. I even have the ammo holder thing. I just didn't have it on there for the pic.
Good taste.
JB
Title: Re: Wanting a new predator gun, .223, .204, 22-250
Post by: ducks55 on January 18, 2011, 01:25:19 PM
What gun is that?
My 22-250 critter gitter. 6-18x50 cheap Bushnell scope but it works.



I have to same exact gun and scope.............are we related ?
Title: Re: Wanting a new predator gun, .223, .204, 22-250
Post by: CAMPMEAT on January 18, 2011, 03:51:09 PM
damn...that's almost scary. I even have the ammo holder thing. I just didn't have it on there for the pic.
Good taste.
JB


No wonder the coyotes run when they see me, there's 2 of us..................
Title: Re: Wanting a new predator gun, .223, .204, 22-250
Post by: CAMPMEAT on January 18, 2011, 03:53:14 PM
What gun is that?
My 22-250 critter gitter. 6-18x50 cheap Bushnell scope but it works.



I have to same exact gun and scope.............are we related ?

T/C Encore 22-250 w/26 inch bull barrel and Bushnell 6x18x50 scope. Works very well I might add.
Title: Re: Wanting a new predator gun, .223, .204, 22-250
Post by: CAMPMEAT on January 18, 2011, 03:55:44 PM
Forgot, I've had a trigger job done on mine from EABCO. I think it's set at 2 1/2-3 lbs. It's been awhile since it was done.
Title: Re: Wanting a new predator gun, .223, .204, 22-250
Post by: jackelope on January 18, 2011, 04:06:28 PM
Mine has a trigger job from a local smith, the Bellm TC's 1x hinge pin, their hammer extender and their heavier hammer springs(no misfires with the extender).
It shoots nicely, outshoots me anyway. This is a 2.5" orange dot at 100 yards.
Title: Re: Wanting a new predator gun, .223, .204, 22-250
Post by: HuntHigh on January 18, 2011, 04:22:52 PM
204s are sweet guns  that strait flatten yotes if you hit em right, but if you have wolf or cougar on the mind as well id go a little larger than even the 22-250 the 243wssm's are sick and i shoot a 6mm with 62gr Barnes varmint grenades  for smallgame and Barnes tipped triple shocks in 80 gr for larger game. Ive never used anything other than Leupold and Burris for glass but i really like both.
Title: Re: Wanting a new predator gun, .223, .204, 22-250
Post by: BlackRidge on January 18, 2011, 04:27:45 PM
Nice setup campmeat, I was gonna say, that looks awefully familiar  :chuckle:
Title: Re: Wanting a new predator gun, .223, .204, 22-250
Post by: CAMPMEAT on January 18, 2011, 05:23:49 PM
Nice setup campmeat, I was gonna say, that looks awefully familiar  :chuckle:

Why thank you. I also put my 300 win mag barrel on that frame too. Coyotes hate that gun big time !!! No matter, just big splatter.
Title: Re: Wanting a new predator gun, .223, .204, 22-250
Post by: jackelope on January 18, 2011, 05:31:42 PM
I've got a 300wm barrel for mine too...
Ohh geez this is really getting spooky.
Title: Re: Wanting a new predator gun, .223, .204, 22-250
Post by: CAMPMEAT on January 18, 2011, 05:54:53 PM
I've got a 300wm barrel for mine too...
Ohh geez this is really getting spooky.


Ok, Ok. How about pistol barrels ? All 15". 308, 450, 454 ?
Title: Re: Wanting a new predator gun, .223, .204, 22-250
Post by: BlackRidge on January 19, 2011, 11:14:31 AM
I've got a 300wm barrel for mine too...
Ohh geez this is really getting spooky.


 :hello:  ....same here, spooky indeed (well, close .223 and 300wm)

No pistol barrels..... yet, any suggestions?
Title: Re: Wanting a new predator gun, .223, .204, 22-250
Post by: dad98684 on January 19, 2011, 11:24:12 AM
Nice setup campmeat, I was gonna say, that looks awefully familiar  :chuckle:

Why thank you. I also put my 300 win mag barrel on that frame too. Coyotes hate that gun big time !!! No matter, just big splatter.

I have have been thinking about a 223 or 22-250 barrel for my encore, i have 4 barrels (300wm, 45-70, 20ga, 22lr) & 2 frames so far, and i have been watching this post and i just can't decide. i am leaning toward 223, here on the west side i would be surprised if i had a shot over 250 yards.
Title: Re: Wanting a new predator gun, .223, .204, 22-250
Post by: jackelope on January 19, 2011, 11:27:52 AM
.22-250 will work great under 250 or out to 500. I don't think you have that longer range ability with the .223 as was stated earlier. I'd get the .22-250( I guess I already did) that way you're covered for both sides of the hill. They're the same price anyway.
I'm looking for a 12 gauge turkey barrel if anyone's got one collecting dust by the way.

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