Post by: Seatown5 on April 22, 2011, 06:39:13 PM
Post by: h2ofowlr on April 22, 2011, 06:55:38 PM
Post by: bearpaw on April 22, 2011, 06:57:07 PM
As far as I know the season is a statewide season except for any areas specifically closed to hunting. I would look through the phamplet pretty close first. Maybe somebdy else has more info?
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on April 22, 2011, 07:06:45 PM
Post by: Seatown5 on April 23, 2011, 09:19:56 AM
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on April 23, 2011, 09:23:18 AM
Post by: skagit on April 23, 2011, 10:24:59 AM
Post by: cryfowl on April 23, 2011, 10:28:30 AM
Post by: h2ofowlr on April 23, 2011, 10:52:08 AM
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on April 23, 2011, 10:35:04 PM
Post by: Andrew on April 28, 2011, 01:33:53 PM
Regs are statewide...therefore, if you are not in a city's limits go for it. However, just because you are in the county does not mean you within a shooting zone. If you are able to shoot be mindful of distances from roads etc. Heard of guys getting busted for being to close to a maintained road while duck hunting.
Post by: STIKNSTRINGBOW on April 28, 2011, 01:40:09 PM
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on April 28, 2011, 02:00:32 PM
Post by: Special T on April 28, 2011, 02:39:49 PM
Post by: Wacenturion on April 28, 2011, 04:16:59 PM
Wasn't there a program to transplant excess birds (Merriams , I think?) from NE to There, or was that shot down ? I remember quite a controversy over the issue.....
NWTF biologists recommended to WDFW to plant Rio Grande's up in Whatcom county a year or two ago, and they bought it hook, line and sinker . Reason given by the NWTF was that WDFW was pre-mature in planting Easterns in western Washington from mid 80's through the 90's, and should have planted Rio's instead. That numskull idea was based on the obvious simple fact that Rio's had done so well from Roseburg ,Oregon all the way down into California. Yeah I can certainly see that working. Whatcom is really dry and has mostly open oak woodlands as a habitat base. That idiotic idea makes about as much sense as global warming put forth by Al Bore.
Small organic farmers questioned potential damge problems which WDFW had no answers for. The proposal got shot down....and good thing it did. Would have been a disaster. Easterns could have been sold with no nuisance problems....too bad. Now it's unlikely any birds will ever get released up there. A moronic exercise from the very start. If truth be know WDFW staff in Region 4 as well as in Olympia now have the perfect excuse not to do anything. Whatcom was only a tidbit been put out there in lieu of no releases elsewhere in the state.
I elaborated on this issue back when it was happening, even going as far as posting harvest records for NW Oregon counties that were similar in habitat to western Washington. Want to guess how many Rio's were harvested in those Oregon counties.....the answer......nada....none...zero. That should have been the first clue. Just an unbelievably stupid scientific recommendation.
Post by: prophet on April 28, 2011, 05:03:31 PM
Post by: yelp on April 28, 2011, 08:56:41 PM
http://nwifc.org/2010/08/wild-turkey-population-introduced-on-tulalip-reservation/ (http://nwifc.org/2010/08/wild-turkey-population-introduced-on-tulalip-reservation/)
Post by: yelp on April 28, 2011, 09:00:18 PM
http://youtu.be/LztKrp2B6qk (http://youtu.be/LztKrp2B6qk)
Post by: Wacenturion on April 28, 2011, 09:00:47 PM
Post by: Wacenturion on April 28, 2011, 09:01:53 PM
Post by: yelp on April 28, 2011, 09:03:21 PM
...the music is awesome! :chuckle:
Post by: Wacenturion on April 28, 2011, 10:44:02 PM
Really can't blame the tribe for trying. If WDFW did their job you could have conceivably had the real deal released on tribal lands in a partnership effort. Now we end up with another game farm experiment.....and we know how they always end up.
Post by: lokidog on April 28, 2011, 10:59:48 PM
Post by: Turkeyman on April 29, 2011, 05:45:32 AM
Post by: yelp on April 29, 2011, 05:46:03 AM
YOU CAN BUY EASTERN STOCK CHICKS AND EGGS FROM THE ONLINE POULTRY PLACES. These have the same genes as any that WDFW released here in Western WA.
Lokidog are you a geneticist? If so do you have any evidence to support your comments? If so I am impressed. Inbreeding in game farms is nowhere near trapping wild stock and releasing wild stock. Also are the catalog varieties disease free? Disease tested for any of the nasty pathogens? Tribes, private farms, people who release game farm stock are doing no good releasing these types. As you see in Laconnor and Twisp for examples..They have created issues. Also they threaten the healthy released flocks that were released in Arlington. Those flocks came from wild stock in Iowa and were quarantined at SeaTac until they passed all the necessary blood work showing no diseases. They also were released in areas where a habitat evaluation was completed and approved prior to all releases. They weren't released willy nilly in any habitat out there.
Post by: Skyvalhunter on April 29, 2011, 05:55:52 AM
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on April 29, 2011, 06:02:12 AM
Post by: yelp on April 29, 2011, 06:08:46 AM
Post by: Seatown5 on April 29, 2011, 06:43:52 AM
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on April 29, 2011, 06:49:05 AM
Post by: yelp on April 29, 2011, 06:52:59 AM
Post by: lokidog on April 29, 2011, 07:28:39 AM
And yes, I have probably taken more genetics and wildlife management classes than most people buying a hunting license.
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on April 29, 2011, 07:40:08 AM
Post by: yelp on April 29, 2011, 07:50:29 AM
Whatever. I am just glad somebody released those genetically inferior dumb birds that drown when they look up in the rain while running around their improper habitatabout fifteen years ago out here so I can see them, hear them, and yes sometimes even hunt them.... Funny thing, our chickens go running for cover when an eagle or vulture flies by, but I guess they are smarter than a turkey having been hatched in the wild,oh wait a minute, never mind....
And yes, I have probably taken more genetics and wildlife management classes than most people buying a hunting license.
That's what I thought. :chuckle: We are all entitled to our opinions. Have a great Day Lokidog! :hello:
Post by: Special T on April 29, 2011, 08:02:50 AM
http://wildlifemanagementtechnologies.com/Store/Product/15:Traditional_Surrogator (http://wildlifemanagementtechnologies.com/Store/Product/15:Traditional_Surrogator)
Could there not be a way for that kind of idea to work for turkeys?
The 2 argument i heard as to why releasing doesn't work is wrong species, and pen raising "dumb" birds...
If those are the arguments what species should we use, or what ones have we used that didn't work?
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on April 29, 2011, 08:17:19 AM
Post by: STIKNSTRINGBOW on April 29, 2011, 08:25:58 AM
As far as my understanding, the first plants in Washington were from pen raised birds, and were unsuccessful, which is why they began using "wild captured" birds.
but if the tribes want to gamble with a lousy bet, who am I to criticize ?
But as far as I understand it, 170 captive bred birds can be purchased for a couple hundred dollars, and "Wild Captured" birds run over $75 APEICE, so...
Please release a few hundred and we shall see how many survive....
Genetics aside, if one or two breeders make it, in a few generations, there might be some to be hunted in that area, and you would be hard pressed to tell the difference, as long as it is "tribal" money what do we care ?
they are not going to introduce any diseases to the wild Turkeys already in the area, are they ?
Post by: singleshot12 on April 29, 2011, 08:34:53 AM
Besides the fact all the time and money which went into releasing birds in Arlington ( pilchuck tree farm ) are in lock down do to new owners of the property who forbid hunting on there land ... sweeeet !
Never could figure why all that time and money was spent on that when the tree farm and surrounding private land has been closed to hunting for years. Now the locals complain about them crapping in their yard.
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on April 29, 2011, 08:46:56 AM
Post by: singleshot12 on April 29, 2011, 09:07:45 AM
Drove through Tulalip reservation the other day 20 turkeys standing in the middle of the road almost plowed them over, looks like the indians will have some good hunting if they can keep them off the busy hiway.
Post by: Special T on April 29, 2011, 09:13:15 AM
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on April 29, 2011, 09:17:41 AM
Post by: STIKNSTRINGBOW on April 29, 2011, 09:49:03 AM
Now there are scattered small flocks spread out and seems like I see more racoon and coyote sign than anything (became a predator hunter more than a turkey hunter)
I am not a biologist, but I do know that in-breeding can be as detrimental as introduction of inferior genetics, diseases, etc...
According to my resources (internet) a stable population CAN expand an average of 5 miles a year, but that would probably require the addition of new blood to the gene pool, to improve genetic diversity and the overall health of the whole flock.
It is not due to over harvesting that you rarely see the Turkeys here in their origional release areas, it is stagnation and predation.
...
The WDFW has made the statement...
Quote
Northwest Population Management Unit (PMU P40)Were the 38 Birds released on Pilchuck pen raised ? You said they were "True Easterns", but where did they come from ?
Various releases since 1925 have failed to establish populations on the mainland or the
San Juan Islands. Most releases utilized pen-raised stock, were limited in number, and
were widely scattered. Between 1998 and 2000, 38 turkeys were introduced into the
Pilchuck Tree Farm (Snohomish County). While occasional sightings of one or two
birds have been reported as far as five miles away, suggesting the birds have
reproduced to some degree, populations remain very low.
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on April 29, 2011, 10:04:30 AM
Post by: Wacenturion on April 29, 2011, 11:09:40 AM
Sounds to me like the tribes might actually be a benifit to us sportsman. Especially since they can cut through teh red tape. First Antelope now turkeys? Hmm I think we will start seeing a tren here! :brew:
You're forgetting one big thing.....the Antelope were wild trapped animals which works. The Tualip turkeys are nothing more than tame birds...period. If they had somehow partnered with say a tribe back east and trapped and received wild Easterns....would have been great.
Also....those game farm birds no matter where they are, poise nothing more than nuisance problems in numbers or tame birds in limited populations.. The only thing that saves them from eradication is public opinion from half the local town population...i.e LaConner.
Bottom line is they give real turkeys a bad rap. That eventually filters down to you the hunter. As I have said before the main reason there are no birds being released in counties north of Tacoma/Seattle is the historic nuisance problems that once were evident on the islands years ago. Region 4 staff have for the last 30 years used that argument to stop releases up there. Now you can see how that can filter down to you.......equating to lost opportunity.
Post by: Wacenturion on April 29, 2011, 11:16:15 AM
Some people will never learn. :dunno:
Meaning.........just how many game farm experiments with tame birds does it take in this country before we do it the right way. The literature is loaded with failures. When game farm releases were abandoned in the 50's-60's and states started to experiment with live trapping and relocation, populations started to take hold and expand, eventually leading to one of the biggest success stories in wildlife management in the past 30 years, as evidenced by nationwide populations as they are today.
But you already knew that..
Post by: grundy53 on April 29, 2011, 11:23:23 AM
Post by: Wacenturion on April 29, 2011, 11:24:00 AM
With the WDFW basically giving up on the Turkeys here in Western Washington, I see nothing wrong with someone else footing the bill for planting them.
As far as my understanding, the first plants in Washington were from pen raised birds, and were unsuccessful, which is why they began using "wild captured" birds.
but if the tribes want to gamble with a lousy bet, who am I to criticize ?
But as far as I understand it, 170 captive bred birds can be purchased for a couple hundred dollars, and "Wild Captured" birds run over $75 APEICE, so...
Please release a few hundred and we shall see how many survive....
Genetics aside, if one or two breeders make it, in a few generations, there might be some to be hunted in that area, and you would be hard pressed to tell the difference, as long as it is "tribal" money what do we care ?
they are not going to introduce any diseases to the wild Turkeys already in the area, are they ?
Stikn......let me explain it this way. You have put in the time and effort to know how to hunt western Washington Easterns. As you know I have followed you episodes over the past couple years trying to help where I could. Here is my simpliest comparison of these tribal birds and what they equate to...........
Wild western Washington Easterns........tough, ghosts, got to believe, probably the toughest turkey to take in United States.
Game Farm Tualip easterns.......spot birds...walk within range...shoot.
I think you get my drift.
Post by: Wacenturion on April 29, 2011, 11:55:14 AM
I just wish they would release some more wild easterns in sw Washington. Like sticknstring said they need the genetic diversity.
I agree completely. Should have planted a whole lot more, and should still be planting. Lots of areas in western Washington to fill in. But understand two things were working against it.
First....WDFW reorganization in 1999 essentially killed the turkey introduction program. Meaning the idiots in Wildlife Management now had control. Those are the same folks as an example that brought you the wonderful new innovative permit system we now have. Enough said....
Second...The NWTF parent organization in Edgefield, South Carolina, positioned themselves as middle man brokers so to speak during the mid 90's. What these meant was that a price was put on the cost of trapping the different subspecies of turkeys. Merriam's and Rio's were $100 a bird with shipping cost on top of that, and Easterns were $500 a bird, also without shipping. The high cost of Easterns was because of smaller flock size and their inherent nature makes them much more difficult to trap.
Washington chapters had to in essence borrow the money and pay it back. The NWTF even charged administrative fees (telephone calls etc) on top of that and interest on the money. Truth be know....it's all about the money.
Really sad thing is before the NWTF set themselves up as a broker, states readily traded birds for other species or for the most part sent birds free of charge, with the exception of shipping costs. An example of state wildlife agencies helping each other.
We could have had many more Easterns during the mid to late 90's if those greedy car salesmen at the NWTF had stayed the hell out of the the Washington State turkey business. You can take that to the bank!
Post by: Wacenturion on April 29, 2011, 12:21:41 PM
Besides the fact all the time and money which went into releasing birds in Arlington ( pilchuck tree farm ) are in lock down do to new owners of the property who forbid hunting on there land ... sweeeet !
Never could figure why all that time and money was spent on that when the tree farm and surrounding private land has been closed to hunting for years. Now the locals complain about them crapping in their yard.
As Bowhunter has already pointed out, there was an agreement in place between Pilchuck and WDFW. Things change over time. We don't have control over that. However birds exist on and adjacent to Pilchuck and will hopefully continue to expand over the years. That is the real benefit. With a little luck you may someday have an opportunity at hunting birds in that area.
For what it's worth I'm sure the opportunity already exists on adjacent lands that one could access now if they were willing to put in the time and effort. Be warned....not easy even where birds do exist in Thurston, Cowlitz, Pacific,and Lewis counties as an example.
Post by: Wacenturion on April 29, 2011, 12:25:51 PM
Sounds like a screwed up deal to me.. but hopefully they will expand onto huntable property. Land in western wash is shrinking so fast that I'm not keeping my hopes up. I know of four other spots where the turkeys are thriving, and all four spots closed to hunting forever.
Drove through Tulalip reservation the other day 20 turkeys standing in the middle of the road almost plowed them over, looks like the indians will have some good hunting if they can keep them off the busy hiway.
I know its a just matter of semantics, but what you should have said was........
"looks like the Indians will have some good harvesting if they can keep them off the busy highway."
Kind of like harvesting broccoli....not real difficult. :chuckle:
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on April 29, 2011, 12:34:35 PM
Post by: Special T on April 29, 2011, 12:37:45 PM
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on April 29, 2011, 12:39:10 PM
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on April 29, 2011, 12:42:49 PM
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on April 29, 2011, 12:46:55 PM
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on April 29, 2011, 12:50:15 PM
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on April 29, 2011, 12:53:57 PM
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on April 29, 2011, 01:02:51 PM
Post by: Wacenturion on April 29, 2011, 01:07:07 PM
The main problem I see is if the trend that has been established here in SW Washington, the birds get planted, and several years of large populations, flocks expanding etc..
Now there are scattered small flocks spread out and seems like I see more racoon and coyote sign than anything (became a predator hunter more than a turkey hunter)
I am not a biologist, but I do know that in-breeding can be as detrimental as introduction of inferior genetics, diseases, etc...
According to my resources (internet) a stable population CAN expand an average of 5 miles a year, but that would probably require the addition of new blood to the gene pool, to improve genetic diversity and the overall health of the whole flock.
It is not due to over harvesting that you rarely see the Turkeys here in their origional release areas, it is stagnation and predation.
...
The WDFW has made the statement...QuoteNorthwest Population Management Unit (PMU P40)Were the 38 Birds released on Pilchuck pen raised ? You said they were "True Easterns", but where did they come from ?
Various releases since 1925 have failed to establish populations on the mainland or the
San Juan Islands. Most releases utilized pen-raised stock, were limited in number, and
were widely scattered. Between 1998 and 2000, 38 turkeys were introduced into the
Pilchuck Tree Farm (Snohomish County). While occasional sightings of one or two
birds have been reported as far as five miles away, suggesting the birds have
reproduced to some degree, populations remain very low.
Yes they were wild, as Bowhunter has already mentioned, they were from Iowa. Wild trapped in the field and shipped out here the following day. Released within a couple days of arrival after disease testing was completed.
As far as not seeing birds on original sites....easy answer. The habitat changes relatively quick in western Washington due to our climate. Areas where I routinely take Easterns out of are usually good for just a few short years and then they for the most part absent of sign. However, they were not far away. They just relocated into areas that mimicked where they had been for a few years previous...age of reprod., older timber borders etc. Problem was you had a 360 degree challenge to find them again...lol.
When all the Easterns were released from the mid 80's on, their genetic viability was ensured as much as possible with mixing of existing releases as well as future ones. An example would be the mixing of say Iowa birds prior to release with gobblers and hens from different counties as one example. Mixing of hens was also done so family groups were not entirely kept in tact.
In addition, new stocks in successive years were planted on top of existing bird to add to the gene pool...i.e. Missouri birds released in areas of Pennsylvania birds, Iowa birds on top of both Missouri and Pa. bird...and so forth over the years.
So in summary, our Easterns are doing just fine. The expansion of small groups, which by the way is the nature of the subspecies, will continue to add genetic strength overall. If you look in this year's regulations at the Estimated Spring Turkey Harvest, it will illustrate my point. The last releases were made in 2000 I believe. The harvest in area P50 Southwest slowly climbed from 26 in 1996 then up in the 40's and 50's until 2006 when it was 77. The 2009 harvest was 65, the second highest total in the 14 year span, and nine years after the last releases.
Area P40 Northwest shows a low harvest from 1996 to 2001, then after releases on Pilchuck increases are noted. However most of that increase probably comes from additional pursuit of birds on the islands and perhaps some other local game farm bird release type harvest like around LaConner perhaps or North Bend where another pocket of illegally released birds exist. Some may very well indeed be some production that was harvested from those wild releases in the Pilchuck area.
Our Easterns will continue to be the biggest turkey hunting challenge we have in state. A true trophy that would give the best of the good ol' southern and Midwest turkey experts fits.
Post by: Wacenturion on April 29, 2011, 01:11:14 PM
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on April 29, 2011, 01:14:58 PM
Post by: Wacenturion on April 29, 2011, 01:41:48 PM
YOU CAN BUY EASTERN STOCK CHICKS AND EGGS FROM THE ONLINE POULTRY PLACES. These have the same genes as any that WDFW released here in Western WA.
That's like saying Einstein and a person with the IQ of a grape have the same genes.
The only thing similar is that the WDFW wild released eastern birds and the eastern game farm stock birds both have turkey genes....nothing more, and certainly they are not similar in their contribution to the physical makeup of said birds. All other similarities stop there.
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on April 29, 2011, 01:44:40 PM
Post by: Wacenturion on April 29, 2011, 02:27:22 PM
yeah huh just advertise this on a site like this one .... :bdid: :bdid:
Advertise what....what am I missing?
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on April 29, 2011, 02:30:22 PM
Post by: Wacenturion on April 29, 2011, 02:32:50 PM
Post by: STIKNSTRINGBOW on April 29, 2011, 08:51:21 PM
Also I have only run into hens in 2 of those locations (although I know there are more than I will see, it just seems like 5 good areas, should have more hens.
I find droppings from a few birds at a time, the only time I find a lot of droppings, they are mostly popcorn sized, so I assume the are from poults...
As long as I continue to find Toms to hunt, cool, but I just wonder why they dont seem to spread into adjoining areas that have the same type of habitat.
or why are the only Toms I seem to run into (actually see) adult and I dont see Jakes at all ?
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on April 29, 2011, 09:07:27 PM
Post by: Special T on April 29, 2011, 10:46:49 PM
Post by: Wacenturion on April 30, 2011, 08:08:02 AM
I guess i always figured that coyotes and such would put the hurt on turkeys here on the west side... An acquaintance of mine that hunted turkeys near olympia said they weren't as talkative as on the east side... Do you guys think that is the case?
Generally speaking the answer is yes. However the reasons are twofold. Densities are lower and Easterns are in smaller groups, so that in itself means less birds heard.
In addition the vegetation in western Washington is dense and it literally eats up the sound of a gobble. Most times, but not always, you'll need to be within 100-200 yards of a gobbler to even hear them if they are being vocal.
If you don't believe that, then go out with a friend in a typical setting and walk away from each other in opposite directions and use your turkey calls at different distances like every 50 yards or so. I think you'll be surprised at how quickly you won't hear each other. Now I'm not saying you won't hear them at greater distances as it depends on vegetation and where you are located. If you're up above them, obviously you'll hear somewhat farther than being on flat ground in dense cover.
They do have a tendency to be as vocal as other subspecies. Hunting Easterns in western Washington kind of goes like this...you scout your ass off for two months prior to season, finally find sign, but hear no gobbles. In the weeks before the season, you stay on the sign, still no gobbles or you hear an occasional one every now or then. You're like a kid at Christmas. You're pretty confident you have your own little honey hole for the opener. You're finally going to kill the "Ghost" as many refer to them as. You become unknowingly distant and weird to anyone who you think might try to somehow find your spot. Your family have growing concerns that you may have gone over to the dark side.
Then on opening day a gobbler in your spot goes ballistic. Your twisted mind is now saying..."Hey I know you're here, shut the hell up and stop advertising the fact to anyone else that may be around or following me". He doesn't come in and you end the day somewhat disappointed but planning your next assault as you walk out. You may even wait for the cover of darkness to avoid being seen by anyone who might see you and think...A ha...must be turkeys in there, the guy is in camo. These Eastern birds can make you really do weird things. Just ask some who have been there and done that............ :chuckle:
Post by: singleshot12 on April 30, 2011, 08:38:37 AM
I guess i always figured that coyotes and such would put the hurt on turkeys here on the west side...
From what I've seen coyotes aren't near as hard on turkeys as the over abundance of bald and golden eagles we have here on the rainy side. Most of the young birds every year get picked off while out grazing clover in farm fields. There is always a few that eventually get smart, stay close to the dense cover, and graze in people's yards instead of open fields.
This I think is one of the main reason's turkeys here on the west side are so slow to take off in most areas close to the coast.
Post by: Wacenturion on April 30, 2011, 10:18:44 AM
Rarely will a coyote take a healthy adult turkey for the most part. I've actually seen a big Gobbler square off with a coyote and force his exit. Hens on the other hand fly short distances and land every time the coyote gets close enough to make an attempt. After awhile of that game the coyote moves on. Seen that many times.
It just depends as far as predator kills. Take the NE as an example. Lots of birds so just from a numbers point of view, predators will take more. Just a greater availability.....more young, more sick, more old. Remember turkeys have multiple sets of eyes watching their back, plus they can see almost 270 degrees. The only thing they don't see is directly behind their head, and to solve that, all they have to do is move their head slightly, one way or the other.
In summary I'll pass along something a long time turkey biologist from Missouri told me once. If a predator takes an adult turkey, then there was something wrong with that bird. Obviously an over simplification, but I think you can take from it what he was alluding to.
Post by: Wacenturion on April 30, 2011, 10:34:26 AM
I guess i always figured that coyotes and such would put the hurt on turkeys here on the west side...
From what I've seen coyotes aren't near as hard on turkeys as the over abundance of bald and golden eagles we have here on the rainy side. Most of the young birds every year get picked off while out grazing clover in farm fields. There is always a few that eventually get smart, stay close to the dense cover, and graze in people's yards instead of open fields.
This I think is one of the main reason's turkeys here on the west side are so slow to take off in most areas close to the coast.
The main reason Easterns on the west side are slower taking off, is simply a numbers game. A couple thousand Merriam's and Rio's were either brought in from other states or trapped in state from production and moved starting new flocks in areas that did not have birds, or supplementing areas that did from the mid 80's till around 2002.
On the other hand only about 700-800 Easterns were released from 1987 up to and including 2000. Capitol Forest alone has 90,000 acres let alone the vast expanses of Lewis, Cowlitz, Mason, Grays Harbor, Pacific, Wakiakum and the remainder of Thurston just to mention a few. All things considered, they are doing quite well.
Because of their nature they are hard to get a handle on, as they unlike Merriam's and Rio's spend all their time within the wood line and in close proximity to the edges, and not in the open or semi open like the opther subspecies. Their scientific name...Meleagris gallopavo silvestris, pretty well sums it up, as silvestris means forest.
There are far more Easterns out there than most would believe. :tup:
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on April 30, 2011, 12:04:47 PM
Post by: Wacenturion on April 30, 2011, 01:10:33 PM
Post by: Wacenturion on April 30, 2011, 02:18:41 PM
"So in summary, our Easterns are doing just fine. The expansion of small groups, which by the way is the nature of the subspecies, will continue to add genetic strength overall. If you look in this year's regulations at the Estimated Spring Turkey Harvest, it will illustrate my point. The last releases were made in 2000 I believe. The harvest in area P50 Southwest slowly climbed from 26 in 1996 then up in the 40's and 50's until 2006 when it was 77. The 2009 harvest was 65, the second highest total in the 14 year span, and nine years after the last releases."
Here is the 2010 harvest figures just out.....as you can see, 2010 is now the highest recorded total harvest in 15 years of estimated harvest for P50 Southwest, surpassing 2006 the previous high at 77.
P50 Southwest 89
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on April 30, 2011, 02:32:24 PM
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on April 30, 2011, 02:38:33 PM
I had mentioned earlier in a response to a question on Easterns...........o.k so when we going ...... hahaha seriously !
"So in summary, our Easterns are doing just fine. The expansion of small groups, which by the way is the nature of the subspecies, will continue to add genetic strength overall. If you look in this year's regulations at the Estimated Spring Turkey Harvest, it will illustrate my point. The last releases were made in 2000 I believe. The harvest in area P50 Southwest slowly climbed from 26 in 1996 then up in the 40's and 50's until 2006 when it was 77. The 2009 harvest was 65, the second highest total in the 14 year span, and nine years after the last releases."
Here is the 2010 harvest figures just out.....as you can see, 2010 is now the highest recorded total harvest in 15 years of estimated harvest for P50 Southwest, surpassing 2006 the previous high at 77.
P50 Southwest 89
Post by: Wacenturion on April 30, 2011, 02:39:21 PM
Post by: Turkeyman on April 30, 2011, 05:48:37 PM
Post by: PA BEN on May 01, 2011, 08:41:42 AM
Post by: Wacenturion on May 01, 2011, 08:50:00 AM
If you read the article, it's not about hunting turkeys. It's about protine for the tribe. Sounds like there running out of elk and deer so yard birds might work.
The article did go on to say..............
“Having wild turkeys right here on the reservation also could engage tribal youth who haven’t been exposed to our hunting culture.”
However I agree with you and as I said earlier....it's more about harvesting than hunting. :chuckle:
Post by: PA BEN on May 01, 2011, 09:01:29 AM
Post by: Wacenturion on May 01, 2011, 10:45:49 AM
Was there wild turkeys there back in the Day?
Ben...although there is some fossil evidence of a turkey like bird out west, Wild Turkeys are considered non-native to the state of Washington and several others...i.e Oregon, California, Hawaii to mention a few.
So no...none back in the day as far as the tribe is concerned.
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on May 01, 2011, 06:02:15 PM
I wish I could hunt the colville reservation ... I built a cabin in HELLS GATE area and I mean son more freaken turkey than I have ever seen ... and I built this cabin in May and could not stand listening to them screaming there heads off every morning and I could not go hunting ...... :bash: :bash:Was there wild turkeys there back in the Day?
Ben...although there is some fossil evidence of a turkey like bird out west, Wild Turkeys are considered non-native to the state of Washington and several others...i.e Oregon, California, Hawaii to mention a few.
So no...none back in the day as far as the tribe is concerned.