Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on July 18, 2011, 08:24:25 AM
and just remember a bear shot threw the lungs will always go a long ways !! :twocents: TO CLARIFY ONE THING ( THIS IS MY OPINION ON SHOT PLACEMENT WITH A RIFLE ) :sry:
Post by: runamuk on July 18, 2011, 08:29:47 AM
http://hunting-washington.com/smf/index.php/topic,28214.0.html (http://hunting-washington.com/smf/index.php/topic,28214.0.html)
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on July 18, 2011, 12:25:18 PM
Post by: slim9300 on July 18, 2011, 12:31:17 PM
http://forums.bowsite.com/TF/bgforums/thread.cfm?threadid=356994&forum=5
Post by: Alan K on July 18, 2011, 12:39:01 PM
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on July 18, 2011, 12:41:18 PM
Guys should take this advice on elk too, except they should aim much lower. Too many guys are aiming behind the shoulder because they don't understand the anatomy of an elk. This goes for rifle and bow hunters alike. And before I start an argument, spend some time reading this thread and get back with me. It opened up my eyes quite a bit.yeah thats basically all I am saying .. and you can still hit a bear lower than I have shown and it will still up end him ...After watching a buddy shoot a bear with his 300 mag dead center about 4 inches behind the shoulder and roll for about 50 yrds and take off for another 150 ... after he seen me with my .270 just dumping them like a bad habit he was convinced it all came down to shot placement ....and it does not matter how far I have taken bear because If I hit where I am aiming its party over ....
http://forums.bowsite.com/TF/bgforums/thread.cfm?threadid=356994&forum=5 (http://forums.bowsite.com/TF/bgforums/thread.cfm?threadid=356994&forum=5)
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on July 18, 2011, 12:42:49 PM
I've yet to take a bear myself, but everyone I know who has taken a number of them swear by going right through the shoulder too. Anchors them right there, or at least gets them rolling around there while you can put another one in 'em. They don't bleed very well with their thick coats, so obviously anchoring them right then and there will be my choice when I get the opportunity at one!yeah exactely that .... but I can only recall shooting twice a couple times .. its usually party over ...
Post by: 101521 on July 18, 2011, 01:00:46 PM
Post by: mulehunter on July 18, 2011, 01:07:45 PM
Mulehunter.
Post by: wacnstak on July 18, 2011, 03:30:32 PM
Post by: Machias on July 18, 2011, 03:31:04 PM
Post by: Machias on July 18, 2011, 03:32:16 PM
Great Post Bowhunter 45... I hit a bear solid, through & through, this spring with a Mathews DXT @ 70 #s. We tracked it well into the dark marking each spot of blood and sign as we went. Came back the next morning and searched 'til lunch. Never did get him, that's the only big game animal I've ever hit and lost; felt bad. I've heard about the shoulder shot too and you can bet I'll be making that shot next time!! :(
Sorry but your crazy to make that shot with a bow. :twocents:
Post by: h20hunter on July 18, 2011, 03:52:10 PM
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on July 18, 2011, 03:56:47 PM
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on July 18, 2011, 03:58:33 PM
But then again ..... the way bows shot this day and age I would not be afraid to shot a bear in the shoulders with an arrow as long as it was not one of those pieces of sheet mechanicals ...I have killed my last 4 elk shot dead center threw the shoulders with a 100 gr wasp boss and watched all 4 die right before my eyes ... so maybe I may not regret saying that after all ... I only killed one bear with my bow and it was a head on collision in the chest and ran about 15 to 20 yrd did a death cry an party over ...and I will not say how many I have killed with my .270 but I have definately killed my share ... :twocents: peace :tup:
Post by: Machias on July 18, 2011, 04:02:03 PM
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on July 18, 2011, 04:15:04 PM
Post by: gaddy on July 18, 2011, 04:24:37 PM
Post by: Wazukie on July 18, 2011, 04:35:49 PM
Post by: Machias on July 18, 2011, 05:17:53 PM
I will always go for the boiler room, either with my rifle or my bow. Remember, like you, this is my opinion formed through my experience in the field. Using the right bullet, and load developed, if I hit the boiler room, the bear, elk, deer or anything else, never goes far. Last years bear, shot at 30 yards though the lungs and heart, went about 10 feet and dropped dead and she bled just like a stuck pig. just my opinion and what I do.
That's been my experience as well be it bear, deer or elk.
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on July 18, 2011, 05:28:33 PM
I will always go for the boiler room, either with my rifle or my bow. Remember, like you, this is my opinion formed through my experience in the field. Using the right bullet, and load developed, if I hit the boiler room, the bear, elk, deer or anything else, never goes far. Last years bear, shot at 30 yards though the lungs and heart, went about 10 feet and dropped dead and she bled just like a stuck pig. just my opinion and what I do.
That's been my experience as well be it bear, deer or elk.
[/quote hahaha hey if its working never change it ,,, its all opinion ...I have learned one thing on here I do respect everyones opinion and no need for pi$$ing matches ... one other thing I must say is I NEVER SHOT DEER OR ELK in the shoulders WITH A RIFLE do to all the damage and blood shot meat but with my bow it does not seem to damage meat as bad ....and that arrow whacks them ... :chuckle: :chuckle: your still my buddy Machias!!! :sry:
Post by: jackelope on July 18, 2011, 05:30:18 PM
Post by: Machias on July 18, 2011, 05:41:34 PM
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on July 18, 2011, 05:42:23 PM
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on July 18, 2011, 05:48:50 PM
I too will also always go for the boiler room and do my best to avoid bone with my bow or my rifle. Way way way too much risk with intentionally taking bone shots with a bow. I've got a lot more flexibility with the rifle but still don't like taking chances. If you miss by a little with that shot, the bear runs off wounded. A lot more leeway for an imperfect shot should something go wrong. We all know that's not our intention but something could happen at any time.I hear ya ,,,kinda but you have about a 20 inch circle to hit if you aim dead center shoulder shot either way you are going threw the vitals .... you brake a bear down he goes NO WHERE!!! Now do not get all pi$$y o.k this is 21 bear later and the same story so I have to be right ..."A" BANG watch them roll/ BANG watch them roll :chuckle: :chuckle:
Post by: jackelope on July 18, 2011, 05:57:45 PM
;)
Post by: Kain on July 18, 2011, 06:02:27 PM
I think both methods are effective. You take out the wheels and the bear wont go anywhere but I have never seen an animal hit double lung go very far at all.
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on July 18, 2011, 06:11:11 PM
A good discussion. After looking at all the diagrams provided I am thinking a lot of guys are shooting too far back and thinking they are getting lungs. Looks like those lungs are tucked way up front and a little high. Looks like hitting a bear above the elbow is gonna miss all the bones and be right in the vital sweet spot even though it look like you are shooting the leg. Im glad I read this because I would have aimed behind the leg thinking I was into the lungsThank you kain ...you nailed it on the head ....always shoot forward on a bear ...look how much you have to hit ... you can hit just in front of the shoulder and drop him like a bad habit or hit just behind the shoulder and still make a clean kill ... just lay the crosshairs on his shoulder and squeeze thy trigger .. you will be a bear hit the dirt ..... :tup: and I never said a lung shot is not going to kill it but most likely he is leaving ... it may be a short distance but I want him laying right where he was standing or very close to ...and do not forget I am using .270 flat shootin bear killin machine :chuckle:
I think both methods are effective. You take out the wheels and the bear wont go anywhere but I have never seen an animal hit double lung go very far at all.
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on July 18, 2011, 06:46:06 PM
Oh I'm not getting pissy. You definitely know more than I do.Now......... I am not saying that neither .....I am just stating what works best for me ....... :chuckle: :tup:
;)
Post by: willipa on July 19, 2011, 04:11:21 PM
Post by: huntnnw on July 19, 2011, 11:49:43 PM
Post by: one-eyed Ross on July 20, 2011, 08:46:41 AM
but...
Intentionally shooting an animal intending to break the shoulder as opposed to taking out both lungs just seems....bass ackwards to me...
A through and through of the lungs will cause a bilateral pneumothrorax. That bear CAN NOT run far. It is a physical impossibility. Now, if the bear is shot and does run a long way, the shot couldn't have been as good as the shooter believed...
Anyway...
Back to hibernation.
Post by: Alchase on July 20, 2011, 12:31:29 PM
A through and through of the lungs will cause a bilateral pneumothrorax. That bear CAN NOT run far. It is a physical impossibility. Now, if the bear is shot and does run a long way, the shot couldn't have been as good as the shooter believed...
Anyway...
Back to hibernation.
That is what I was taught as well, and has proved correct over the years.
Post by: runamuk on July 21, 2011, 12:53:21 PM
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on July 21, 2011, 05:48:19 PM
Thanks nice post, I think that both ways work pretty good but for a bear I would prefer a shoulder shot,O.K I about done with this post but anyway you need to realize that this picture shows the bear walking ..RIGHT ...front leg going forward if you shoot dead on the crease of his leg you will blow out both lungs and brake his shoulder ....SWEEEEEEEET !! Now if his shoulders where lined up perfectly across from each other you would break both shoulders maybe his back and blow out both lungs ...A BEARS LUNGS GO FORWARD MORE THAN MOST REALIZE ! And I have killed bear in the thickest crap known to man and just using a little .270 and at longer distances...and not to be a smart butt but I have also watched many bears with both lungs blowed out shot behind the shoulder and run like h$ll ....So the next bear you have a chance to shoot at just place those crosshairs dead center shoulder and squeeze the trigger and let me know the report .... :chuckle: :chuckle: AND PLEASE DO NOT USE A HOLLOW POINT :yike: Of course it will not do sheet to a bears shoulder :twocents: Happy bear hunting and I will be packing a video for sure this year so I can show ya first hand on how I have to roll down the mountains to retrieve bear I shoot :chuckle: :chuckle: :chuckle: :rolleyes:
when you go for a shoulder you are not just brake that bone most likely you are going to brake a spine as well
that's probably why they died instantly, i add few picks witch show what I'm toking about.
Post by: CAMPMEAT on July 21, 2011, 06:00:19 PM
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on July 21, 2011, 06:07:53 PM
What happened to head shots ?:chuckle: :chuckle: yeah they work too ... :chuckle: :tup:
Post by: johnnyaustin44 on July 21, 2011, 08:16:28 PM
Post by: Boss .300 winmag on July 21, 2011, 08:34:59 PM
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on July 21, 2011, 08:40:06 PM
This one was shot from top right shoulder (between shoulder blade and spinal column) to bottom left shoulder. Took out some of both lungs and just plan paralyzed him, shot off course with a .300 winmag. He was below me angling up hill and away from me, didn't know what hit him.nice one .... :tup:
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on July 21, 2011, 08:41:54 PM
The high shoulder seems to work pretty well especially with smaller calibers. The beyond belief movies show grizzlies shot with 6.5x284 140 grain bullets and they drop on the spot at over 500 yards. Elk and deer the sam.e at farther distance with. Same results. It seems like its bear to bear really with some guys swearing by one shot placement and others swearing on another. I say do what you are comfortable shooting forYEAH thats all I shoot anyway 140 GR hornadays .....270 spanks them :yeah:
Post by: Boss .300 winmag on July 21, 2011, 08:42:56 PM
Post by: Boss .300 winmag on July 21, 2011, 08:46:08 PM
PM sent.This one was shot from top right shoulder (between shoulder blade and spinal column) to bottom left shoulder. Took out some of both lungs and just plan paralyzed him, shot off course with a .300 winmag. He was below me angling up hill and away from me, didn't know what hit him.nice one .... :tup:
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on July 21, 2011, 08:55:40 PM
I like those shots best ...angling away from me so the bullet blows out the neck ..or facing me I will shoot just in front of the front shoulder and hopefull hitting the shoulder on the opposite side going out ...PM sent.This one was shot from top right shoulder (between shoulder blade and spinal column) to bottom left shoulder. Took out some of both lungs and just plan paralyzed him, shot off course with a .300 winmag. He was below me angling up hill and away from me, didn't know what hit him.nice one .... :tup:
Post by: 3nails on July 21, 2011, 08:56:10 PM
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on July 21, 2011, 09:05:24 PM
Bowhunter45- Man I am so with you on the shoulder! Being a fellow bushwacker I will ALWAYS wait for them to quarter towards me and pound then through the near shoulder. Pancakes them every time. This lesson I learned the hard way. I'm done tracking wounded bears through mountain alder.....or blackberries! :bdid:yeah buddy !!! :chuckle: :tup:
Post by: demontang on July 22, 2011, 08:10:16 AM
Post by: one-eyed Ross on July 22, 2011, 09:01:54 AM
Post by: johnnyaustin44 on July 22, 2011, 06:57:25 PM
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on July 22, 2011, 07:58:37 PM
Lungs, heart,spine or brain or its gone end of story..chances of breaking both shoulders is almost impossible. I have broke many of bears shoulders to watch keep going..when u hit the lungs or heart its done as with any animalI have to and they have not been easy shots ...200yrds or more threw brush and I have never not seen one not take off hit threw the lungs and heart without braking bone ,,NO DOUBT they will die but not on the spot :sry:
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on July 22, 2011, 08:11:20 PM
Post by: turnloose on July 22, 2011, 10:03:15 PM
Post by: Elk whack master on July 22, 2011, 11:34:50 PM
Post by: Annette on July 22, 2011, 11:49:50 PM
I guess I'm an anomoly then. I have taken 8 bears so far, 5 with a bow and 3 with a rifle. 7 were shot right behind the shoulder, complete pass through on all 7. One was shot between the eyes. Not one bear ran over 60 yards. All 8 were shot within 15 yards. I think the biggest problem, same with elk, is guys are not hitting where they think they are hitting at longer distances. :twocents: If you deflate both lungs they are NOT going to go far, it's just a fact of life.couldn't have said it better...Thanks !
Post by: D-Rock425 on July 23, 2011, 06:44:40 AM
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on July 23, 2011, 10:41:48 AM
I've shot 4 bears in the last 3 years. 3 of the bears were shot right behind the shoulder and they have all gone less then 50 yards. I shoot a 7mm-08 so I try not to shoot them in the shoulder. If I shot a bigger gun I might think more about pining them to the ground but for now I will stick with what I know works.Hey I am loading some 7mm-08 just has we speak ... my boy uses it and it does the same thing :dunno: I am loading 139 GR hornadays BTSP & 139 SST just bought the SST so I will see what the diffence is between the two ..as far as groups go ....
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on July 23, 2011, 10:45:19 AM
hahaha just move over about 3 inches TO THE RIGHT and then give me your report ...( WITH A RILE) :chuckle: :chuckle:I guess I'm an anomoly then. I have taken 8 bears so far, 5 with a bow and 3 with a rifle. 7 were shot right behind the shoulder, complete pass through on all 7. One was shot between the eyes. Not one bear ran over 60 yards. All 8 were shot within 15 yards. I think the biggest problem, same with elk, is guys are not hitting where they think they are hitting at longer distances. :twocents: If you deflate both lungs they are NOT going to go far, it's just a fact of life.couldn't have said it better...Thanks !
Post by: Jellymon on July 23, 2011, 10:49:15 AM
I talk to alot of guys who tell me stories about how they shot bears and tracked them for hundreds of yards with big magnums and I can only shake my head... I have used a .270 forever and never lost a bear and I also hunt areas that are so thick most people would sheet their pants thinking about going in after one ..and most of the shots are over 200yrds...I always shoot for dead center top half of the shoulder and the results are always the same Dead bear .. This is just my opinion and mostly for the guys who never killed a bear and want solid advise ....hope it helps :tup:
and just remember a bear shot threw the lungs will always go a long ways !! :twocents: TO CLARIFY ONE THING ( THIS IS MY OPINION ON SHOT PLACEMENT WITH A RIFLE ) :sry:
Always is kind of a big word for this. Every bear we have shot behind the shoulder has either dropped in its tracks, or went less than 50yds.
Post by: D-Rock425 on July 23, 2011, 10:49:57 AM
Post by: Kain on August 08, 2011, 11:49:00 PM
HUNT MASTERS EPISODE 1 PROMO - BLACK BEAR (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tg6Sdy-VZZI#ws)
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on August 09, 2011, 07:04:42 AM
Takes a brave man to ignore Jim Shockey :chuckle: But it worked out.What does shockey got going on .... now he is the man Period ! He is a moose - bear killin machine .. cant watch your post because I do not have flash player :bash:
HUNT MASTERS EPISODE 1 PROMO - BLACK BEAR (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tg6Sdy-VZZI#ws)
Post by: Kain on August 09, 2011, 08:53:50 AM
Takes a brave man to ignore Jim Shockey :chuckle: But it worked out.What does shockey got going on .... now he is the man Period ! He is a moose - bear killin machine .. cant watch your post because I do not have flash player :bash:
HUNT MASTERS EPISODE 1 PROMO - BLACK BEAR (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tg6Sdy-VZZI#ws)
He tells the hunters not to aim for the shoulder and go for a lung shot because the bear is huge. The hunter ignores him and aims for the shoulder with his muzzleloader. Drops it in its tracks. :chuckle:
Post by: jackmaster on August 09, 2011, 12:16:30 PM
Post by: Bofire on August 09, 2011, 01:53:01 PM
I shoot my 7'2" bear twisted towards me, head to the right but twisted around looking at me, almost turned clear to me, I did not want to hurt the skull so I draw a line thru the bear which is where I think the bullet will travel if not deflected. That bullet went into the right side of his head in the neck, broke the neck thru the lungs and we found it in the rear left foot. almost full length travel thru center mass and a broken spine, 300 WM, 180 grain Winchester Black Talon. About 100 yards down hill from me. Good Penetration.
Carl
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on August 09, 2011, 07:18:19 PM
yeah thats what I am talking about :chuckle: :chuckle: :chuckle: Besides I never said shooting threw the lungs will not kill them but I do not chasing them ...especially where I HUNT ...open country no problem but brush I would rather shoot twice rather than chase them :twocents: In a couple weeks I go kill one :chuckle: Shoulder shot and I will be sure to have video rollin :chuckle:Takes a brave man to ignore Jim Shockey :chuckle: But it worked out.What does shockey got going on .... now he is the man Period ! He is a moose - bear killin machine .. cant watch your post because I do not have flash player :bash:
HUNT MASTERS EPISODE 1 PROMO - BLACK BEAR (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tg6Sdy-VZZI#ws)
He tells the hunters not to aim for the shoulder and go for a lung shot because the bear is huge. The hunter ignores him and aims for the shoulder with his muzzleloader. Drops it in its tracks. :chuckle:
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on August 09, 2011, 07:21:19 PM
i aint trying to ruffle any feathers here but, to me the fail safe shot is the slight quarter away about 4 ribs back through the boiler room and explode the opposite shoulder from the inside, i learned it from my dad who has never used more than one bullet per critter and he is 60, and since i took his advise when i was 16 or so, when i could controll my adrenaline a little better i to have not had to hit an animal more than once, that includes bear , elk and deer but of course that is just my :twocents: worth...no I agree any shot going forward is going to up end them .. :tup: No doubt about that ....The only animal I shoot in the shoulder is bear .... I do not like wasting meat on deer and elk .... :tup:
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on August 09, 2011, 07:25:04 PM
:)I shoot alittle lower than bowhunter shows but about the same, IF I ever see on broadside!! :chuckle:I did mark that shot a little high but you will spine him ...I do shoot a little lower too... But you need to realize a bears lungs are further forward than ya think ...and I like breaking bones on bear :chuckle:
I shoot my 7'2" bear twisted towards me, head to the right but twisted around looking at me, almost turned clear to me, I did not want to hurt the skull so I draw a line thru the bear which is where I think the bullet will travel if not deflected. That bullet went into the right side of his head in the neck, broke the neck thru the lungs and we found it in the rear left foot. almost full length travel thru center mass and a broken spine, 300 WM, 180 grain Winchester Black Talon. About 100 yards down hill from me. Good Penetration.
Carl