Hunting Washington Forum

Big Game Hunting => Deer Hunting => Topic started by: poulsbo on July 21, 2008, 06:14:46 PM

Title: min pts to draw desert A or the swakane unit?
Post by: poulsbo on July 21, 2008, 06:14:46 PM: what do you guys think it takes for min. pts to draw swakane or the desrt A tag i missed with 9 pts this year. :bash:
Title: Re: min pts to draw desert A or the swakane unit?
Post by: 3boys on July 21, 2008, 06:22:00 PM: You may never get drawn. I drew the desert unit several years ago with no pts. I now have several again with no luck. Now you can max out and some lucky duck will get drawn with 1 pt.
Title: Re: min pts to draw desert A or the swakane unit?
Post by: poulsbo on July 21, 2008, 06:30:32 PM: thanks for the words of encouragement... you could have lied and told me i was due next year for sure...lol ,did you shoot a large buck?
Title: Re: min pts to draw desert A or the swakane unit?
Post by: Rocky Mtn Fever on July 21, 2008, 07:07:07 PM: doesnt Washington square your points ie, if you have 7 points they are suppose to put your name in 49 times...the few guys i've talked to who drew the late mule deer hunts had 10+ points or over 100 chances to get the tag....i guess i got 4 more years to wait...i drew the Coweeman B hunt w/ 8 points..kinda a waste of 8 points but its an easy nearly given cow hunt and it give me time to hunt in Montana....
Title: Re: min pts to draw desert A or the swakane unit?
Post by: Antlershed on July 21, 2008, 07:08:36 PM: Yes, Washington squares your points. I don't know how many it takes, cause I haven't drawn it yet... :chuckle:
Title: Re: min pts to draw desert A or the swakane unit?
Post by: rackattack on July 21, 2008, 07:17:21 PM: I'd be willing to bet that most of those tags go to people without max points. :bash: That's one reason Washington draws suck, but on the other side if you just drew and are starting over there's always a shot to hit the jackpot again.
Title: Re: min pts to draw desert A or the swakane unit?
Post by: andrew_12gauge on July 21, 2008, 07:21:56 PM: i drew the desert a with only 2 points 4 years ago, at the time my dad had 9 now he has 13 and still hasnt drawn even with a lotta points you still have to get lucky, but i think my dad is happy with his sheep tag this year.
Title: Re: min pts to draw desert A or the swakane unit?
Post by: Wea300mag on July 21, 2008, 07:27:20 PM: I talked to a hunter last year in the desert unit during the permit season who had drawn for the second time in five years. The good news is he did not want to walk too much and was happy with a standard 20" buck.
Title: Re: min pts to draw desert A or the swakane unit?
Post by: Bigshooter on July 21, 2008, 07:43:13 PM: I had a friend last year draw the entiat with 2 points. I have 7 and still have not drawn.
Title: Re: min pts to draw desert A or the swakane unit?
Post by: 257 Wby Mag on July 21, 2008, 07:45:58 PM: If the stars are lined up right, 1...
Title: Re: min pts to draw desert A or the swakane unit?
Post by: Jackjr on July 21, 2008, 08:23:47 PM: I would guess somewhere between 1 and 12 points . unless the point system has been around longer???
Title: Re: min pts to draw desert A or the swakane unit?
Post by: kirkl on July 21, 2008, 08:49:26 PM: i have 12 deer points and desert is always my first choice. I also put down 4 gmu's for choices.
Title: Re: min pts to draw desert A or the swakane unit?
Post by: KDume on July 22, 2008, 09:09:58 AM: I'm not to sure about those units. I got lucky and got Entiat archery with 0 pt's. Got drawn last year and saw alot of buck's. they were either to small or to far. Took a big doe without a fawn for good table fare!
Title: Re: min pts to draw desert A or the swakane unit?
Post by: Ridgerunner on July 22, 2008, 09:31:44 AM: Too many variables, the guys with the most points will pull most of the tags but there will always be someone with very few who gets very lucky. It helps your draw odds if you put 4 choices down, but don't put down any units you don't want to hunt. I've drawn 3 what I would consider premium tags, but never drawn higher than my 3rd choice. Had I only put one or two choices down its possible I wouldn;'t have ever drawn anything.
Title: Re: min pts to draw desert A or the swakane unit?
Post by: BlackTail on July 22, 2008, 09:36:49 AM: "I drew the desert unit several years ago with no pts." - 3boys

"I got lucky and got Entiat archery with 0 pt's." - KDume

I might be wrong, but don't you get 1 point the first time you put in for these draws? You couldn't draw these tags with zero points (assuming WDFW doesn't royally screw something up, which is a big assumption).
Title: Re: min pts to draw desert A or the swakane unit?
Post by: muleracks on July 22, 2008, 09:46:01 AM: One comment and one questions:

1. Congratulations to KDume for harvesting the correct animal for his venison. Going home with a young buck is not going to impress anyone plus the dry doe is better eating. Let the 2 and 3 year old bucks grow up and take home the doe.

2. Have all of you guys responded to the wdfw survey? What do you think of the idea of setting aside some permits for the "unlucky nimrods" who maxed out points and still can't get a permit? I voted to set aside 25% of the permits for those guys.
Title: Re: min pts to draw desert A or the swakane unit?
Post by: kirkl on July 22, 2008, 10:02:01 AM: In most of those gmu's they only give anywhere from 5-25 tags so 25% isnt really helping. That would be 3 tags for the desert unit for the hundreds of guys who are maxed out.
Title: Re: min pts to draw desert A or the swakane unit?
Post by: WDFW-SUX on July 22, 2008, 10:03:21 AM: BAD IDEA.
Title: Re: min pts to draw desert A or the swakane unit?
Post by: Ellensburg on July 22, 2008, 12:01:19 PM: Quote from: Antlershed on July 21, 2008, 07:08:36 PM
Yes, Washington squares your points. I don't know how many it takes, cause I haven't drawn it yet... :chuckle:

squares your points?
Title: Re: min pts to draw desert A or the swakane unit?
Post by: kirkl on July 22, 2008, 01:07:06 PM: yes they square your points, if you have 2 points then its 2x2 and it give you 4 chances. 3 points, 3x3=9 chances. etc.
Title: Re: min pts to draw desert A or the swakane unit?
Post by: Ellensburg on July 22, 2008, 05:49:49 PM: wow that makes a lot of since. Is there any link that tells exactly how it works? cuz I thought I had it figured out but i didn't know about the squaring part.
Title: Re: min pts to draw desert A or the swakane unit?
Post by: Curly on July 22, 2008, 05:56:28 PM: Quote from: Ellensburg on July 22, 2008, 05:49:49 PM
wow that makes a lot of since. Is there any link that tells exactly how it works? cuz I thought I had it figured out but i didn't know about the squaring part.

http://hunting-washington.com/smf/index.php/topic,5534.0.html
Title: Re: min pts to draw desert A or the swakane unit?
Post by: SkookumHntr on July 22, 2008, 06:08:38 PM: ---At least 25% as far as I'm concerned. I would like to see a guy who has put in for 15+ years to disagree!
Title: Re: min pts to draw desert A or the swakane unit?
Post by: Curly on July 22, 2008, 06:28:52 PM: Quote from: muleracks on July 22, 2008, 09:46:01 AM
What do you think of the idea of setting aside some permits for the "unlucky nimrods" who maxed out points and still can't get a permit? I voted to set aside 25% of the permits for those guys.

I don't like the idea of setting aside permits. If they had it that way from the beginning, then I'd be okay with it. But those people that keep trying to draw Desert or Entiat or some of the other really popular unit have chosen to gamble and keep putting in for the almost impossible to draw units. I almost always put in for Desert as #1 choice but then I'll put some easier to draw units down as 2, 3 and 4. I'll probably never get drawn for Desert, but I still have a chance.......and I'm okay with losing my points every few years to draw some other unit that is not as popular. Hell, I'm okay with all those guys continually applying for only the premium hunts and leaving some of the less popular ones for me to draw. ;)
Title: Re: min pts to draw desert A or the swakane unit?
Post by: SkookumHntr on July 22, 2008, 06:53:41 PM: ---Well sure the guys who don't have many or any points don't like it. Like I said I want to see somebody who has been putting in for 13 years and longer have a problem with a % of permits to them say they don't like it. If you blew your points on a lesser tag, well tuff $hit. At least you would know that the 25% pool applicants earned there tag!
Title: Re: min pts to draw desert A or the swakane unit?
Post by: poulsbo on July 22, 2008, 08:49:07 PM: whitetail hunted idaho last year with my buddies uncle hhe wasted two quilomene muley tags to hunt whitetail i told him he was nuts for doing so and it was a waste to draw them. you can hunt whitetail any year! he draws grat tags with min. pts it drives me insane. just lucky i guess
Title: Re: min pts to draw desert A or the swakane unit?
Post by: Curly on July 23, 2008, 06:31:19 AM: Quote from: SkookumHntr on July 22, 2008, 06:53:41 PM
---Well sure the guys who don't have many or any points don't like it. Like I said I want to see somebody who has been putting in for 13 years and longer have a problem with a % of permits to them say they don't like it. If you blew your points on a lesser tag, well tuff $hit. At least you would know that the 25% pool applicants earned there tag!

---Well sure the guys that have max points will like the idea..........it will help their odds. You won't find any of them that won't like that idea. I say tuff $hit to them; why change the rules to accomodate them? Its their choice to keep gambling on drawing the premium tag, and by looking at the odds, they should have figured that they may never draw.
Title: Re: min pts to draw desert A or the swakane unit?
Post by: kirkl on July 23, 2008, 07:47:41 AM: I have 12 points and could care less about the 25% since theres a ton of guys out there with max points.
Title: Re: min pts to draw desert A or the swakane unit?
Post by: WDFW-SUX on July 23, 2008, 08:17:43 AM: If you started in the very first year of Washingtons point system a "max" pool draw might help you one time in your life and decrease your odds of ever drawing a tag again. If you are 1 point behind you will never be in the max pool. If your goal is to hunt a late muley hunt one time and you have 14 points this year its a good idea.... If you want to hunt a late hunt more than once over 50 years it a terrible idea.

Older hunters are the one who benefit from max pools everyone else suffers.

Given how poor the odds are for washington's good late muley hunts are I don't understand why anyone would want to make them worse for themselves and everone else. :twocents:
Title: Re: min pts to draw desert A or the swakane unit?
Post by: Skyvalhunter on July 23, 2008, 08:21:57 AM: Tell that to some of the other states that do it.
Title: Re: min pts to draw desert A or the swakane unit?
Post by: WDFW-SUX on July 23, 2008, 08:25:56 AM: The reason other states were tricked into it is because there are a ton of baby boomers that were nearing the end of there time hunting and felt like they needed a added advantage in the draws. It screwed everone else. The backlog of applicants will never in the next 50 years get to folks who started applying more that 5 years after the beggining of the point system. The math does not lie.

:tdown:
Title: Re: min pts to draw desert A or the swakane unit?
Post by: Slider on July 23, 2008, 08:40:57 AM: Passions right!!! The only one's to benifit would be Max Point holders. You would simply be slitting your own throat!!!
Title: Re: min pts to draw desert A or the swakane unit?
Post by: wastickslinger on July 23, 2008, 09:06:45 AM: But dont the max point guys deserve the OIL tags???
Title: Re: min pts to draw desert A or the swakane unit?
Post by: Dry creek on July 23, 2008, 09:27:30 AM: i like the idea of two animals to draw for deer&elk - elk&moose - sheep&moose ext. it wood improve your odds greatly!!!
Title: Re: min pts to draw desert A or the swakane unit?
Post by: WDFW-SUX on July 23, 2008, 09:28:33 AM: My vote is for Deer or elk and 1/3 for sheep, goat, moose.
Title: Re: min pts to draw desert A or the swakane unit?
Post by: Skyvalhunter on July 23, 2008, 09:45:55 AM: Well I think a better way to improve the odds is to limit the number of big game permits to non residents to say like 10%. Same as other some other states do. You know as well as I do that there are non residents out there putting in for special permits and this is driving up the odds. That and given the fact that you don't have to buy a license to apply for sheep, goat, and moose unless drawn.
Title: Re: min pts to draw desert A or the swakane unit?
Post by: Dry creek on July 23, 2008, 10:09:59 AM: the app fee for non-res is 55$ per animal i don't think it will change your odds.
Title: Re: min pts to draw desert A or the swakane unit?
Post by: Skyvalhunter on July 23, 2008, 10:21:53 AM: Think again it's just like Az($125) where you have to buy a lisc to put in and get a preference point. If you don't think Non residents are putting out $55 for a chance to draw to a moose, sheep or goat you are mistakened.
Title: Re: min pts to draw desert A or the swakane unit?
Post by: WDFW-SUX on July 23, 2008, 10:38:46 AM: Quote from: Dry creek on July 23, 2008, 10:09:59 AM
the app fee for non-res is 55$ per animal i don't think it will change your odds.

Trust me on this when I say that there are people who spend thousands of dollars per year on applications and licences and $165 bucks doesn't even make them flinch. I agree that we need to strictly limit the number of tags that go to non residents. I would say one tag for moose and sheep and no tags for goat is about right.
Title: Re: min pts to draw desert A or the swakane unit?
Post by: Skyvalhunter on July 23, 2008, 10:41:55 AM: I second that motion!!
Title: Re: min pts to draw desert A or the swakane unit?
Post by: Curly on July 23, 2008, 11:02:24 AM: Everyone has to purchase a tag first for deer or elk, and for non-residents at $395 each, in addition to the $55 app fee; that should limit the non-res applicants for deer and elk. But Moose, sheep, and goat they only have to spend the $55 app fee, and don't have to purchase the tag unless they draw. So, I could see where a lot of non-res are probably applying for moose, sheep, and goat.......
Title: Re: min pts to draw desert A or the swakane unit?
Post by: Dry creek on July 23, 2008, 01:20:11 PM: i disagree i apply in Oregon, Montana and Wyoming and eventual i am granted to get drawn or my odds. in Montana for moose,goat and sheep my odds will go up in time 20% draw odds, in washington i don't care if you have max 1% till you die
Title: Re: min pts to draw desert A or the swakane unit?
Post by: andrew_12gauge on July 24, 2008, 05:37:50 PM: a max point system on deer and elk permits may work not with sheep, goat and moose it would never work there are probably 10000 guys out there with "max" points for the OIL tags and there really is no max with bonus points for turning in poachers and such. the states that have a max point system are states with a preference point system where only those with points can draw and at a certain point you are guaranteed usually you can know to the exact year when you will draw. so no i dont wanna set aside permits for those with max points especially since no matter what there will never be a max number of points one can have. some of us may die with 50 points for sheep goat and moose and thats just the way its gonna be
Title: Re: min pts to draw desert A or the swakane unit?
Post by: Ironhead on July 25, 2008, 02:29:32 PM: True story Skyvalley, not only should we limit the NR's to up to 10%, but make them buy a non refundable 150.00 dollar liscence and then charge them another 20.00 per application for and another 15.00 per animal for bonus pts.
Title: Re: min pts to draw desert A or the swakane unit?
Post by: bobcat on July 25, 2008, 03:50:31 PM: Quote from: poulsbo on July 21, 2008, 06:14:46 PM
what do you guys think it takes for min. pts to draw swakane or the desrt A tag i missed with 9 pts this year. :bash:

Back to the original question...the answer is: 1
Title: Re: min pts to draw desert A or the swakane unit?
Post by: popeshawnpaul on July 25, 2008, 03:52:17 PM: Ironhead, I agree and brought this up to the guy that ran the draws a few years ago. He stated that non-residents aren't an issue because they never get more than 10% of the tags anyways. I'm not sure if this is true but I bet it isn't with OIL tags...
Title: Re: min pts to draw desert A or the swakane unit?
Post by: WDFW-SUX on July 25, 2008, 03:55:45 PM: 50 bucks and a chance at a sheep tag that has no non resident cap or advantage given to residents.............I bet there are 1,000's of NR in that draw.
Title: Re: min pts to draw desert A or the swakane unit?
Post by: bobcat on July 25, 2008, 03:56:13 PM: Quote from: popeshawnpaul on July 25, 2008, 03:52:17 PM
Ironhead, I agree and brought this up to the guy that ran the draws a few years ago. He stated that non-residents aren't an issue because they never get more than 10% of the tags anyways. I'm not sure if this is true but I bet it isn't with OIL tags...

I find that believable but I still think non-residents should have to pay more to apply for moose, sheep, and goat.
Title: Re: min pts to draw desert A or the swakane unit?
Post by: WDFW Hates ME!!! on July 27, 2008, 03:51:43 PM: Look at some of these states with max point draws. Colorado, max points for unit 1,2,10 & 210 were in the 12 point range, not in the 18 point range, if you were not in it from inception you will never draw. Yeah vote that in and we all lose.
Title: Re: min pts to draw desert A or the swakane unit?
Post by: chukarchaser on July 28, 2008, 10:02:41 PM: I have 13 for sheep and either 12 or 13 for elk. I support no part of making someone decide on which OIL tag to apply for or whether it is deer or elk to put in for :bdid:. In order to have a dream come true you have to have a dream. So let everyone apply, it will work out in the end.