Post by: WAmuleyHunter on March 13, 2012, 03:54:34 PM
http://nwsportsmanmag.com/2012/03/13/entiat-poachers-get-big-fines-lose-hunting-privileges/
Post by: chukar hunter on March 13, 2012, 04:05:02 PM
Just wish it was me who turned them in and got those poacher points! Would that be 20? Or only 10 for the shooter?
Post by: Pathfinder101 on March 13, 2012, 04:18:32 PM
Post by: HUNTINCOUPLE on March 13, 2012, 04:30:35 PM
Post by: Woodchuck on March 13, 2012, 04:31:51 PM
Post by: C-Money on March 13, 2012, 04:38:47 PM
Post by: MIKEXRAY on March 13, 2012, 04:57:44 PM
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on March 13, 2012, 05:01:54 PM
Post by: Capt Morgan on March 13, 2012, 06:40:30 PM
Post by: BOWHUNTER45 on March 13, 2012, 06:57:52 PM
Post by: adamR on March 13, 2012, 07:01:53 PM
I think it would be nice if they pull all future special permits for these meatheads.
I agree it would be nice to see their rights to permits be taken away for good!!
I am glad, however, to see them get punished though.
Post by: throttlejocky20 on March 13, 2012, 08:07:36 PM
Post by: deerslyr on March 13, 2012, 11:22:44 PM
HOLY SHEET BATMAN ....6000 BUCKS :o A guy best think about it before pulling something like that ...Especially in Wa. That deer looks like in was in combat your something ...his EYES ARE SUNK in like it was dead for a month :dunno: :yike:
If you look at it in the grand scheme of things thats not any more than a guided hunt in a different state and can expect the same size of buck. You lose your hunting rights for 2 years and get a day of community service big whoop. Make poaching a felony and ull see a drop in poaching cases.
Post by: washelkhunter on March 14, 2012, 12:30:16 AM
Post by: Deep Forks on March 14, 2012, 04:56:13 AM
Post by: dreamingbig on March 14, 2012, 06:35:54 AM
Post by: ldjbuff on March 14, 2012, 06:36:42 AM
Post by: JCKILLSHOT on March 14, 2012, 08:49:25 AM
Post by: Dhoey07 on March 14, 2012, 09:31:17 AM
Post by: pendoreilleadventures on March 14, 2012, 09:53:03 AM
Post by: 180-GRAIN on March 14, 2012, 09:58:53 AM
Post by: deerslyr on March 14, 2012, 10:05:50 AM
I am curious and I don't know the answer. Can they apply and hunt other states during the next two years or is the ban only for Washington St?
No I think there are like 40 states or so that if you lose them in one state you lose them in the rest.
Post by: BULLBLASTER on March 14, 2012, 10:06:44 AM
HOLY SHEET BATMAN ....6000 BUCKS :o A guy best think about it before pulling something like that ...Especially in Wa. That deer looks like in was in combat your something ...his EYES ARE SUNK in like it was dead for a month :dunno: :yike:
If you look at it in the grand scheme of things thats not any more than a guided hunt in a different state and can expect the same size of buck. You lose your hunting rights for 2 years and get a day of community service big whoop. Make poaching a felony and ull see a drop in poaching cases.
Post by: huntnfmly on March 14, 2012, 10:09:21 AM
I am curious and I don't know the answer. Can they apply and hunt other states during the next two years or is the ban only for Washington St?I believe we are part of a compact wich means he cannot hunt in any of the states in that compact
Post by: pianoman9701 on March 14, 2012, 10:11:57 AM
Post by: huntnfmly on March 14, 2012, 10:16:28 AM
Nothing more to the story he's a poacher. I don't care if he put in for 20yrs. He didn't have tag for that area
Post by: NoBark on March 14, 2012, 10:38:51 AM
That was a cool buck! glad they got caught I just don't think the penalty was steep enough! I n my opinion they should have lost hunting privileges for life.
Well, I hope you never make a mistake reading the regs or out in the field. That would kill me to not be able to hunt for life. In fact, might turn me into a cronic poacher I guess.
I like the 3 strike idea, 2nd conviction 5 years and 3rd time, life. Maybe I'm getting soft in my old age.
Post by: Pathfinder101 on March 14, 2012, 04:11:32 PM
Unless there is more to this story that i'm not gettting but this guy shooting this buck doesn't make me mad at all. The guy got a great tag, meaning that he has been putting in for tags and buying licenses for 6+ years or so. He's not out shooting 10 deer a year (that i know of). He's not out dropping does that are carrying fawns, he's not out shooting deer in February or august. Just seems like small pototoes to me :dunno:Well, I don't really know the specifics of this case, so I am just spitballin' here, but I think under these circumstances, this was probably planned. The guy had a late season tag for another unit, figured that he could draw the Chiwawa a lot easier than the Entiat tag. Planned out the hunt (and probably his escape route), popped that buck, called in his backup, loaded it in the truck and zoomed over to the legal unit to gut it (game warden will always ask where the gut pile is). It's actually amazing that he got caught. Good police work.
I guess there's a chance that the guy just crossed over on the wrong side of his unit and shot a deer just out of bounds, but if it were an honest mistake he probably would have had it gutted before he realized his error. Looks planned to me... :dunno:
Post by: vandeman17 on March 14, 2012, 04:16:20 PM
Post by: bowtech721 on March 14, 2012, 04:25:45 PM
Unless there is more to this story that i'm not gettting but this guy shooting this buck doesn't make me mad at all. The guy got a great tag, meaning that he has been putting in for tags and buying licenses for 6+ years or so. He's not out shooting 10 deer a year (that i know of). He's not out dropping does that are carrying fawns, he's not out shooting deer in February or august. Just seems like small pototoes to me :dunno:Well, I don't really know the specifics of this case, so I am just spitballin' here, but I think under these circumstances, this was probably planned. The guy had a late season tag for another unit, figured that he could draw the Chiwawa a lot easier than the Entiat tag. Planned out the hunt (and probably his escape route), popped that buck, called in his backup, loaded it in the truck and zoomed over to the legal unit to gut it (game warden will always ask where the gut pile is). It's actually amazing that he got caught. Good police work.
I guess there's a chance that the guy just crossed over on the wrong side of his unit and shot a deer just out of bounds, but if it were an honest mistake he probably would have had it gutted before he realized his error. Looks planned to me... :dunno:
The guy new what he was doing there was no error... I hunted the entiat legally just after this and everybody i talked to said he was a local. plus its not like the border between the chiwawa and entiat isnt pretty friggin clear. Also the fact that it was hauled out into to chiwawa to be gutted shows that it was no accident. Glad they got him
Post by: kyle78 on March 14, 2012, 05:57:25 PM
http://nwsportsmanmag.com/2012/01/24/entiat-man-who-wdfw-says-poached-trophy-buc-due-in-court-today/
Post by: jeepguy on March 14, 2012, 09:32:02 PM
Post by: deerslyr on March 14, 2012, 09:46:13 PM
GUILTY, hang him high. any big game poaching incident should result in loss of privaleges life time with heavy $$$$$ fines.these types of acts should rank right up with feloneys.
IMO its just like robbery. Its stealing resources from the public and involves a weapon.
Post by: natural born killer on March 14, 2012, 10:31:09 PM
Post by: HairTrigger on March 14, 2012, 10:36:00 PM
Should be what his punishment is, also I've heard the poacher can never have any trophies in any record books is this correct??
Post by: huntnnw on March 14, 2012, 11:56:26 PM
Post by: HairTrigger on March 15, 2012, 12:07:16 AM
I can be just as ignorant or concerned there lil minded buddy,
an yeah it coulda been one I harvested legally :tup:
Post by: huntnnw on March 15, 2012, 12:35:58 AM
Post by: Pathfinder101 on March 15, 2012, 10:57:58 AM
Here is the original story that I posted awhile ago. I hope this helps catch people up.
http://nwsportsmanmag.com/2012/01/24/entiat-man-who-wdfw-says-poached-trophy-buc-due-in-court-today/
Okay, so it sounds like the buck wandered into the orchard behind his house, was bigger than the ones he had been seeing in his legal unit, so he popped it. Not quite as premeditated as I thought, but still, he knew exactly what he was doing when he poached that buck.
Post by: PlateauNDN on March 15, 2012, 11:31:41 AM
1 OR 20? I will have this attitude till they can assimilate like everyone else in this country...there will always be racism or dislike towards any group till all are the same!
Then I guess you're going to have that attitude until you pass on. Why should we have to assimilate to another culture when we weren't the immigrants of this Country? Maybe little ol' Tibet should just give up and assimilate to China since they were taken over? :dunno: Maybe the Chinese should've assimilated to the Japanese during WWII? Or most of Europe for that matter should have assimilated to Nazi Germany and give up because they were being forcibly taken over?
Are you seeing a pattern here? I love this Country and will never stand for its disrespect by foreigners. With that said my Tribe never gave up or agreed to assimilate to the newly formed America. We agreed to peace and to keep our sovereignty and continue our culture unaltered. I served my Country and my People and will do so again if she ever called. Whether or not this is the 21st century and not the 1800's makes no difference. I've said it before and I'll say it again we didn't land here or get brought here we were already here.
The US Government agreed to let us be who we are without assimilation and that's how it's going to be for a very long time. Just in case you doubt that, it's written in our Treaty minutes as Gov. Stevens saying by order from his superiors.
If you think that's racist for being who I am and who we are since before Columbus then that's your opinion.
It might be legal for us to do so, (overharvest multiple big game) but that doesn't mean its ethical and as I've said before I don't condone that type of actions and irresponsibilities.
Post by: deleted BGS on March 15, 2012, 11:44:47 AM
I also like the 3 strike idea
Post by: PlateauNDN on March 15, 2012, 11:47:21 AM
Post by: Pathfinder101 on March 15, 2012, 01:19:56 PM
To get back on track I think maybe a little more time but as long as the person and anybody affiliated with him understand that there are eyes in the woods and the possibility of getting caught is always there when you break the law then it seems the punishment fits the crime.
:yeah:
Post by: Co on March 19, 2012, 10:30:32 PM
Post by: Bigtine96 on March 19, 2012, 10:34:42 PM
Post by: Wenatcheejay on March 19, 2012, 10:43:58 PM
countless bucks being killed there by indians is okay :tup:
OK? Nope, encouraged.
They deserve 50% of all resources they can show they might have ever used in a usual way in this State.
Post by: DIYARCHERYJUNKIE on March 20, 2012, 05:51:13 AM
Post by: Skyvalhunter on March 20, 2012, 05:52:46 AM
Post by: Pathfinder101 on March 20, 2012, 09:51:30 AM
I get a kick how that buck is considered a trophy buck.... (and anything with one point more then 3 on one side) most required areas on mule deer is 3 point min. give it one more point then the minimum and , skip an ok buck, a big buck, and whopper to trophy...... LAME ... should just slap anyone with the same dam fine make it 10 grand I dont care... sounds so stupid.
I think they just decided that they had to draw the line somewhere. Most mature mule deer have 4 points. On the other hand WDFW could write a 4 page description of what a "trophy buck" is; Mass, Spread, Height, Points, etc...
Post by: pianoman9701 on March 20, 2012, 10:04:48 AM
Post by: lilredhead on March 20, 2012, 11:22:54 AM
Post by: Skyvalhunter on March 20, 2012, 11:43:03 AM
Post by: DIYARCHERYJUNKIE on March 20, 2012, 12:32:36 PM
Post by: lilredhead on March 20, 2012, 01:17:58 PM
Post by: Mike450r on March 20, 2012, 01:45:20 PM
This guy stole a mule deer, a mule deer is worth a hell of a lot more than $250.00 to me. I vote for felony charges on that all day long.
Post by: DIYARCHERYJUNKIE on March 20, 2012, 02:04:22 PM
Post by: PlateauNDN on March 20, 2012, 02:20:24 PM
Thank you mike. Big brother would rather keep the laws leanient and have poachers kill off any chance you stand at self reliance and sustainability. If we don't vote for stricter laws for poaching big brother never will. There is no argument for theses crimes not being felonys. NONE. I have been skunked four years in a row archery hunting. I see deer in my back yard every day and I have never considered shooting. That's not hunting that's poaching. Fair chase is the only way to hunt. How could he even of been proud to show off a buck he shot in his yard in a closed gnu? I'd be ashamed of that mount. A lot of fair chase hunters spend thousands of dollars and travel long distances and prepare for each season scouting learning the lay of the land preparing mentally and physically to do what they love on opening morning even putting in to the drawings for twns of years just to have some dummie pull up in his truck with a different areas special permit in his pocket and shoot your bull or buck that you've worked so hard for makes me sick to see him skate like that.
I feel the same way except from a different side of the coin. :bash:
Post by: 6x6in6 on March 20, 2012, 02:26:15 PM
In fact, I think that the fines are too light and the potential for license reinstatement are too light. I could really care less about the jail time though. Why pay for free food along with room and board? Give them a ton of community service hours to be done on State and Federal Land only. Make it financially painful and take away their legal right to obtain a license.
Post by: PlateauNDN on March 20, 2012, 02:37:14 PM
Thank you mike. Big brother would rather keep the laws leanient and have poachers kill off any chance you stand at self reliance and sustainability. If we don't vote for stricter laws for poaching big brother never will. There is no argument for theses crimes not being felonys. NONE. I have been skunked four years in a row archery hunting. I see deer in my back yard every day and I have never considered shooting. That's not hunting that's poaching. Fair chase is the only way to hunt. How could he even of been proud to show off a buck he shot in his yard in a closed gnu? I'd be ashamed of that mount. A lot of fair chase hunters spend thousands of dollars and travel long distances and prepare for each season scouting learning the lay of the land preparing mentally and physically to do what they love on opening morning even putting in to the drawings for twns of years just to have some dummie pull up in his truck with a different areas special permit in his pocket and shoot your bull or buck that you've worked so hard for makes me sick to see him skate like that.
I feel the same way except from a different side of the coin. :bash:
Sorry, I just read this again and maybe I should've made it a little more clearer. I feel the same way when I put in the time and effort to scout and look for the game prior to fall and low and behold somebody goes and waits until the game are starving and fighting for survival on their winter range and wacks some big bulls/bucks and feels like they did something. That's not hunting and that's for damn sure not sustinence hunting if the target was the male species because he was just standing there conserving energy for the winter. Or driving to a location that is easily accessible by roads and wacking 8 or 9 big bulls and claiming they're for sustenance when you could've just shot some cows that are becoming overpopulated in that particular area. Or how about slaughtering a big bull that is pretty much a farm raised tame cattle bull and then parading him around and entering contests like you accomplished something. I hunt for sustenance and to provide food for my family, not to take as many big bulls/bucks that I can pile in my truck. If I hunt other than fall time it's usually for a funeral and that's not very often I will utilize the permit and harvest a cow. Why get a male? Let him have a chance to pass on his genes a couple of times and harvest him when he's at his peak strength on his terms, that's hunting!
Post by: HUNTINCOUPLE on March 20, 2012, 03:22:59 PM
Post by: WSU on March 20, 2012, 03:44:58 PM
I think the idea of going with heavy fines and forfeitures makes more sense than raising taxes to put people like this in jail. $6,000 sounds steep enough to me to make him think twice about shooting a deer in an adjacent unit.
Post by: bobcat on March 20, 2012, 03:57:16 PM
So basically $13,000 and the loss of hunting privileges for two years. Seems like plenty to me.
And I definitely don't agree it should be a felony. If he were a repeat offender, then yes, I could see a felony being appropriate. But in this case no way.
There are people who go out and kill several deer in one night, both does and bucks, and leave them lay. No hunting license, it's not hunting season, they just kill for the fun of it. They shoot every living thing they see. This type of crime gets less of a fine than this guy who killed a 4 point mule deer on the wrong side of a GMU boundary.
For the people who kill multiple deer in one night, and leave all the meat to rot, they're the ones that need to be charged with a felony and put in prison. That's the type of person that could end up being a serial killer or a mass murderer, IMO.
Post by: buckfvr on March 20, 2012, 04:14:23 PM
Post by: DIYARCHERYJUNKIE on March 20, 2012, 04:49:16 PM
Post by: biggdogg on March 20, 2012, 08:01:44 PM
Post by: biggdogg on March 20, 2012, 08:06:37 PM
Post by: bobcat on March 20, 2012, 08:08:02 PM
I have one question about the true spike rule I heard a few stories on here about people making mistakes and shooting not true spikes, and not getting in trouble??? Poaching is poaching to me should be stiffer penalties whether it be accidental or not. Just like I think the Yakamas need to put the smack down on a hand full of tribal members :twocents:
What I heard is that they are still "getting in trouble" but the fine is only $80.
Post by: biggdogg on March 20, 2012, 08:13:28 PM
Post by: huntergreg on March 20, 2012, 08:20:08 PM
80 $ that is it, I wounder how many people take the risk and get away with it, or shoot and get scared and not haul it out. So poaching a trophy buck is a fine of 6500 $, and poaching an illegal elk is 80$. I have heard lots of times that any animal is a trophy so fine should straight across the board 6500 $ for any animal poached. I don't care if the hunter did the right thing, need to start making an example out of these people!!!!!!!!
I have one question about the true spike rule I heard a few stories on here about people making mistakes and shooting not true spikes, and not getting in trouble??? Poaching is poaching to me should be stiffer penalties whether it be accidental or not. Just like I think the Yakamas need to put the smack down on a hand full of tribal members :twocents:
What I heard is that they are still "getting in trouble" but the fine is only $80.
I hunted up in the colockum last rifle season with my father and talked to 3 different people that shot 1x2's. They turned them self in to the gami. If you do that you only get a ticket for $80.00 a notched tag for that year and loose the elk. They take it to needy people. If you don't turn yourself in you get charged with poaching if caught.
Post by: fishingnut71 on March 20, 2012, 08:45:31 PM
Post by: bobcat on March 20, 2012, 08:49:31 PM
Post by: huntergreg on March 20, 2012, 09:57:47 PM
Post by: PlateauNDN on March 20, 2012, 10:08:39 PM
Post by: DIYARCHERYJUNKIE on March 21, 2012, 04:59:14 AM
Post by: biggdogg on March 21, 2012, 05:33:16 AM
Post by: Skyvalhunter on March 21, 2012, 05:37:47 AM
Post by: PlateauNDN on March 21, 2012, 08:45:10 AM
I was just kidding plat, I will probably never travel to Entiat to shoot deer when we have trophy's in our back yard.
I agree, I don't get why anybody would travel that far to harvest a trophy when they're in our own back yard. I was relating the story of my bull from last year and I filled up my truck went up and parked, walked in to where I had been scouting, shot him, packed him out and came back and only used a couple of gallons.
Guess I will put in for a permit for your back yard then.
My backyard is near the foothills outside of white swan though not quite as close as Hair to the mts. :chuckle:
Post by: Mike450r on March 21, 2012, 08:48:37 AM
I am willing to bet based on what I have read on this site about hating thieves that if your car got broken into and the value of items stolen constituted a felony everybody would be fine with the felony charges.
Is a deer not worth $250.00? Plus, most of the times the crime is committed with a firearm. Other crimes committed with a firearm gets an enhancement.
I say the charge should be a felony, that doesn't mean that a judge or jury cannot convict them of a lesser charge based on a good defense argument or other circumstances that may change things.
Jail time can be suspended, fines can be in the same range. I don't have the exact numbers regarding fines on hand but a misdemeanor is up to a year in jail and a felony is a year or more and fines can fall in the same range with the maximum for a felony being higher. I would not have minded the sentence in this case containing a year in jail that was suspended for the length of probation. A violation of probation would mean the jail time is then to be served.
Post by: Wenatcheejay on March 21, 2012, 08:55:16 AM
However, I just don't get people here anymore. bobcat said 13k in fines? And people still want blood? Why not call for hanging? So, loss of gun privilages (not a Right, a privliage of the State the way we are going?)
A disclaimer this time: Be Careful What You Wish For. I am sure we could find a Senator that supports all illegal hunting as a felony.
Post by: DIYARCHERYJUNKIE on March 21, 2012, 10:32:02 AM
I don't understand the mindset that something like this should not be a felony. The statute is clear on the dollar amount that constitutes felony theft.
I am willing to bet based on what I have read on this site about hating thieves that if your car got broken into and the value of items stolen constituted a felony everybody would be fine with the felony charges.
Is a deer not worth $250.00? Plus, most of the times the crime is committed with a firearm. Other crimes committed with a firearm gets an enhancement.
I say the charge should be a felony, that doesn't mean that a judge or jury cannot convict them of a lesser charge based on a good defense argument or other circumstances that may change things.
Jail time can be suspended, fines can be in the same range. I don't have the exact numbers regarding fines on hand but a misdemeanor is up to a year in jail and a felony is a year or more and fines can fall in the same range with the maximum for a felony being higher. I would not have minded the sentence in this case containing a year in jail that was suspended for the length of probation. A violation of probation would mean the jail time is then to be served.
:yeah:
Post by: Curly on March 21, 2012, 11:50:06 AM
I'm okay with the punishment though. Seems like fairly stiff penalty for not having a history of offenses............(of course, I do have to wonder how many times they've poached but didn't get caught). But you can't penalize someone for assuming they've broken the law before and didn't get caught.
Post by: HairTrigger on March 21, 2012, 12:59:45 PM
I'm not the only one that said this lol. But y'all act like I did our law is first time loss of rights for a year or so second its a loss for lifeGUILTY, hang him high. any big game poaching incident should result in loss of privaleges life time with heavy $$$$$ fines.these types of acts should rank right up with feloneys.
IMO its just like robbery. Its stealing resources from the public and involves a weapon.
Post by: PlateauNDN on March 21, 2012, 01:31:34 PM
I'm not the only one that said this lol. But y'all act like I did our law is first time loss of rights for a year or so second its a loss for lifeGUILTY, hang him high. any big game poaching incident should result in loss of privaleges life time with heavy $$$$$ fines.these types of acts should rank right up with feloneys.
IMO its just like robbery. Its stealing resources from the public and involves a weapon.
I believe they were talking about the State Laws and the guys that were sentenced??? :dunno: :dunno: :dunno: Could be wrong though???
Post by: DIYARCHERYJUNKIE on March 21, 2012, 01:54:40 PM
I'm not the only one that said this lol. But y'all act like I did our law is first time loss of rights for a year or so second its a loss for lifeGUILTY, hang him high. any big game poaching incident should result in loss of privaleges life time with heavy $$$$$ fines.these types of acts should rank right up with feloneys.
IMO its just like robbery. Its stealing resources from the public and involves a weapon.
I believe they were talking about the State Laws and the guys that were sentenced??? :dunno: :dunno: :dunno: Could be wrong though???
Max sentence a year no hunting maybe I know of an incident of an untagged buck and the guy hunted the next year but it was a three point blacktail so not a throphy. Lmao what a joke!
Post by: bigtex on March 21, 2012, 06:00:48 PM
And I definitely don't agree it should be a felony. If he were a repeat offender, then yes, I could see a felony being appropriate. But in this case no way.
There are people who go out and kill several deer in one night, both does and bucks, and leave them lay. No hunting license, it's not hunting season, they just kill for the fun of it. They shoot every living thing they see. This type of crime gets less of a fine than this guy who killed a 4 point mule deer on the wrong side of a GMU boundary.
For the people who kill multiple deer in one night, and leave all the meat to rot, they're the ones that need to be charged with a felony and put in prison. That's the type of person that could end up being a serial killer or a mass murderer, IMO.
There are very few hunting related felonies. The ones that apply to big game is unlawful hunt of big game 1st degree.
There are two routes this offense can be charged:
-Having a previous big game conviction within the past 5 years, and committing another big game offense
-Unlawfully killing 3 or more big game animals within a 24 hour period (often known as thrill or spree killing)
Post by: Biggerhammer on March 21, 2012, 08:36:11 PM