Post by: Killmore on April 10, 2012, 08:56:36 PM
Post by: cem3434 on April 10, 2012, 09:10:57 PM
Well, I see in the new proposals for this coming year they have cut the permit numbers down to 2. Thats 2 for muzzy and 2 for rifle. Hmmmmmm, wonder what their reasoning is?
The deer havent fully recovered from the hair slip disease they had going about 5 years ago. I used to kill a deer in there every year and see 25 plus deer a day in the area I hunted. The last time I hunted in there about 3 years ago, I only seen 3 deer in 4 days of hunting. :twocents:
I wouldnt waste the points in that area for a tag right now. If it was up to me, I would suggest that they close the area down for a couple of seasons to help the population recover.
Post by: ribka on April 10, 2012, 10:03:18 PM
have not see much evidence of hair-loss the past 2 years. If the WDFW regulated the LT and locked the gates from NOv to May would have some fantastic bucks there and more tags IMO
Post by: fishingnut71 on April 12, 2012, 08:05:50 PM
Post by: Killmore on April 13, 2012, 08:34:23 AM
Post by: Killmore on April 13, 2012, 08:38:43 AM
Post by: wazzu99 on April 13, 2012, 08:39:47 AM
Wazzu
Post by: PlateauNDN on April 13, 2012, 09:02:46 AM
Was up there mid nov last year and got stopped by a newer tan dodge ram driven by an Native and he asked me if I had seen any deer or elk. I told him there was a bunch out behind White Swan and he drove off??? Evidentally he didn't like my answer.
Wazzu
:lol4: :lol4: :lol4: I don't care who you are, that Shhh is funny right there! Roadhunters, maybe they should get out and walk off the roadway a little and then they might see something.
I said something similar a couple of years ago when I was in that area when a couple of road hunters pulled up saying the same thing. :bdid:
Post by: groundhog on April 13, 2012, 09:24:06 AM
Post by: PlateauNDN on April 13, 2012, 09:34:19 AM
Post by: boneaddict on April 13, 2012, 10:50:44 AM
Post by: cem3434 on April 13, 2012, 04:46:58 PM
Said it before and I'll say it again, road closures, it's the only way to reduce roadhunting and allow for escapement. Though this year will be interesting, I'm curious to see if any other Tribes attempt to come back over the mts. to the eastside again, if they do I foresee a huge battle between Tribes with us on the winning end. I wouldn't mind throwing out the Mucks and anybody else I find trying to hunt in our Ceded Lands.
Agreed, I love hunting the area. If the gates arent closed, then they get hammered.
It pure and simple......natives+disease+wolves = no animals! WDFW should really try to do a better job of managing the herds with all of the money they get out of us.
Post by: boneaddict on April 13, 2012, 08:45:59 PM
Post by: fishingnut71 on April 15, 2012, 06:50:28 PM
Post by: Slenk on April 15, 2012, 09:17:16 PM
Owner of private ground took the WDFW to court in about 1989-1990 sometime in there.
Post by: Pinetar on April 15, 2012, 09:19:04 PM
On that same day we found 8 gut piles from deer and 7 from elk, 4 were right in the road at the Robinson feed lot. We also saw 5 other vehicles driving off roads and down closed roads.
Not exactly the day I planned in the hills with my 14 year old son. He spent most of the day climbing out of my truck and picking up water bottles and energy drink/soda cans. It was disgusting to witness.
I hope they close the gates the day after elk season and get rid of all the late buck permits. I hate to see the gates get so closed in the year but I don't really see where we have a choice.
Post by: sled on April 15, 2012, 09:25:54 PM
One more thing, now we have to compete with the wolves. So we are DOOMED ...there is a crap load of kittys up there too.
Post by: royalbull on April 15, 2012, 09:38:14 PM
Said it before and I'll say it again, road closures, it's the only way to reduce roadhunting and allow for escapement. Though this year will be interesting, I'm curious to see if any other Tribes attempt to come back over the mts. to the eastside again, if they do I foresee a huge battle between Tribes with us on the winning end. I wouldn't mind throwing out the Mucks and anybody else I find trying to hunt in our Ceded Lands.
how does one tell the difference between tribes?
Post by: Pinetar on April 15, 2012, 09:48:42 PM
Post by: PlateauNDN on April 15, 2012, 10:15:07 PM
Post by: sled on April 15, 2012, 10:25:57 PM
Its pretty difficult if you're not familiar with Tribes but an easy indicator is becoming more and more common around here, our new Yakama Nation license plates which are for Yakama Members only. Also, if they mention they have a permit then they're not Yakama because Yakamas don't require any permits. I usually just ask right off the back if they don't look Yakama. Also, this year our Tribal Leaders issued a letter to the Mucks and WDFW to halt all permits and illegal hunting in our territories or face lawsuits. I haven't inquired as to the responses but from what they told me is they're serious and ready to move forward if they don't comply. So that means their all open game if I see them.if the state cant enforce tribal hunting then who is going to stop them?
Post by: cem3434 on April 15, 2012, 11:07:21 PM
I myself have Native roots (Blackfoot and Wapato), but I have never even thought about pursuing "my rights" because my family wasnt suppressed or held back from something that happened several generations ago. I have hunted with my family, who also have Native roots, but we all hunt by WDFW's rules like every other man, woman or child.
One of my Uncles is 100% Yakima and he has hunted with us since marrying into the family. Sure he doesn't kill a deer and elk every year, but he enjoys the comradery of hunting with the family. I think the Natives have lost sight of what hunting is about and dont depend on hunting as a means to an end any longer.
That's my :twocents: for what its worth and I'm sure it with piss off a couple of the Natives.
Post by: groundhog on April 16, 2012, 07:41:17 AM
Once again it is all about the money and how many dollars these permits generate for the wdfw. Our Mule deer are not doing very well and yet the wdfw give out all these late tags. It would not surprize me to find that more big mature bucks are killed during these late seasons then the entire general season. Now add the native harvest because the gates are open longer. I hate to say it but I think we shoud do away with the late permits and close the LT Murray as soon as the general elk is over.
Post by: PlateauNDN on April 16, 2012, 08:49:45 AM
Its pretty difficult if you're not familiar with Tribes but an easy indicator is becoming more and more common around here, our new Yakama Nation license plates which are for Yakama Members only. Also, if they mention they have a permit then they're not Yakama because Yakamas don't require any permits. I usually just ask right off the back if they don't look Yakama. Also, this year our Tribal Leaders issued a letter to the Mucks and WDFW to halt all permits and illegal hunting in our territories or face lawsuits. I haven't inquired as to the responses but from what they told me is they're serious and ready to move forward if they don't comply. So that means their all open game if I see them.if the state cant enforce tribal hunting then who is going to stop them?
What is occurring is basically poaching. That's what our leaders down here are telling them and WDFW. They venture into our territory then they are going to face a lawsuit and our Leaders are going to pursue the WDFW for not enforcing the Game Laws and allowing another Tribe to poach into our territory.
They have no Rights on this side of the Mts. and that's what they've told the Mucks, stay off our land and if you cross the mts. again then they will pursue it till the very end. I know our Leaders will because they've gone after everybody else when it comes to our lands, the Colvilles, Warm Springs, Umatillas and anybody else that encroaches into our territories.
Our Tribe has entered into more lawsuits than most Tribes in the Northwest and won because we've got a strong Treaty and it has language unique to us and no others, for that we've been successful and will continue to be successful against other Tribes, if need be, and other government entities as well.
Nobody, thats why the treaties need to be abolished. We are in the 21st century and sure there was a lot of pain and suffering a couple hundred years ago, but somebody needs to start managing the game for the future generations. Just because you are Native and have the right to slaughter the animals doesn't mean it the right thing to do.
I myself have Native roots (Blackfoot and WapatoNever heard of this, do you wish to ellaborate?), but I have never even thought about pursuing "my rights" because my family wasnt suppressed or held back from something that happened several generations ago.Or they don't have any ties to any Tribe and you just put this statement in to make yourself look better? My family has done very well through the ages and we don't live like we've been suppressed, but it's our Culture and Tradition that we live by, maybe if you were raised with some of that you would have a sense of what I'm talking about instead of just spouting something off. There are bad apples in each group and we as a People have ours, but don't assume we are all like that and it's pretty obvious your comments about having Native roots is just that, fictitious claims with no value behind it. I have hunted with my family, who also have Native roots, but we all hunt by WDFW's rules like every other man, woman or child.
One of my Uncles is 100% YakimaObviously not if you can't spell "Yakama" correctly. and he has hunted with us since marrying into the family. Sure he doesn't kill a deer and elk every year, but he enjoys the comradery of hunting with the family.That's fine if he doesn't and "IF" he's "Yakama", he was brought up like a lot of us who hunt with ethics and morals, who treat the animals with respect and are not out there for sport like the few bad apples. I think the Natives have lost sight of what hunting is about and dont depend on hunting as a means to an end any longer.I partially agree, there are some who have lost sight of what hunting really means and that's the fault of the family for not teaching the younger generation about respect, ethics, morals, tradition, culture and our way of life.
That's my :twocents: for what its worth and I'm sure it with piss off a couple of the Natives.
No matter who you are talking about it is always a few bad apples that ruin it for everyone. I question wether there should be any late special permit deer tags. Dont get me wrong I put in for them and would love to have the opportunity to hunt during a late season. Does the wdfw have these seasons because of a biological reasons or is it an economic decision?
Once again it is all about the money and how many dollars these permits generate for the wdfw. Our Mule deer are not doing very well and yet the wdfw give out all these late tags. It would not surprize me to find that more big mature bucks are killed during these late seasons then the entire general season. Now add the native harvest because the gates are open longer. I hate to say it but I think we shoud do away with the late permits and close the LT Murray as soon as the general elk is over.
:yeah:
Post by: kirkl on April 16, 2012, 02:51:06 PM
Its pretty difficult if you're not familiar with Tribes but an easy indicator is becoming more and more common around here, our new Yakama Nation license plates which are for Yakama Members only. Also, if they mention they have a permit then they're not Yakama because Yakamas don't require any permits. I usually just ask right off the back if they don't look Yakama. Also, this year our Tribal Leaders issued a letter to the Mucks and WDFW to halt all permits and illegal hunting in our territories or face lawsuits. I haven't inquired as to the responses but from what they told me is they're serious and ready to move forward if they don't comply. So that means their all open game if I see them.if the state cant enforce tribal hunting then who is going to stop them?
What is occurring is basically poaching. That's what our leaders down here are telling them and WDFW. They venture into our territory then they are going to face a lawsuit and our Leaders are going to pursue the WDFW for not enforcing the Game Laws and allowing another Tribe to poach into our territory.
They have no Rights on this side of the Mts. and that's what they've told the Mucks, stay off our land and if you cross the mts. again then they will pursue it till the very end. I know our Leaders will because they've gone after everybody else when it comes to our lands, the Colvilles, Warm Springs, Umatillas and anybody else that encroaches into our territories.
Our Tribe has entered into more lawsuits than most Tribes in the Northwest and won because we've got a strong Treaty and it has language unique to us and no others, for that we've been successful and will continue to be successful against other Tribes, if need be, and other government entities as well.Nobody, thats why the treaties need to be abolished. We are in the 21st century and sure there was a lot of pain and suffering a couple hundred years ago, but somebody needs to start managing the game for the future generations. Just because you are Native and have the right to slaughter the animals doesn't mean it the right thing to do.
I myself have Native roots (Blackfoot and WapatoNever heard of this, do you wish to ellaborate?), but I have never even thought about pursuing "my rights" because my family wasnt suppressed or held back from something that happened several generations ago.Or they don't have any ties to any Tribe and you just put this statement in to make yourself look better? My family has done very well through the ages and we don't live like we've been suppressed, but it's our Culture and Tradition that we live by, maybe if you were raised with some of that you would have a sense of what I'm talking about instead of just spouting something off. There are bad apples in each group and we as a People have ours, but don't assume we are all like that and it's pretty obvious your comments about having Native roots is just that, fictitious claims with no value behind it. I have hunted with my family, who also have Native roots, but we all hunt by WDFW's rules like every other man, woman or child.
One of my Uncles is 100% YakimaObviously not if you can't spell "Yakama" correctly. and he has hunted with us since marrying into the family. Sure he doesn't kill a deer and elk every year, but he enjoys the comradery of hunting with the family.That's fine if he doesn't and "IF" he's "Yakama", he was brought up like a lot of us who hunt with ethics and morals, who treat the animals with respect and are not out there for sport like the few bad apples. I think the Natives have lost sight of what hunting is about and dont depend on hunting as a means to an end any longer.I partially agree, there are some who have lost sight of what hunting really means and that's the fault of the family for not teaching the younger generation about respect, ethics, morals, tradition, culture and our way of life.
That's my :twocents: for what its worth and I'm sure it with piss off a couple of the Natives.No matter who you are talking about it is always a few bad apples that ruin it for everyone. I question wether there should be any late special permit deer tags. Dont get me wrong I put in for them and would love to have the opportunity to hunt during a late season. Does the wdfw have these seasons because of a biological reasons or is it an economic decision?
Once again it is all about the money and how many dollars these permits generate for the wdfw. Our Mule deer are not doing very well and yet the wdfw give out all these late tags. It would not surprize me to find that more big mature bucks are killed during these late seasons then the entire general season. Now add the native harvest because the gates are open longer. I hate to say it but I think we shoud do away with the late permits and close the LT Murray as soon as the general elk is over.
:yeah:
You guys cant even police your own people from going out and killing ungodly amounts of bucks and bulls. Now you want the fish and game to do something. Kinda sounds like reverse of what the white man wants for the indians to qui
killing so many deer and elk but fish and wild life cant do anything about it. why dont your own fish cops deal with it since its ceded land. let them patrol it and try and catch the mucks. what a joke.
Post by: trophyhunt on April 16, 2012, 03:27:53 PM
:yeah: Amen.Its pretty difficult if you're not familiar with Tribes but an easy indicator is becoming more and more common around here, our new Yakama Nation license plates which are for Yakama Members only. Also, if they mention they have a permit then they're not Yakama because Yakamas don't require any permits. I usually just ask right off the back if they don't look Yakama. Also, this year our Tribal Leaders issued a letter to the Mucks and WDFW to halt all permits and illegal hunting in our territories or face lawsuits. I haven't inquired as to the responses but from what they told me is they're serious and ready to move forward if they don't comply. So that means their all open game if I see them.if the state cant enforce tribal hunting then who is going to stop them?
What is occurring is basically poaching. That's what our leaders down here are telling them and WDFW. They venture into our territory then they are going to face a lawsuit and our Leaders are going to pursue the WDFW for not enforcing the Game Laws and allowing another Tribe to poach into our territory.
They have no Rights on this side of the Mts. and that's what they've told the Mucks, stay off our land and if you cross the mts. again then they will pursue it till the very end. I know our Leaders will because they've gone after everybody else when it comes to our lands, the Colvilles, Warm Springs, Umatillas and anybody else that encroaches into our territories.
Our Tribe has entered into more lawsuits than most Tribes in the Northwest and won because we've got a strong Treaty and it has language unique to us and no others, for that we've been successful and will continue to be successful against other Tribes, if need be, and other government entities as well.Nobody, thats why the treaties need to be abolished. We are in the 21st century and sure there was a lot of pain and suffering a couple hundred years ago, but somebody needs to start managing the game for the future generations. Just because you are Native and have the right to slaughter the animals doesn't mean it the right thing to do.
I myself have Native roots (Blackfoot and WapatoNever heard of this, do you wish to ellaborate?), but I have never even thought about pursuing "my rights" because my family wasnt suppressed or held back from something that happened several generations ago.Or they don't have any ties to any Tribe and you just put this statement in to make yourself look better? My family has done very well through the ages and we don't live like we've been suppressed, but it's our Culture and Tradition that we live by, maybe if you were raised with some of that you would have a sense of what I'm talking about instead of just spouting something off. There are bad apples in each group and we as a People have ours, but don't assume we are all like that and it's pretty obvious your comments about having Native roots is just that, fictitious claims with no value behind it. I have hunted with my family, who also have Native roots, but we all hunt by WDFW's rules like every other man, woman or child.
One of my Uncles is 100% YakimaObviously not if you can't spell "Yakama" correctly. and he has hunted with us since marrying into the family. Sure he doesn't kill a deer and elk every year, but he enjoys the comradery of hunting with the family.That's fine if he doesn't and "IF" he's "Yakama", he was brought up like a lot of us who hunt with ethics and morals, who treat the animals with respect and are not out there for sport like the few bad apples. I think the Natives have lost sight of what hunting is about and dont depend on hunting as a means to an end any longer.I partially agree, there are some who have lost sight of what hunting really means and that's the fault of the family for not teaching the younger generation about respect, ethics, morals, tradition, culture and our way of life.
That's my :twocents: for what its worth and I'm sure it with piss off a couple of the Natives.No matter who you are talking about it is always a few bad apples that ruin it for everyone. I question wether there should be any late special permit deer tags. Dont get me wrong I put in for them and would love to have the opportunity to hunt during a late season. Does the wdfw have these seasons because of a biological reasons or is it an economic decision?
Once again it is all about the money and how many dollars these permits generate for the wdfw. Our Mule deer are not doing very well and yet the wdfw give out all these late tags. It would not surprize me to find that more big mature bucks are killed during these late seasons then the entire general season. Now add the native harvest because the gates are open longer. I hate to say it but I think we shoud do away with the late permits and close the LT Murray as soon as the general elk is over.
:yeah:
You guys cant even police your own people from going out and killing ungodly amounts of bucks and bulls. Now you want the fish and game to do something. Kinda sounds like reverse of what the white man wants for the indians to qui
killing so many deer and elk but fish and wild life cant do anything about it. why dont your own fish cops deal with it since its ceded land. let them patrol it and try and catch the mucks. what a joke.
Post by: PlateauNDN on April 16, 2012, 03:28:30 PM
Yes, that's right we need to do a better job of policing our own but, who doesn't? There's poachers and unethical hunters on both sides of the fence.
Since you don't like what I have to say then put me on ignore and save yourself the trouble of having to read what I have to say. :tup:
Post by: cem3434 on April 16, 2012, 03:51:17 PM
My dad's mother was full blooded Wapato and was born and raised in the culture. She met my Grandfather and left her family behind to be with him before having 8 children. My Mom's mother was half Blackfoot, but wasn't raised with the culture. She left home when she was 15 and married my Grandfather at 16 before having 8 kids. You are correct that we do not tie ourselves to the Native culture, but that doesn't mean that I am don't have Native roots. I am not ignorant, but I have never taken much interest in the culture and tradition because I wasn't raised with our heritage.
In this day and age, the United States is a melting pot and there are very few"true" Native people left. Just because you choose to partake in your heritage and I don't, doesn't mean that I don't have Native Roots. I
agree that there are bad apples in every group, but would you not agree that Natives seem to be involved more often then other groups in taking of game that is questionable or unethical? If it is part of a Tribes culture, then why don't today's Native people hunt the same way their ancestors did? I think mowing down a herd with rifles (not saying that you would) is a far cry from what your ancestors did when they were hunting for sustenance while upholding your culture and tradition. I don't think that these actions are what your ancestors envisioned for their people when they signed the treaty's which were meant to help preserve culture and tradition.
You are correct, I did misspell Yakama in the sense that you are speaking about because I used spell check which recognizes the word "Yakima". With that being said, that doesn't mean that my Uncle wasn't born and raised in the culture. I do agree that he does have more respect for animals than most people, but he doesn't live by the culture and traditions in which he was raised.
It sounds like we are on the same page on a lot of the major issues, i.e. losing site of what hunting really about, bad apples in every group, etc. I think certain Tribes, take advantage of the system and the tribes need to do a better job of regulating their people versus letting them run a muck. Obviously the State and WDFW has no ability to and that's why I think that the treaties have outlived their use. Poaching is poaching is poaching and something needs to be done to minimize poaching from Natives and Nonnatives alike.
If you want to uphold your culture and tradition, I am all for it and would support you in doing so. I would be in support to some revised treaties to allow for the harvesting of animals to help preserve your culture and tradition, but the current system isn't working. My primary concern is being able to pass on hunting and fishing to my children, but I think our sport is in grave danger if all of us aren't willing to compromise!
Post by: sled on April 16, 2012, 03:57:34 PM
Post by: PlateauNDN on April 16, 2012, 04:25:42 PM
If you have never heard of the Wapato Indians, then try googling it. Honestly, I wasn't raised in the culture and with the traditions, so I have never taken much time to learn about my Native heritage. Sorry, never heard of them, maybe you can enlighten me as to the origins of this "Tribe".
My dad's mother was full blooded Wapato and was born and raised in the culture. She met my Grandfather and left her family behind to be with him before having 8 children. My Mom's mother was half Blackfoot Blackfoot or Blackfeet?, but wasn't raised with the culture. She left home when she was 15 and married my Grandfather at 16 before having 8 kids. You are correct that we do not tie ourselves to the Native culture, but that doesn't mean that I am don't have Native roots. I am not ignorant, but I have never taken much interest in the culture and tradition because I wasn't raised with our heritage.
In this day and age, the United States is a melting pot and there are very few"true" Native people left.Really? What rock have you been living under? I see them all the time and especially now since we're nearing the end of our General Council. We exercise our culture and heritage in everything we do. We open a birthday or event with a song and prayer and close the event with a song and prayer. There are many still to this day that live without many luxuries that most have. I know scores of families that live in the Medicine Valley area, Billyville and other villages along the river that to this day don't have electricity or running water and that's of their choosing. Just because you choose to partake in your heritage and I don't, doesn't mean that I don't have Native Roots. I
agree that there are bad apples in every group, but would you not agree that Natives seem to be involved more often then other groups in taking of game that is questionable or unethical? No, I don't agree, there's just as many if not more poachers and unethical hunters than there are Tribal Hunters. Look at previous threads on here for example as to how many spikes were left to rot because somebody shot and left them to avoid a ticket, I think I counted at least 20-30 spikes that were reported on here that were poached. There have also been those on here with ethics that have bit the bullet when they were in the wrong and that's commendable. If it is part of a Tribes culture, then why don't today's Native people hunt the same way their ancestors did? I think mowing down a herd with rifles (not saying that you would) is a far cry from what your ancestors did when they were hunting for sustenance while upholding your culture and tradition. I don't think that these actions are what your ancestors envisioned for their people when they signed the treaty's which were meant to help preserve culture and tradition. No, it probably wasn't what they had in mind and there are more than you and others think that are trying to see somethings change in regards to overharvesting and unethical hunting.
You are correct, I did misspell Yakama in the sense that you are speaking about because I used spell check which recognizes the word "Yakima". With that being said, that doesn't mean that my Uncle wasn't born and raised in the culture. I do agree that he does have more respect for animals than most people, but he doesn't live by the culture and traditions in which he was raised. Sorry but I haven't had an issue with spell check. He was raised with culture and tradition but he now chooses to live without it?
It sounds like we are on the same page on a lot of the major issues, i.e. losing site of what hunting really about, bad apples in every group, etc. I think certain Tribes, take advantage of the system and the tribes need to do a better job of regulating their people versus letting them run a muck. Obviously the State and WDFW has no ability to and that's why I think that the treaties have outlived their use. Poaching is poaching is poaching and something needs to be done to minimize poaching from Natives and Nonnatives alike.
If you want to uphold your culture and tradition, I am all for it and would support you in doing so. I would be in support to some revised treaties to allow for the harvesting of animals to help preserve your culture and tradition, but the current system isn't working. My primary concern is being able to pass on hunting and fishing to my children, but I think our sport is in grave danger if all of us aren't willing to compromise! Again, there are things that need to be updated but it's not at the expense of the Treaties. And I for one and many of my family members don't see it as a "sport" but that's how some do and the mind set needs to be adjusted. This isn't a sport to I and my family, it's a way of life, a culture and tradition passed down for many many many generations.
Plat. I think i remember you saying somthing about going to montana, or wyoming to hunt buffalo. Maybe it wasnt you dont remember. What is the diff between that and the mucks comming to the ceded area?
It was first stated on here by Bigbulls and then myself when I mentioned I've been looking into it as well. The difference is we, along with the Umatillas and Nez Perce have it documented that we all traveled to the Plains to harvest buffalo. The Mucks have no justifiable documentation to prove they ever came into this area. Even in our Treaty Minutes one of the Chiefs tells Gov. Stevens that he was late to the Council because he just got back from a buffalo hunt. He goes on to state that he will sign only if the People are given guarantees that they will be able to exercise their rights to travel to the Plains of MT and continue hunting buffalo and that Gov. Stevens needed to secure safe passage and talk with the Blackfeet Nation to tell them that we have come to an agreement and to stop attacking our warriors as they traveled across Blackfeet territory, he did not want to be the ones to violate the Treaty by becoming hostile in self-defense of his People.
Post by: coachcw on April 16, 2012, 04:52:41 PM
Post by: cem3434 on April 16, 2012, 07:03:30 PM
You are obviously very educated, so look it up. If I had questions about the Yakama Tribe, then I would research it for myself. If you want to be arrogant and your only purpose is to just try to make me look stupid, then I'm not going to lower myself to your level. If you want to have an intelligent conversation or debate, then I am more than willing to engage.
My Grandmother on my Mothers' side was half Blackfoot and my Mothers' family is from Montana. As I said previously, I don't embrace the culture and traditions of the Tribe, so I don't know a lot about the people. With that being said, I started hunting at an early age and it is part of my culture and traditions.
I haven't been living under a rock, but I think you are misinterpreting my message. What I was trying to convey, is there are very few Native people left who are of pure blood in comparison to the number of people that are members of the tribe. I am sure with a little research and effort, I could get a card that proves that I am of Native blood, but what would that accomplish for me? I think several guys that are in my position exploit the system for the sake of their benefit.
As far as people choosing to live without power, well that is there God given right. I'm not going to judge someone that chooses that lifestyle for themselves, but I know a few white people that chose to live without power so does that make them any better than the rest of us? Just because you chose to live your life a certain way doesn't mean that you should be entitled to greater or lesser treatment than the next man.
Natives and Nonnatives (married in, adopted, etc) that hunt with Natives poach animals too. I'm not calling all Tribal hunters poachers, but there are several Tribal hunters that ARE poachers. Don't preach to me about spikes being shot and left and don't be so ignorant or naive to think that Native hunters don't poach just as much as ALL other hunters. I have seen Natives shoot up a heard of elk hitting bulls, cows and calves and then only take the bulls that they could get their trucks to. We reported them to WDFW and they said there was nothing they could do.
As far as my uncle goes, he got in a lot of trouble when he lived on the Reservation. He chose a different path for his life and decided to conform to the standard, which took him away from the Reservation when he was about 20 years old. I have never questioned him about it nor would I ever because every man has to live with his choices and I would never disrespect my Uncle in that way. I have seen several pictures from hunting in his youth when he partook in Tribal hunts and they slaughtered elk. When he was 16 years old, he harvested 2 very nice bulls in the same weekend. I think all told, his hunting party that harvested a total of 7 bulls that weekend and they were all Yakama Nation members.
I agree with your last statement, with some exceptions. If the Tribes don't modify the Treaties, then who is going to protect OUR wildlife from the Native hunters that go to far because they can? I know you wont agree with my last statement, but all the guys that pay for licenses every year do just as much or more as Natives for conservation so they are all of OUR elk and not just the Tribes Secondly, it is a sport, way of life, culture, heritage and tradition. It is a sport because none of us have to kill animals any longer and we all could go buy meat out of the store. Just because you are active in the Yakama Tribe, that doesn't mean that the choice to hunt is any more sacred to your culture and tradition than mine!
I grew up hunting just like you, so to say that the hunting isn't a way of life or part of the culture and tradition to myself or others not affiliated with the tribe is ludicrous. If you truly feel this way then you are a very ignorant individual. Just because I don't practice the same cultural events and traditions as you, doesn't mean that its not part of my culture, tradition, heritage and who I am as an individual.
Post by: igotbigbulls on April 16, 2012, 08:08:48 PM
Post by: royalbull on April 16, 2012, 08:46:50 PM
Its pretty difficult if you're not familiar with Tribes but an easy indicator is becoming more and more common around here, our new Yakama Nation license plates which are for Yakama Members only. Also, if they mention they have a permit then they're not Yakama because Yakamas don't require any permits. I usually just ask right off the back if they don't look Yakama. Also, this year our Tribal Leaders issued a letter to the Mucks and WDFW to halt all permits and illegal hunting in our territories or face lawsuits. I haven't inquired as to the responses but from what they told me is they're serious and ready to move forward if they don't comply. So that means their all open game if I see them.
this would be nice if all tribes used tribal plates then I would no for sure I see alot of tribal members hunting in 346 and I believe most are from the west side
Post by: cem3434 on April 16, 2012, 08:49:14 PM
Post by: Killmore on April 16, 2012, 08:51:08 PM
Post by: PlateauNDN on April 16, 2012, 09:10:57 PM
Post by: sled on April 16, 2012, 09:36:27 PM
Post by: coachcw on April 17, 2012, 06:48:28 AM
Post by: PlateauNDN on April 17, 2012, 08:22:37 AM
I would love to see your harvest info plat. Thanks. Looking forward to it.
This is only representative of the West side Tribes as they report to the Northwest Indian Fisheries Commission which oversees all the Treaty Tribes in Western Washington. This is their 2010-2011 big game harvest report.
http://nwifc.org/w/wp-content/uploads/downloads/2011/08/big-game-harvest-report-2010to2011.pdf
I talked to three different mucks that where road hunting in robinson canyon the first week of december . they where dressed like they where headed to a soccer game not hunting , Atleast We where able to save some elk that day since we spooked them off the roads early :tup: . Not one of them got outta there truck and even glassed a canyon let alone hiked one :bash: ( evidence from the lack of boot tracks . Close the gates to walk in only mid Nov and you will all but cure the problem there. :tup: I agree, close gates and you'll spare more wildlife.
Thanks coach for the info. I'll be sure to pass that along.
Post by: igotbigbulls on April 17, 2012, 08:34:59 AM
Post by: Killmore on April 17, 2012, 11:36:37 AM
Post by: coachcw on April 17, 2012, 01:13:33 PM
Post by: cem3434 on April 17, 2012, 01:20:53 PM
Good read and info.
Agreed, thanks for the info!
Post by: hunterrcc on April 18, 2012, 10:08:37 PM
Yep the tags have been reduced because of the increase in native harvest. I agree the gate should be closed as soon as the special permit season is over. If this doesn't work we need to do away with the special permits and close it after the general elk season. It is a shame to have to close it down early but I see no alternative. The animals got hammered last year by natives in December.2nd this!!! you know how I feel about this!