new Article: WDFW blindsided by Timberland Fees

[fireweed]

I blame the agencies for landlocked public land, not the private landowners.  Agencies can get easements, but they are too cheap.  However, the DNR has no legal authority  to get a public use easement via eminent domain (only willing seller).  The WDFW can (but they don't) and the USFS can, and sometimes they do.  There are also laws on the books that say you can't landlock someone else's TIMBER, but you can landlock public land. 

For all you the Toutle and Margaret tag holders who get locked out of public land every fire season, yell at the Forest Service.   USFS specifically passed on easements back in 1985 because (this is quoted from their plan)  "The landowners have traditionally had an open access policy...If in the future public demands indicate a need for public access rights, the Forest Service will acquire those rights." These easements would open up the Toutle block DNR plus adjacent USFS.   We've been demanding for years now, and the USFS is aware of the issue, but they haven't gotten serious...Surprise!  (I'm a broken record... and don't just think I pick on timber co's for access.  This landlocked situation is squarely the fault of agencies and they've all heard from me!Maybe if they got letters from more folks they would take it seriously. I was especially miffed that the DNR was asking you to have a DP once you got to their landlocked land.)

[bigtex]

And,
Our own DNR continues to "swap out" public lands held close to population centers for lands held in the high elevations of North Eastern Washington where almost nobody can just drop by after work or school to enjoy.

People need to remember DNR's #1 purpose is NOT providing public land access but rather profiting from timber sales

[headshot5]

People need to remember DNR's #1 purpose is NOT providing public land access but rather profiting from timber sales

 

[grundy53]

"And what did you mean by landowners next to a pubic road controlling everybody else?"

What kind of road?

It means the one with the legal access (public road frontage) gets to control all the land behind them on the logging roads.  We all know in Wash. state USFS owns the Mountains, DNR then might own the foot hills, and private owns the lowland next to the public roads.  So if the lowland gates are shut, they can block all the land "behind" them (the public land).  Where I live we have many thousands of acres of public lands blocked by private timber simply because of this--to get to the public land from a public road you must first go through a few miles of private.  I DO blame the agencies for this.  They had chances in the past to get easements, but were getting public access (then!) without easements for free, so they didn't bother.  Now it is a big issue--for access, tourism, economic development, rural quality of life.  Those landlocked public areas, no matter how large, are ineligible for most public funding like grants.  So we pay in via taxes, but cant get funds for our public lands.   I have no sympathy for landowners who think it is their "right" to control public land.  Getting legal easements to landlocked public lands is the perfect use of eminent domain, especially for large parcels (1000's of acres) using existing roads. How could America or any country develop if roads to key areas couldn't pass through private lands?

I don't know of any land owners that think it is their "right" to control public lands. It is not their fault the agencies were dumb enough to end up with these situations. If I had landlocked public land behind mine I sure as heck wouldn't keep an open road to it that I had to maintain and clean up garbage on, not to mention dealing with vandalism that inevitably goes along with it. Meanwhile sitting back waiting for a guy to run off the road and sue me because he claims a pothole or something was the cause.

"Getting legal easements to landlocked public lands is the perfect use of eminent domain" I think you are spot on here! But I don't see how you can villainize the landowners because this is not happening  I think it is pretty clear by now that the government agencies don't care to much about us. My bet is the only thing stopping them from purchasing easement's is that they don't want to pay for them and maintain the roads. They are doing a piss poor job of maintaining the roads they already do have in my area.

Exactly!

sent from my typewriter

[grundy53]

And,
Our own DNR continues to "swap out" public lands held close to population centers for lands held in the high elevations of North Eastern Washington where almost nobody can just drop by after work or school to enjoy.

People need to remember DNR's #1 purpose is NOT providing public land access but rather profiting from timber sales

sent from my typewriter

[Goshawk]

And,
Our own DNR continues to "swap out" public lands held close to population centers for lands held in the high elevations of North Eastern Washington where almost nobody can just drop by after work or school to enjoy.

People need to remember DNR's #1 purpose is NOT providing public land access but rather profiting from timber sales

Well then, I think they really screwed that up big time. Some of the land swaps I've seen are loosing lowland forests for high elevation forests that have a much slower rate of regrowth. Now toss in the outright land sales and your just loosing ground all around.

[jay.sharkbait]

Wouldn't think of dropping a flare, just sarcasm and frustration. Lighten up.

It's not me you have to be concerned about lightening up. After your public post, if a suspicious fire starts in one of these tree farms, I'll be the least of your worries. Everything you post on the internet is there forever.

My property borders Vail. Everything I own is here including a 150 years of family history and heirlooms.

Think about it

[Coastal_native]

And,
Our own DNR continues to "swap out" public lands held close to population centers for lands held in the high elevations of North Eastern Washington where almost nobody can just drop by after work or school to enjoy.

People need to remember DNR's #1 purpose is NOT providing public land access but rather profiting from timber sales

 

Interesting...I wonder if they know that.  They're currently cutting 1/3 of what would be considered sustainable...meanwhile the state is broke and people have to pay for access.

[snowpack]

And,
Our own DNR continues to "swap out" public lands held close to population centers for lands held in the high elevations of North Eastern Washington where almost nobody can just drop by after work or school to enjoy.

People need to remember DNR's #1 purpose is NOT providing public land access but rather profiting from timber sales

 

Interesting...I wonder if they know that.  They're currently cutting 1/3 of what would be considered sustainable...meanwhile the state is broke and people have to pay for access.

I think that DNR gets hamstrung by the greenies/laws so much more than the private farms (but not nearly as much as USFS) that they can't really capitalize on the timber.

[bobcat]

You also need to consider the state of the timber market. Many timber sales that the DNR puts up for bid are going unsold.

[KFhunter]

since they are charging recreational use fees it should be taxed like an amusement park, a separate tax from land/timber.

I really don't see a lot of difference from Silverwood charging to get through their gates vs weyco to get through their gates etc.


 

[RadSav]

I have to wonder if Weyco isn't a little miffed that they are not being included in the Discover Pass program.  WDFW is getting 8% & DNR is getting 8%.  Perhaps they wanted a stake and this is all just a loud statement they want to be included 

Timber companies own twice as many acres as those covered by the DPass. I expect because of the pass they are seeing an increase in sportsmen using their land.  And they are seeing no monetary benefit to the increased use, wear and vandalism.  I'd bet if the state wanted to keep private timber lands open to the public they could simply offer to expand the DPass program.  But then again that sounds like a simple solution.  And we all know government hates anything that might be simple!

[Skyvalhunter]

As has been said do away with the tax incentives.

[TheHunt]

Get a group for hunting.  Hire a helicopter to drop you in the State property that is land locked.   Not sure what the payment would look like but not sure it would be too much split between three or four people.

[templar021]

 "Public lands are owned by the government, not a company"
no...public lands are owned by us.  They are only managed by the government.