Post by: ribka on January 01, 2012, 08:21:04 PM
Waiting now six years for an archery bull tag for this unit.
Really putting a hurt on the elk and deer in there this Winter.Saw over ten rigs with Yak plates driving into the LT yesterday. Shooting lots of does and small bucks. Be nice if the deer herds were allowed to recover in this state. :bash: :bash:
Post by: buglebuster on January 01, 2012, 08:58:15 PM
Be nice if the deer herds were allowed to recover in this state. :bash: :bash:Especially in the LT/wenas area :bash:
Post by: ribka on January 01, 2012, 08:58:39 PM
maybe WDFW needs to increase fees for the Discover Pass or introduce a $75 wolf sighting vehicle pass for all public grounds in WA.
Post by: ribka on January 01, 2012, 09:00:45 PM
Be nice if the deer herds were allowed to recover in this state. :bash: :bash:Especially in the LT/wenas area :bash:
Last 2 years deer finally recovering from hair loss in the Wenas but this year seeing a lot of does and small one year old bucks shot from vehicles bearing tribal plates.
Post by: adamR on January 01, 2012, 09:06:40 PM
Post by: Skyvalhunter on January 01, 2012, 09:13:27 PM
Post by: ICEMAN on January 01, 2012, 10:07:55 PM
Post by: canyelk48 on January 02, 2012, 10:27:11 AM
Post by: C-Money on January 02, 2012, 10:42:24 AM
Post by: 3dsheetmetal on January 02, 2012, 11:02:40 AM
Great! What the heck are the natives planning on hunting after they wipe out the herds? :mor:The natives are a proud people you know.They have to feed their families and my god if one of them passes on they have to kill an elk so they can feast.Well might as well face the fact that they will kill everything until nothing is left then go crying that the white man has destroyed and raped there lands and they will want to be compensated. They destroyed the salmon and steelhead runs and now are working on the deer and elk herds. Better plan on hunting different states where the natives aren't so glutinous.NATIVE PRIDE what a joke!!!!!!!! :mor:
Post by: colockumelk on January 02, 2012, 12:24:17 PM
Post by: Harborhunter on January 02, 2012, 12:44:00 PM
Something does need to be done though, we all need to be on the same playing field in regards to public land. Times have changed. The game is not as plentiful as it once was. Do what you want on your reservation, but if you are on public land i think everyone should have to buy a license and abide by the same rules. Guess what, everyone is trying to feed their families, that is not an excuse for tribal members. We all have the opportunity to go to the store now days and purchase food. Get a job and earn a living or use some of your money to necessities, not new vehicles that will end up being beat to hell, Jordan's, or tattoos.
Post by: igotbigbulls on January 02, 2012, 01:05:05 PM
Great! What the heck are the natives planning on hunting after they wipe out the herds? :mor:The natives are a proud people you know.They have to feed their families and my god if one of them passes on they have to kill an elk so they can feast.Well might as well face the fact that they will kill everything until nothing is left then go crying that the white man has destroyed and raped there lands and they will want to be compensated. They destroyed the salmon and steelhead runs and now are working on the deer and elk herds. Better plan on hunting different states where the natives aren't so glutinous.NATIVE PRIDE what a joke!!!!!!!! :mor:
I am glad I do not hunt central Washington for deer or elk! We have tribes who hunt here on the coast, but at least the animals do not have winter range areas where animals are concentrated for their "hunt". No doubt they are putting a hurting on the deer and elk, but i am sure there are some animals that actually require work to kill, and not many tribal hunters are going to put forth much effort to get an animal. They will get some, but they won't get them all. You guys keep up the good work over there in Central Washington!
Something does need to be done though, we all need to be on the same playing field in regards to public land. Times have changed. The game is not as plentiful as it once was. Do what you want on your reservation, but if you are on public land i think everyone should have to buy a license and abide by the same rules. Guess what, everyone is trying to feed their families, that is not an excuse for tribal members. We all have the opportunity to go to the store now days and purchase food. Get a job and earn a living or use some of your money to necessities, not new vehicles that will end up being beat to hell, Jordan's, or tattoos.
uneducated :mor: :stup: dont think you want to play the stereo typing game. or keep complaining and do nothing.
Post by: 3dsheetmetal on January 02, 2012, 01:22:56 PM
uneducated :mor: :stup: dont think you want to play the stereo typing game. or keep complaining and do nothing.
[/quote]
How is it stereotyping to say the natives are destroying the elk and deer herds when actually you know what they are get a clue.I guess the NATIVES DIDN'T DESTROY THE FISH RUNS EITHER. Let me ask you who hunts at the feeding stations and have no limits on what they slaughter all winter long.Something has to be done at least you got that right!
Post by: HairTrigger on January 02, 2012, 04:06:35 PM
Post by: huntergreg on January 02, 2012, 04:10:21 PM
Post by: canyelk48 on January 02, 2012, 04:26:13 PM
So long as Native Americans continue to drive the mountains and fill the beds of their pickups with anything with fur or stretch their nets across the mouths of streams and rivers catching as many Salmon as they can, only to leave stacks of dead rotting fish on the banks, you will always be seen as "the problem".
There's a few Native Americans on this site that seem like stand up guys who have their chit together and understand the problems and issues. If they'd step up and educate their people, it could go a long way towards changing things for the better.
Post by: sled on January 02, 2012, 04:38:05 PM
Thats my opinion! When is the bs going to stop?
Post by: HairTrigger on January 02, 2012, 04:55:15 PM
Sorry need to vent! If they want to hunt the way they do they can ride horses over and shoot animals with bows and arrows they make. If they want to fish with nets, they can hand weave them out of cedar bark or whatever they used back in the day. If they want to take whales they can carve cedar canoes, and harpoon whales with ones they made with the materials they did when the treaty was signed.
Thats my opinion! When is the bs going to stop?
As should you too remember where you all come. From
Post by: sled on January 02, 2012, 05:03:37 PM
Sorry need to vent! If they want to hunt the way they do they can ride horses over and shoot animals with bows and arrows they make. If they want to fish with nets, they can hand weave them out of cedar bark or whatever they used back in the day. If they want to take whales they can carve cedar canoes, and harpoon whales with ones they made with the materials they did when the treaty was signed.i hunt and fish by laws that are made for 2012, not 200 years ago!
Thats my opinion! When is the bs going to stop?
As should you too remember where you all come. From
Post by: HairTrigger on January 02, 2012, 05:07:31 PM
:tup:
Post by: HairTrigger on January 02, 2012, 05:08:51 PM
Post by: jager on January 02, 2012, 05:14:08 PM
How about the Native Americans that don't abuse their hunting rights take a stand and raise enough stink with their tribes so that the problem "slaughter hunters" get pressured enough to stop this senseless slaughter that occurs every year. You take the pictures of the truckloads of deer and elk that come back onto the Rez, and you send them to the Press to embarrass and pressure your tribe until it stops. Us "white eyes" will never be able to fix this issue since our government feels that its hands are tied because of some 200 year old treaties. If YOU don't get your own people to stop, then there will be a time in the future where the only thing left to hunt will be the empty beer cans strewn throughout the wilderness. (and those are left by both ethnic groups).
So long as Native Americans continue to drive the mountains and fill the beds of their pickups with anything with fur or stretch their nets across the mouths of streams and rivers catching as many Salmon as they can, only to leave stacks of dead rotting fish on the banks, you will always be seen as "the problem".
Post by: adamR on January 02, 2012, 05:20:21 PM
From the whole ceeded area :chuckle:
:tup:
This is what canyelk48 was talking about, everything I read from you is all a big freaking joke!!! I hope you are still laughing when there is no animals left for you to go hunt and your family is starving. Or if by some chance our government does something right for once and fixes this I can't wait to laugh in your face and turn "this big joke" right around.
Post by: HairTrigger on January 02, 2012, 05:21:50 PM
Post by: HairTrigger on January 02, 2012, 05:28:55 PM
Post by: sled on January 02, 2012, 05:34:12 PM
Post by: colockumelk on January 02, 2012, 05:34:38 PM
So based on this why do the Yakamas think that their unrestricted hunting will be any different and won't lead to the decimation of our herds. Especially since technology is so much better.
Back then conservation minded hunters pushed for game laws and people who were selfish and either didn't care about game animals or were naive to the situation were against this and cried about their rights being taken. This is the same situation just 100 years later.
Sorry need to vent! If they want to hunt the way they do they can ride horses over and shoot animals with bows and arrows they make. If they want to fish with nets, they can hand weave them out of cedar bark or whatever they used back in the day. If they want to take whales they can carve cedar canoes, and harpoon whales with ones they made with the materials they did when the treaty was signed.
Thats my opinion! When is the bs going to stop?
As should you too remember where you all come. From
Post by: adamR on January 02, 2012, 05:38:23 PM
I do what I can an don't say I don't cause you don't even know me I don't think its a joke the only joke is tha racist peopleWho's being racist?
I read every comment in the silver dollar thread and didn't say much during that process, all you ever did was tell us non natives we were racist and had false hopes and just laughed it off. Never once did you supply constructive comments, and when people like Plateau and Colockumelk had intelligent things to say you just put them down. Grow up and realize whats going on, we aren't out to get you cuz you're a different color, we want game management.
Post by: HairTrigger on January 02, 2012, 05:49:37 PM
Post by: HairTrigger on January 02, 2012, 05:51:38 PM
Post by: colockumelk on January 02, 2012, 06:26:30 PM
What I wanted on the silver dollar was the pictures on said he had for the proof an none surfaced. Basic a bashing tread from the get go never said any you were did I if I did show me where I did
It wasn't a bashing thread. It was the guys first post. He heard a rumor that was very plausible and he was shocked. He asked for clarification and if anyone knew anything about it. It was stated early on that it was just a rumor. The the thread then went in a completely different direction and was about tribal hunting and its effects in the wintering grounds. Everyone except you knew this and moved on. You also being new were the o.ly one bent around the axle about the title of the thread.
I did notice that once again you either ignored my posts or chose not to respond to it.
We do remember where we came from and we remember our history. We remember that unregulated hunting led to the decline and decimation of game animals. We remember that it was this decimation that resulted in sportsman developing game laws and harvest restrictions so we could conserve and ensure the continuation of the species.
So based on this why do the Yakamas think that their unrestricted hunting will be any different and won't lead to the decimation of our herds. Especially since technology is so much better.
Back then conservation minded hunters pushed for game laws and people who were selfish and either didn't care about game animals or were naive to the situation were against this and cried about their rights being taken. This is the same situation just 100 years later.Sorry need to vent! If they want to hunt the way they do they can ride horses over and shoot animals with bows and arrows they make. If they want to fish with nets, they can hand weave them out of cedar bark or whatever they used back in the day. If they want to take whales they can carve cedar canoes, and harpoon whales with ones they made with the materials they did when the treaty was signed.
Thats my opinion! When is the bs going to stop?
As should you too remember where you all come. From
Post by: HairTrigger on January 02, 2012, 06:41:50 PM
Post by: adamR on January 02, 2012, 06:58:09 PM
Same ol same ol
there it is again! got to have the last word and without a rebuttal
Post by: ICEMAN on January 02, 2012, 07:05:45 PM
Post by: Pinetar on January 02, 2012, 07:13:13 PM
You are the one that seems like he has issues with racism, every time someone posts something that has to do with native american you call them out. Plus you are arguing with guys that are obviously a whole lot smarter than you by the way I read your comments.
Post by: HairTrigger on January 02, 2012, 07:24:24 PM
Post by: sled on January 02, 2012, 07:35:02 PM
Yup I sure am NOT. I know that something needs to happen an in a hurry too before the one's who take advantage an ruin it for all I hope something is hashed out between the tribe an state I wouldn't even mind us goin into a season like the umatillasare you kidding??
Post by: igotbigbulls on January 02, 2012, 07:42:15 PM
Post by: HairTrigger on January 02, 2012, 07:43:52 PM
Post by: adamR on January 02, 2012, 07:47:46 PM
we have a good season i think. that is for a tribe. i know it doesnt make everyone happy.It's not about making us happy, it's about my grandchildren having something to hunt someday, I don't see how you aren't worried about your grandchildren. You seem worried that your family has enough elk to last an average family a long long time.
Yup I sure am NOT. I know that something needs to happen an in a hurry too before the one's who take advantage an ruin it for all I hope something is hashed out between the tribe an state I wouldn't even mind us goin into a season like the umatillasif you agree with us why have you been fighting us this whole time and not offering input or anything, I'm glad you agree but that just means you were ignoring it then and thats not helping the problem either
Post by: Pinetar on January 02, 2012, 07:50:54 PM
Post by: colockumelk on January 02, 2012, 07:51:37 PM
Now what I say something. For both sides. An its not good enough wtf do you want me say then
Nope your previous post was very well said. :tup: He said "are you kidding" because your last post was a complete 180 from your previous posts.
Post by: igotbigbulls on January 02, 2012, 07:54:50 PM
Post by: HairTrigger on January 02, 2012, 07:57:19 PM
Post by: sled on January 02, 2012, 08:02:07 PM
im not talking about making you happy. hell your not happy with the current rules and regs as it is. everyone has the answer and WDFW sucks. thats what i get from most of the talk out there. my grandchilderen will be hunting and fishing just like i am right now. and dont talk about what i take for my family and how much game we eat. you dont know the culture the people or the history of the people.greedy poeple!!! Bye the way anyone can go to a museum, or read about the history. Its not rocket science. Is bs because as i stated before there is not enough resources to feed families like that anymore. I would love to be able to shoot enough for my extended family also. If everyone did that there wouldn't. Be much left would there? Unfourtanately most people need to have jobs to buy beef chicken, and pork to feed their families for the remainder of the year after the one deer or elk they were lucky enough to harvest if they did is gone.
Post by: adamR on January 02, 2012, 08:08:04 PM
Do you?
did your great grandfather go out in his motor driven vehicle with his buddies and their high powered rifles and shoot as many elk as they wanted?
or did they ride their horses out and shoot with primitive weapons? get just enough for the tribe and have respect for what they took or didn't take, they didn't fill a truck bed full of meat because they didn't have a truck bed to fill? I believe they had their backs and horses to carry the animals back.
Don't pull that culture crap on me, it's in no way the same as it was when they made the treaty.
Post by: Pinetar on January 02, 2012, 08:12:10 PM
Post by: HairTrigger on January 02, 2012, 08:15:59 PM
Post by: HairTrigger on January 02, 2012, 08:19:03 PM
Post by: igotbigbulls on January 02, 2012, 08:45:02 PM
Post by: igotbigbulls on January 02, 2012, 08:46:28 PM
Post by: sled on January 02, 2012, 08:53:00 PM
Post by: adamR on January 02, 2012, 08:54:08 PM
if you want to know pinetar look it up on the web. ive posted our regs before. if you dont know, then educate yourself. adamr you just want to stir the pot. i know where all my family comes from. the non indian and the indian. back to the 1500's. i know where i come from and where im headed. quit hatin and being jealous. get off this computer and do something about it. oh yeah im sure your an all talk kinda guy.
I'm not trying to stir the pot, you are the one who brought up your culture. I'm not saying it's wrong for you to hunt with advanced weapons and vehicles. What I'm saying is you can't bring up culture and the past, it's a whole different world now. I'm all for natives using whatever they want to hunt with they have that right, however, I don't believe the same rules should apply in a new playing field.
Don't worry about me getting off the computer and doing something about it, I've got my plan to bring native "culture" to public light. All talk kinda guy? We'll see pal...
Post by: igotbigbulls on January 02, 2012, 09:01:51 PM
and sled. get over it. and shut up about it.
Post by: Pinetar on January 02, 2012, 09:09:30 PM
If we all went out hunting OUR winter grounds in late December and January shooting OUR elk and deer I can guarantee you igotbigbulls grandchildren will have no reason to learn his ancestors way of subsistence hunting.
I'm sorry to hear that your town of Spearfish was flooded, which I'm pretty sure that it was your ancestors that lived there and not you yourself. Lets not use this logic to the sacrifice of OUR wildlife. I'm sure that your ancestors would not be pleased with this way of thinking.
igotbigbulls- THANKS for the link. I will read it and try and get educated towards your way of subsistence hunting.
Post by: buglebuster on January 02, 2012, 09:20:19 PM
Post by: igotbigbulls on January 02, 2012, 09:23:41 PM
You know what HairTrigger, I see where you are coming from now?? Neither of our ancestors used ATV, trucks or high powered rifles so does this make it right now that we can go ahead and decimate our elk and deer on their winter grounds throughout the entire winter? I get a 10 day season to hunt elk in late/early Oct. and November to shoot a spike elk and try to find a 3pt or better deer, this is working for the wildlife and has for 18 years, since the draw system was implemented. In fact our elk herds have gotten healthier because we sacrificed by hunting nothing but spikes and a shorter season. We didn't have all this tribal hunting out of Ellensburg till our bulls started getting bigger, now all of a sudden theirs tons of interest in killing off all the Big Bulls by the tribes.
If we all went out hunting OUR winter grounds in late December and January shooting OUR elk and deer I can guarantee you igotbigbulls grandchildren will have no reason to learn his ancestors way of subsistence hunting.
I'm sorry to hear that your town of Spearfish was flooded, which I'm pretty sure that it was your ancestors that lived there and not you yourself. Lets not use this logic to the sacrifice of OUR wildlife. I'm sure that your ancestors would not be pleased with this way of thinking.
igotbigbulls- THANKS for the link. I will read it and try and get educated towards your way of subsistence hunting.
but im positive they wouldnt want us giving up anymore than already has been. thats what the treaty accomplished. no more killing from either side and we ll give ya this area for your own to do as you please. and some more area that youve been used to hunting fishing and gathering on also keep doing what your doing. just no more killing.
Post by: sled on January 02, 2012, 09:40:15 PM
:dunno: :dunno: Dont get it. Who is they?, And I you know that changing a few things as far as wildlife harvest goes would only benfit the wildlife you claim you need. There is no reason in hell that one family needs more than one deer and one elk in a year.You know what HairTrigger, I see where you are coming from now?? Neither of our ancestors used ATV, trucks or high powered rifles so does this make it right now that we can go ahead and decimate our elk and deer on their winter grounds throughout the entire winter? I get a 10 day season to hunt elk in late/early Oct. and November to shoot a spike elk and try to find a 3pt or better deer, this is working for the wildlife and has for 18 years, since the draw system was implemented. In fact our elk herds have gotten healthier because we sacrificed by hunting nothing but spikes and a shorter season. We didn't have all this tribal hunting out of Ellensburg till our bulls started getting bigger, now all of a sudden theirs tons of interest in killing off all the Big Bulls by the tribes.
If we all went out hunting OUR winter grounds in late December and January shooting OUR elk and deer I can guarantee you igotbigbulls grandchildren will have no reason to learn his ancestors way of subsistence hunting.
I'm sorry to hear that your town of Spearfish was flooded, which I'm pretty sure that it was your ancestors that lived there and not you yourself. Lets not use this logic to the sacrifice of OUR wildlife. I'm sure that your ancestors would not be pleased with this way of thinking.
igotbigbulls- THANKS for the link. I will read it and try and get educated towards your way of subsistence hunting.
but im positive they wouldnt want us giving up anymore than already has been. thats what the treaty accomplished. no more killing from either side and we ll give ya this area for your own to do as you please. and some more area that youve been used to hunting fishing and gathering on also keep doing what your doing. just no more killing.
Post by: Ellensburg on January 02, 2012, 09:44:26 PM
Post by: greenhead_killer on January 02, 2012, 09:52:57 PM
Post by: Harborhunter on January 02, 2012, 10:03:30 PM
just because we use cars doesnt mean most of our cultural heritage is not still intact. we practice the same things weve been practicing for hundreds of years. stories, language, dance and singing is also a huge part of our culture that has been passed down. i wish more people understood reservation life. you can bring to light whatever you want. hopefully it does some good and the abusers will be punished more appropriately. but dont think that by trying to put tribal hunting in a bad light as a whole is going to accomplish much.
and sled. get over it. and shut up about it.
Bigbulls, having the abusers being punished properly is a big part about what this whole argument is about. It's like anything, the few always ruin it for the many. We know not all native hunters abuse their privileges, but the people who do are really starting to piss people off. Hunters who buy state licenses pay good money for them, and when observations like Ribka's happen obviously it is not going to sit too well. Tribal hunting as well as poaching by other people is putting a hurt on our animals and I doubt many people will deny that. I will also add that I have been trying to do my part and have been able to catch a poacher, so I am not another one of those people who will do nothing. Stupid people also piss me off too, so I see we have something in common. Lastly, do not give me crap about being uneducated until you maybe start capitalizing letters and using correct punctuation.
Post by: 270Shooter on January 02, 2012, 10:06:45 PM
Thats some subsistance hunting for you :tup:
Post by: greenhead_killer on January 02, 2012, 10:16:27 PM
I have not read all of the posts in this thread, so I do not know where this topic has gone but today I was on the reservation looking for ducks and as we passes a house (natives) there were skinned deer carcasses hanging from the tree in the yard, unfortunately it looked like the deer had been hanging for a very long time. We're talking like 2-3 weeks plus. I know some people hang their deer for a short time but this seemed ridiculous and there was no way they were going to be able to eat either of these deer.i think thats more of what we will see and have been seeing for some time...i think a few good apples and the rest bad is more the story these days....have yet to see anything to change my tune
Thats some subsistance hunting for you :tup:
Post by: Pinetar on January 02, 2012, 10:25:08 PM
give up your hunting rights and I don't want you to either. Nobody should ever mess with someones cultural heritage. This is one of the most important things that we have. However we could change our ways and times of our hunting without giving up much.
A lot of unforeseen things have changed that were not thought of when the treaty was written. When the treaty was written they had no clue that there would be huge cities and pavement around every corner which means less area for wildlife, they didn't know that we would have high powered rifles, atv's, pickup trucks, rangefinders, scopes and rifles that shoot 1000 yards. They had no idea that their would be so many people living on winter ranges and the backyards of our wildlife. They had no idea that their would be so many different kinds of issues that could jeopardize our wildlife.
I'm pretty sure that my ancestors and yours did their best to write and understand these treaties and they were very smart people but there was just no way that they could have been written back then to work for today. Just like our hunting and fishing regulations have to be changed and re-written every three years to continue to work. Example: If too many bulls get killed in the 340 Manastash unit over the last three years than they will give less permits over the next three years.
I don't pretend to know all the answers or solutions but we must all start very soon to come up with the answers or our grandkids are screwed.
If we continue to shoot elk and deer all winter long on our winter range it won't take long and we will decimate our wildlife and then we will not have much left to fight and argue about on our favorite hunting talk forum. lol
I'm not pointing fingers at you by any means as I do not even know you and I know not all native hunters abuse their privileges, but I have personally seen a lot of abuse in the last couple of years and it is very frustrating
have a good night
Post by: sled on January 02, 2012, 10:32:04 PM
just because we use cars doesnt mean most of our cultural heritage is not still intact. we practice the same things weve been practicing for hundreds of years. stories, language, dance and singing is also a huge part of our culture that has been passed down. i wish more people understood reservation life. you can bring to light whatever you want. hopefully it does some good and the abusers will be punished more appropriately. but dont think that by trying to put tribal hunting in a bad light as a whole is going to accomplish much.Ill shut up about it and get over it when the tribe members stop poaching!!! It might be legal for you, but as long as you take more than one deer, and elk a year I consider that poaching.
and sled. get over it. and shut up about it.
I am pretty sure the the federal gov would allow you to live off the reservation like everyone else now so dont cry about that life anymore.
This is a free country, times change, and everyone should have to live by the same laws. Why cant you accept that? It is a shame what happened many moons ago I agree, but come on man this is 2012.
Sing and dance all you want, but there are simply not enough resource to be overharvested Unethically anymore. understand that its not difficult!
Bigbulls, having the abusers being punished properly is a big part about what this whole argument is about. It's like anything, the few always ruin it for the many. We know not all native hunters abuse their privileges, but the people who do are really starting to piss people off. Hunters who buy state licenses pay good money for them, and when observations like Ribka's happen obviously it is not going to sit too well. Tribal hunting as well as poaching by other people is putting a hurt on our animals and I doubt many people will deny that. I will also add that I have been trying to do my part and have been able to catch a poacher, so I am not another one of those people who will do nothing. Stupid people also piss me off too, so I see we have something in common. Lastly, do not give me crap about being uneducated until you maybe start capitalizing letters and using correct punctuation.
Post by: HairTrigger on January 03, 2012, 02:37:58 AM
Post by: sled on January 03, 2012, 06:48:46 AM
Post by: igotbigbulls on January 03, 2012, 07:54:53 AM
Post by: PlateauNDN on January 03, 2012, 08:46:25 AM
I have not read all of the posts in this thread, so I do not know where this topic has gone but today I was on the reservation looking for ducks and as we passes a house (natives) there were skinned deer carcasses hanging from the tree in the yard, unfortunately it looked like the deer had been hanging for a very long time. We're talking like 2-3 weeks plus. I know some people hang their deer for a short time but this seemed ridiculous and there was no way they were going to be able to eat either of these deer.
Thats some subsistance hunting for you :tup:
You have a general area for this residence? If it's still in the state that you mentioned then it can be pursued for wastage. Also does anybody have any info. regarding these incidents? Pics, video, lic. plates or anything usable for possible violations?
Post by: coteyd on January 03, 2012, 09:46:33 AM
Post by: colockumelk on January 03, 2012, 11:21:40 AM
Pinetar I am sure you don't live where your ancestors lived an we do have regulations for fishing an hunting
The only regulation you have is that from January 1st to August 31st you can't harvest cows or does. UNLESS.... you get a special permit to do so from your tribal council for ceremonies etc. There are also some small areas that are closed off to protect deer and elk around the feed stations. Other than that you have no limits on how many animals you can harvest. I would not consider this effective or responsible game managment. :twocents:
I have said it a million times people. Get pictures. If this stuff is happening. We all know it is happening. It is not enough to just talk about it anymore. Pictures is what will solve the problem and bring some positive change. And do NOT under any circumstance get confrontational. No picture is worth getting in a fight and especially isn't worth getting killed over. :twocents: Whether its a gut pile, pictures of waste and abuse, video of it happening, pictures of tribal members hunting in the mountains, pictures of elk and deer in a truck etc. Anything and everything. Just talking about it isn't enough. We need pictures. Pictures show a pattern of conduct and events. This is what we need to bring light to this subject.
Unfortunately I think we could send and show the Yakamas a million pictures and they would not change. I think they will only change when they are put in the public spot light with pictures that are "not flattering". This is I think the only way that any real and positive changes will occur. Maybe I am wrong but history shows that I am right.
And the other thing I have said time and time again, tribes impose harvest restrictions and modern game management practises on its members and still keep their traditions alive. Most of the other tribes in America, and the Northwest somehow have managed to do this. So why cant the Yakamas. Also it is a SHARED resource. So why is the WDFW the ONLY ones supporting and doing anything to ensure the proper managment and continuation of our elk and deer? Why is it that the Yakamas think they should be able to sit back and do NOTHING to help out with our shared resource? People talk about the "fair share" doctrine. Well if we have to "share" in a "fair" way then shouldn't the Yakamas pay for half the mangement and conservation costs. If the Yakamas and the treaty etc says they have a right to HALF the animals then okay this should also mean they should pay HALF the cost of these animals. As it is they pay NOTHING :twocents:
Post by: Rainier10 on January 03, 2012, 11:52:20 AM
Post by: PlateauNDN on January 03, 2012, 11:53:55 AM
I say rock and hard place because what I do is not the popular opinion of most here on the Yakama Reservation. By speaking my mind in regards to the overharvesting of branched bulls and trophy bucks for the sole purporse of the size of the rack in my mind is a sport and should be treated as such. Not everybody shares my opinion when I say this because they always revert to the "sustenance clause" and I again rebuttal with, why not shoot a cow or doe then?
I hunt for sustenance first and foremost and to harvest more than one bull or buck a year in my mind is a waste. I find every scenario to apply to the situation and it doesn't always sink in or the message gets lost with being an "Uncle Tom" or taking the side of Non-Tribal Members. Which is not the case. I will stand and be heard whether people like it or not because that is "my right" and it may not be the popular thing to do but it is still the right thing to do regardless.
Here is the article from the Fall 2011 edition of Hunting the Rez Magazine.
"From the Editor
I am always humbled and in a state of awe by what is provided for us in the way of sustenance and experiences by our creator. As I reflect on what has transpired and the events over the last year, which marks on year of quarterly magazine issues, I’m reminded of the many great people of whom I’ve had the good fortune to cross paths. Two of the truly admirable individuals that we, at Hunting the Rez were privileged to meet and hunt with were Jim Kinsey and Jana Waller of Skull Bound TV.
Jim and Jana called in August to discuss coming to Indian Country to do an antelope hunt. As we talked about expectations and logistics, I couldn’t help but notice how content, fulfilled and genuinely happy the couple is while pursuing their adventures and living their dream. They have a deep respect for conservation and the balance of nature. As the hunt came to be and good friends were made, I began to question my own journey through life. I thought about things such as where I am going, what I am doing and what I hope to accomplish. These are tough questions that we all face at many different stages of our lives. I thought about things from different perspectives and was reminded that everything is God’s creation and we are just along for the ride. Native Americans through tradition and culture, are taught about the creation of all things and the ties we all share with Mother Earth, the spirits and the elements.
Balance and harmony must be attained in order for this natural state to remain. We must acknowledge Mother Earth and her delicate balance. We should always be asking ourselves “Are we doing right by her?” After some serious thought, I have to admit that at times, we are not.
I was recently given a reminder of how we need to be more thoughtful and respectful of Mother Earth and the Creator. First, a little history refresher to help you understand where I am coming from. Indian Nations lived in an environment, prior to European contact where hunting and fishing was vital to life. It was sacred as water. Our ancestors hunted and fished and harvest what was needed to survive, nothing was wasted. Today, hunting and fishing to survive is no longer needed. We can go to a crockery store and buy food at our leisure if we financially able to do so. Today, hunting has spiritual meaning and helps to keep ourselves in spiritual contact with God’s Creation. There is also the element of joy we derive from hunting as a sport. By partaking in the latter, are we neglecting or ignoring the balance of life? I think these types of question are in the back of our minds at times and we chose to ignore them. Whose responsibility is it to maintain this balance? We must listen to our environment, to Mother Earth. She Is talking to us, but not many people listen. Some of us who do listen for her cries for help are sometimes at a loss and don’t know what we can do to help her.
This came to me as I was attending a council meeting with the leaders of our Tribe.
The Fish and Game department wanted to host a coyote hunt to eradicate some of the predator problems that exist here in Rocky Boy. We were reminded by the Chairman before we make any such decision to burn sweet grass and ask for permission to do so. The role that the coyote plays is reenacted in one of our most important ceremonies and it is here where respect and permission are required. Again the balance of life is brought up. It seems at times that everything is so far out of balance that we might not be able to fix it. Maybe we are fooling ourselves into thinking that we can play a role in fixing some of these problems. Maybe Mother Nature will show us exactly who is in control. I believe that if we don’t pay attention to Mother Earth she will give us a reminder. As hunters, anglers and lovers of all things outdoors, let us be mindful and respectful of Mother Earth.
Jason Belcourt
Editor"
Post by: HairTrigger on January 03, 2012, 12:12:42 PM
Post by: colockumelk on January 03, 2012, 12:17:26 PM
Post by: 270Shooter on January 03, 2012, 01:32:42 PM
I have not read all of the posts in this thread, so I do not know where this topic has gone but today I was on the reservation looking for ducks and as we passes a house (natives) there were skinned deer carcasses hanging from the tree in the yard, unfortunately it looked like the deer had been hanging for a very long time. We're talking like 2-3 weeks plus. I know some people hang their deer for a short time but this seemed ridiculous and there was no way they were going to be able to eat either of these deer.I'll PM you
Thats some subsistance hunting for you :tup:
You have a general area for this residence? If it's still in the state that you mentioned then it can be pursued for wastage. Also does anybody have any info. regarding these incidents? Pics, video, lic. plates or anything usable for possible violations?
Post by: wazzu99 on January 05, 2012, 09:39:19 AM
Post by: PlateauNDN on January 05, 2012, 09:54:28 AM
Post by: buglebuster on January 05, 2012, 10:08:39 AM
I'm assuming they are entering from the chinook pass side? :dunno: That side does not have a gate and you can get all the way to the gates on the Wenas side IF you know where you're going. I'd say the road but that would be helping.They don't have to go that far out of the way I don't think. Observatory road is locked but Hanson pond road isn't. When you get clear up to the observatory there is another gate the sometimes is not shut. If it Is there Is pretty much a road around it through the trees.
Post by: wazzu99 on January 05, 2012, 02:42:25 PM
Another fantastic job by our game department..........
Post by: PlateauNDN on January 05, 2012, 03:02:25 PM
I'm assuming they are entering from the chinook pass side? :dunno: That side does not have a gate and you can get all the way to the gates on the Wenas side IF you know where you're going. I'd say the road but that would be helping.They don't have to go that far out of the way I don't think. Observatory road is locked but Hanson pond road isn't. When you get clear up to the observatory there is another gate the sometimes is not shut. If it Is there Is pretty much a road around it through the trees.
I don't know I've always assumed they closed all the gates that enter into the observatory beginning of December, learned something new today. I know the Audobon, Maloy and Observatory rd are always closed and I just assumed the rest were as well, but guess not. I've seen the road you're talking about and it was tore up pretty good when I went through there earlier this year during the opener.
Not worth getting a ticket for trespassing in my opinion so once the snow flies we stay out of that area.
Post by: biggdogg on January 05, 2012, 05:29:31 PM
Post by: biggdogg on January 05, 2012, 05:36:56 PM
Post by: colockumelk on January 05, 2012, 06:17:07 PM
Why would u get a trespassing ticket because there is a gate doesn't mean its private property every place talked about is not private property anyways
You're joking right :yike:
If there is a locked gate it means that it is closed to vehicular traffic. If you are caught behind the gate with a motorized vehicle you WILL get a ticket that you will have to pay. You can still walk behind it though.
Post by: 400out on January 05, 2012, 06:19:25 PM
I want to disagree with the thread I seen lots of bulls up there probably close to 20 bulls in two different trips and lots o true spikes not to many people up in that area not that I seen anyways:dunno: is this during the week season :dunno:
Post by: PlateauNDN on January 05, 2012, 06:39:40 PM
Why would u get a trespassing ticket because there is a gate doesn't mean its private property every place talked about is not private property anyways
You're joking right :yike:
If there is a locked gate it means that it is closed to vehicular traffic. If you are caught behind the gate with a motorized vehicle you WILL get a ticket that you will have to pay. You can still walk behind it though.
[/quote
No I'm not joking. Winter months I don't hunt and it turns into sightseeing for my family. Kids love seeing tje animals up close ALIVE. So when the gates close that means no driving around sightseeing in the area and to much gas to go up chinook and drive backwards. No walking in snow with my daughter who loves animals. I don't want a ticket for havinmg a vehicle behind a closed gate.
Post by: sled on January 05, 2012, 07:04:24 PM
Post by: colockumelk on January 05, 2012, 07:19:07 PM
To answer your question yes. You will get a ticket. My family does the same thing in the winter. Looks at animals. The WDFW to protect animals from poachers, tribal hunters and harassmemt from snowmobilers have closed a lot of roads so the animals don't get unnecessary pressure and stress when they are trying to survive the winter. If you see a road with a gate you can't drive behind it. Further more its a green dot area so if the road does not have a green dot sign then you can't drive behind it either. Same thing if caught you will get a ticket.
Post by: ribka on January 05, 2012, 07:31:16 PM
Elk and deer need to be left alone in their Wintering grounds!
Based upon personal observations if people cannot drive to areas they will not poach. Shame WDFW will not gate off areas in the Nile Wenas, Clockum, YTC, Manastash, Little Naches during Winter months. Imo
Post by: gasman on January 05, 2012, 07:37:02 PM
:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:
Not that I would condone such actions ;)
Post by: 3dsheetmetal on January 05, 2012, 07:38:22 PM
I wonder what people would think if a box of nails was spread in the area where people are driving around the gates :dunno::chuckle: :chuckle: :chuckle: :chuckle: :chuckle: :chuckle: :tup:
:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:
Not that I would condone such actions ;)
Post by: ribka on January 05, 2012, 07:54:36 PM
SImply not right that unlicensed people can drive into closed areas and take multiple bulls and bucks each year. If this continues then WDFW has to nix spike and 3 pt regs and return to branch antlered regs. As stated before all we are doing is creating a trophy class of easy pickings bulls and bucks for late season native hunters.( Mucks, Yaks, Nooks etc)
Not against native hunting but close and restrict harvest to foot traffic areas. :twocents:
Post by: gasman on January 05, 2012, 07:57:57 PM
I personally observed how much time,money and effort Gasman put into his Observatory tag this past year.
SImply not right that unlicensed people can drive into closed areas and take multiple bulls and bucks each year. If this continues then WDFW has to nix spike and 3 pt regs and return to branch antlered regs. As stated before all we are doing is creating a trophy class of easy pickings bulls and bucks for late season native hunters.( Mucks, Yaks, Nooks etc)
Not against native hunting but close and restrict harvest to foot traffic areas. :twocents:
And I did not see crap in that area too, once the season started :bash: :bash: :bash: :bash: :bash:
Post by: colockumelk on January 05, 2012, 09:24:33 PM
I personally observed how much time,money and effort Gasman put into his Observatory tag this past year.
SImply not right that unlicensed people can drive into closed areas and take multiple bulls and bucks each year. If this continues then WDFW has to nix spike and 3 pt regs and return to branch antlered regs. As stated before all we are doing is creating a trophy class of easy pickings bulls and bucks for late season native hunters.( Mucks, Yaks, Nooks etc)
Not against native hunting but close and restrict harvest to foot traffic areas. :twocents:
I agree. While during the any bull and any buck days the elk herd wasn't impressive as far as big trophy bulls went. There were enough that the herd was able to sustain itself. At least it would bring more equality to elk hunting in central Washington.
Post by: biggdogg on January 05, 2012, 09:47:39 PM
Post by: colockumelk on January 06, 2012, 08:16:02 AM
You are probably going to say well it is ceded land so why should I have to abide by these rules? Well the reason is you have a right to hunt fish and gather etc on the ceded land. But.... you have to still abide by all traffic laws and regulations. DNR and/or WDFW owns the land so they decide which roads are open and which ones are not. Does this help out. If not just explain what you are confused about and I will try my best to explain it.
Post by: biggdogg on January 06, 2012, 08:23:35 AM
Post by: colockumelk on January 06, 2012, 08:34:01 AM
I remember as a kid driving up with my family up in the Mud Lake area and the Wenas during the winter looking at elk and deer. But now all that is closed off because of stupid people. :bash: But I understand the road closures because its to help protect the deer and elk so I support them. Hope you can still get around and show your family some elk and deer.
Post by: jstone on January 06, 2012, 04:37:20 PM
Post by: STIKNSTRINGBOW on January 06, 2012, 06:29:07 PM
As a "white boy" i spent my summers in the small town of Suquamish, this is Reservation property.
My Grandmother was a cook at the local school, I played with all the kids in the area.
Bear in mind this was 30 years ago...
I was treated like someone who belonged, because my family lived there, I have cousins that still do, one owns a house on Agate Passage, another on Suquamish Way (305), 2 more in the "new" housing up off of Urban Ave NE, and other cousins spread out from Poulsbo to Bainbridge Island.
But enough of what my early childhood experience with Native Americans was, I have had several friends over the years , both Native and "non-Native", have never been prejudiced, but ANY TIME SOMEONE PLAYS THE "RACE CARD" it is a sign of ignorance, and racism, I do not care how you are arguing...
When the Suquamish go to the San Juan's to harvest Crabs, or the Muckleshoots go over the pass to harvest deer or Elk, or the Yakima travel to the Colockum, that is just (my opinion) ridiculous, because HISTORICALLY THEY ONLY TRAVELED THAT FAR BECAUSE THEY HAD HARVESTED EVERYTHING IN THEIR "LOCAL" AREA, AND HAD TO TRAVEL FURTHER BECAUSE THEY DID NOT HAVE ANY LEFT IN THEIR AREA !!!
Historically, the only respect that "Natives" had for anything that "Mother Earth, the spirits and the elements" had to provide, was to take, and be grateful, as that is what kept them from starvation, CONSERVATION WAS NOT IN THEIR VOCABULARY !!!!
They took what they could, when they could, because they believed it would always be there, if it was not, they blamed "Mother Earth, the spirits and the elements" , and attempted to figure out where they had displeased "Mother Earth, the spirits and the elements"
The common "belief" that
Quote
Our ancestors hunted and fished and harvest what was needed to survive, nothing was wasted.Is a crock of steaming :liar: because the only reason nothing was wasted is because their very survival depended on it, historically, they hunted and fished, harvested, etc, until nothing was left, then moved !!!
THAT IS THE REASON THEY DID NOT WANT TO MOVE TO A RESERVATION THEY DID NOT KNOW HOW TO CONSERVE !!!, they believed in taking what was available, then going somewhere else, they fought amongst themselves and other tribes for better areas, and limited resources.
.....................................
Now, Today, there are casinos, firework stands, and other opportunities for Tribal members to make a living, even special government grants and loans that I (as a caucasian American) am not eligible for.
"Natives" get to fish and hunt in all "free and unclaimed" lands they can, and a FEW take advantage of it, but you will never convince me of the "need", as they already should have some in storage (if they did not sell it)
I know that Tribal government has done several projects to benefit fish/wildlife (Columbia Sturgeon, Antelope re-introduction, fish counting at the locks, to name a few) but there will always be a few people of all races that feel entitled to take, without giving back, and it is these that we all need to stop, so TAKE PICTURES, REPORT OFFENDERS, and hope that eventually we will all be treated as American citizens, equal in the eyes of the law, no matter what our what our ethnic background.
............
Mine used to pull their ships up on the beach, kill, rape, pillage, and rob. But if I want to practice my "heritage", I go to jail....
Post by: STIKNSTRINGBOW on January 06, 2012, 06:51:49 PM
Quote
The tribes of the Pacific Northwest were only lightly visited by whites before the 1830s. When, for
commercial and scientific reasons, whites began assessing wildlife numbers in the area around Mount
Rainier, they expressed surprise to find that these numbers were quite low. Moreover, they were inclined
to attribute those low numbers to overhunting by tribes in the area. These early assessments seem also to
imply that overhunting was a relatively recent phenomenon, though they did not elaborate on that
implication or on its possible causes. Notable examples of these early assessments follow.
Johnson, who traveled across Naches Pass in 1841 as part of the Wilkes Expedition, described the
Yakima groups as follows:
This tribe subsist chiefly upon salmonid and the camass-root: game is very scarce and the beaver have all
disappeared (Johnson 1850).
Brackenridge, who accompanied Johnson, also commented on the shortage of game, not imagining how
productive the Yakima Valley could become under cultivation:
Our route still lay close upon the Eyakema which flows through one of the most barren countrys it has
ever been my lot to witness (Brackenridge 1931).
In 1844, Father M. Demers, writing generally on what he called "the Territory of the Columbia," was
apparently discussing Washington and Vancouver when he said that "Wild animals have been more
abundant than they are at present; elk, deer, caribou have become rare..." (Demers 1956).
Captain George B. McClellan of the Pacific Railroad Survey traveled up the Yakima Valley to Naches
Pass in 1853. He and his group explored at least some of the tributaries of the Yakima and made a
reasonable effort to examine the region. He reported his disappointment:
The country through which we passed to the east of the Cascade range may be described as generally
barren and unfit for agriculture, and poor for grazing purposes.
And, later in the same report:
The Indians are harmless and peaceable; with the exceptions of the Tekamas they are very poor. Their
food consists of salmon, berries, and potatoes; the entire absence of game renders it difficult for them to
obtain good clothing; during the whole trip I did not see a single deer, elk, or bear - nothing larger than a
wolf. Wolves, badgers, squirrels, and a few gray marmots, were the only quadrupeds. The blue and ruffed
grouse, prairie chickens, and sage-fowl abounded (McClellan 1855).
Post by: buglebuster on January 06, 2012, 08:08:47 PM
:peep: This thread is funny to read, all of you should sit back, take a moment or two to think about what this conversation is really about, and and realize that pointing fingers and blaming ANYONE is a ridiculous waste of time...Great post, I couldn't agree more. Awesome you hit the nail on the head with that one :tup:
As a "white boy" i spent my summers in the small town of Suquamish, this is Reservation property.
My Grandmother was a cook at the local school, I played with all the kids in the area.
Bear in mind this was 30 years ago...
I was treated like someone who belonged, because my family lived there, I have cousins that still do, one owns a house on Agate Passage, another on Suquamish Way (305), 2 more in the "new" housing up off of Urban Ave NE, and other cousins spread out from Poulsbo to Bainbridge Island.
But enough of what my early childhood experience with Native Americans was, I have had several friends over the years , both Native and "non-Native", have never been prejudiced, but ANY TIME SOMEONE PLAYS THE "RACE CARD" it is a sign of ignorance, and racism, I do not care how you are arguing...
When the Suquamish go to the San Juan's to harvest Crabs, or the Muckleshoots go over the pass to harvest deer or Elk, or the Yakima travel to the Colockum, that is just (my opinion) ridiculous, because HISTORICALLY THEY ONLY TRAVELED THAT FAR BECAUSE THEY HAD HARVESTED EVERYTHING IN THEIR "LOCAL" AREA, AND HAD TO TRAVEL FURTHER BECAUSE THEY DID NOT HAVE ANY LEFT IN THEIR AREA !!!
Historically, the only respect that "Natives" had for anything that "Mother Earth, the spirits and the elements" had to provide, was to take, and be grateful, as that is what kept them from starvation, CONSERVATION WAS NOT IN THEIR VOCABULARY !!!!
They took what they could, when they could, because they believed it would always be there, if it was not, they blamed "Mother Earth, the spirits and the elements" , and attempted to figure out where they had displeased "Mother Earth, the spirits and the elements"
The common "belief" thatQuoteOur ancestors hunted and fished and harvest what was needed to survive, nothing was wasted.Is a crock of steaming :liar: because the only reason nothing was wasted is because their very survival depended on it, historically, they hunted and fished, harvested, etc, until nothing was left, then moved !!!
THAT IS THE REASON THEY DID NOT WANT TO MOVE TO A RESERVATION THEY DID NOT KNOW HOW TO CONSERVE !!!, they believed in taking what was available, then going somewhere else, they fought amongst themselves and other tribes for better areas, and limited resources.
.....................................
Now, Today, there are casinos, firework stands, and other opportunities for Tribal members to make a living, even special government grants and loans that I (as a caucasian American) am not eligible for.
"Natives" get to fish and hunt in all "free and unclaimed" lands they can, and a FEW take advantage of it, but you will never convince me of the "need", as they already should have some in storage (if they did not sell it)
I know that Tribal government has done several projects to benefit fish/wildlife (Columbia Sturgeon, Antelope re-introduction, fish counting at the locks, to name a few) but there will always be a few people of all races that feel entitled to take, without giving back, and it is these that we all need to stop, so TAKE PICTURES, REPORT OFFENDERS, and hope that eventually we will all be treated as American citizens, equal in the eyes of the law, no matter what our what our ethnic background.
............
Mine used to pull their ships up on the beach, kill, rape, pillage, and rob. But if I want to practice my "heritage", I go to jail....
Post by: colockumelk on January 06, 2012, 08:10:17 PM
Post by: biggdogg on January 06, 2012, 09:22:18 PM
Post by: HairTrigger on January 06, 2012, 09:44:06 PM
Post by: sled on January 06, 2012, 10:03:00 PM
Post by: HairTrigger on January 07, 2012, 12:29:00 AM
I personally think the tribal hunters that are commenting on this post are a joke. Hairtrig. I dont understand why you pmd me when i asked about the tribal goat permit. Maybe you were embarrassed or didnt want anyone else to read. I do hope to find about more why there are reservation permits given out in a seperate drawing. Seems to me that should be one drawing for them reservation or not giving the low population numbers. Doesnt seem right. Again my opinion.Why does it matter it was a yakama permit you can't hunt tha closed area an he was shot an killed in the closed area embarrassed nothing I could have gone onto the ceeded area to harvest him but that was my choice. It doesn't hurt your guys chance at all. So why does it bother you so much? Don't get mad at us tribal members cause you've never been drawn. An the only joke is your hate. Don't like it don't read or comment on it move on to a different tread. Such as this one
Post by: sled on January 07, 2012, 01:14:15 AM
Post by: colockumelk on January 07, 2012, 08:23:30 AM
2. Yes the elk and deer were almost wiped out by the settlers. But we learned from our mistakes and did the right thing. Now its the Indians who are trying to wipe out the herds. Hopefully they learn from their mistakes quicker than we did.
3. I have no problem with reservation hunting. If they want to have an open season on goats and sheep on the reservation fine by me. Doesn't affect me at all. It's the off reservation hunting I care about.
4. Hairtrigger its not racial hate. You are so sensitive. Just because we disagree doesn't mean it has anything to do with racism. It's about conservation and equality. I think you are only trying to turn it into a racial issue so you can have something to debate. Because when it comes to equality and conservation you have nothing to debate with.
Post by: ribka on January 07, 2012, 08:53:57 AM
I think most law abiding hunters would not have a problem with tribal hunting if they were required to access hunting areas on foot like they have for generations.
And you can better honor and celebrate your tribal traditions by hunting on foot instead of shooting out of the window from a Toyota with a lift kit :tung:
Post by: longknife on January 07, 2012, 09:19:58 AM
i don't know about the hunting part but the fishing part is all bull*hit the non natives pretty much killed of all the salmon runs with dams and over fishing so dont tell me that that natives whiped out the fish runs and if i remember right were the indians the ones that wiped the elk herds and or did non natives. That post was all bull*hit and if u agree with your there is something wrong with u. an interesting piece of history if that's all clockum has to say about it something tells me even he can call bull*hit on that
With pics like this, no, i dont believe it, just PART of it. Who is labeling a race now!??? Your no better than anyone else, why should you have special privilages on PUBLIC LAND? thats all we want, equality on PUBLIC land!
(https://hunting-washington.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi965.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fae140%2Frugerdog1%2Fpreview_salmon_waste_002_Large.jpg&hash=02585594464b9bbe8fa2fa346b0aa945a8aeee39)
Post by: colockumelk on January 07, 2012, 09:58:20 AM
Post by: longknife on January 07, 2012, 10:09:58 AM
Do you have any more pictures? I will add them to my collection.
Not latley, but hot on the trail of a couple poachers!! Will send when i can confirm a person doing s@#t like this!
Post by: colockumelk on January 07, 2012, 10:46:43 AM
Post by: biggdogg on January 07, 2012, 12:23:43 PM
Post by: STIKNSTRINGBOW on January 07, 2012, 12:34:49 PM
That was an interesting piece of history. Where did you find it.From a different thread actually,... "A History of Native Elk in Mount Rainier National Park"
cannot remember thread,
Post by: biggdogg on January 07, 2012, 12:48:06 PM
Post by: colockumelk on January 07, 2012, 12:56:11 PM
Post by: biggdogg on January 07, 2012, 03:19:20 PM
Post by: longknife on January 07, 2012, 05:11:30 PM
lets keep the topic at hand so what does casinos have to do with hunting???? you still never answered my question about the fish pics. Just to let u know i tried and wasted enough time trying to deal with the bad apples i have no power to anything about it so i gave up on it,why don't u ask plateau ndn the same questions and see what kind of response u get back, and believe me the hunting on the rez is a lot harder than u think our elk r smart, and don't depend anybody to feed them in the winter( ours r not welfare elk) that's why so many yakamas hunt off rez most r not in my position and get to be in the mountains 5 to 7 days a week to work so advantage me i know where the animals r, and don't bs me about man kind took over their wintering grounds those elk were set up fail as soon as the first bail of hay was set out to feed them. Ethical tribal hunters don't bother me, some tribal hunters bother me
You dont need to know who in your heritage is wasting salmon, cuz you dont do it rite? Just turn the other way, like always.
Rebuilding pride with casino $, so you can buy the balls to report poaching EITHER WAY, white, black, brown, yellow it just takes a set of balls, or pride witch you lack. Love how your elk are soo smart, you cant shoot them!ROFLMAO :chuckle: :tup:
Why dont you speek to Plateau, and figure your s#@t out! I know what i see, and document, i dont need approval from you, or your elders.
Post by: biggdogg on January 07, 2012, 06:31:26 PM
Post by: PlateauNDN on January 07, 2012, 06:40:12 PM
Post by: HairTrigger on January 07, 2012, 06:42:26 PM
I agree biggdogg. I enjoy seeing pictures taken on the rez because its places I can't go. I enjoy reading hairtriggers posts and stories. I wish more of you would post them up but I understand why you don't. And yes as far as the colockum abusers go I know what family does it. I also agree I want pictures not just words. Good post biggdogg.Every post ive put up has at least one that hates on it
And colock where did I say anything about racial in my last post
An its not just yakamas that fish on the columbia that coulda been some other tribal members that dumped that im not saying its right.at all just theres more tribes that fish it too
I agree with.biggdogg on that one they shouldnt be able.to fish anymore
Post by: longknife on January 07, 2012, 07:10:14 PM
All I was asking was yakama or not u need to take a chill pill I never disrespected u but if u want to keep disrespecting me I can give u my address and u can come talk to me face to face I'm not fond of shi* talking behind a computer oh I can aso show a horn collection of my rez kills lt me pull the race card u sound more racist then anybody on here
I am not afraid to face you! WOW did i strike a neurve! You cant tell me theres not s$#t in every race??? You can call it the way you want to. What did you forget the other half of the USA thats ethnic background isnt Whities or indian ? All i stated is i DONT CARE WHAT RACE, i WILL turn them in!
The horn collection, dose the set of horns from the rez laugh at the ones off public land??LOL You are the first to tell me this, and i cant stop laughing. Your basicly saying, the elk are too hard to hunt here, i need to go there, next to the alfalfa, and kill them. :tup:
All i asked was equality on public land! Whats hard about that? You cant comment on that, in the last 4 posts i made?
:stirthepot: :stirthepot: til you see the bottom line!
Post by: huntinguy on January 07, 2012, 07:33:26 PM
It is important to note that in the 30's hunting groups brought in elk from Wyoming (iirc) and restarted or supplemented the Ellensburg area and Olympic peninsula.
I do not disagree with tribal rights, though I may wish to, but I think, like all of us, we ALL need to be self policing and limit some activities.
It would be nice if the tribal hunters did not hunt in the refuge areas. That is not a case of anything other than wildlife conservation.
Early Indians as well as white hunters killed a lot of game for profit. I read where one lone Indian hunter in the early 1800s sold over 300 deer hides and others hides as well. (There is a lot of good reading in old books. )
But, where we are now is in the 21st century and we live longer. Hence, there are less resources. The question is how to share them.
The answer will not come into fruition or even have a seminal moment unless we can all realize we ALL hunt for sport at this point in history.
So, instead of pointing fingers, maybe instead of a Tribal Hunting thread there should be a Shared Solution thread.
One can't put their shoulder to the wheel if there is a chip on it.
:peep:
Post by: colockumelk on January 07, 2012, 07:35:13 PM
1. Yes casinos are a little off the topic. And I agree with biggdogg that the rez elk are harder to get. I believe what he was referring to is the fact that the reason a lot of tribal hunters hunt the ceded land is because in the winter they are congregated all down low in the winter ground and near roads. Therefore its a lot easier there than on the rez that does not have a feed station network to congregate the elk and deer. Not as many roads and they are not congregated.
2. Wellfare elk. That's pretty funny good one. :chuckle: so true.
3. Biggdogg I applaud your efforts in trying to change things. I ask that you continue to try to make a change. Maybe join with Plateau since two people have a stronger voice than just one. I know we have had our differences in the past but your recent posts on this subject have been pretty good. I agree good job.
4. Hairtrigger I think it was a broad statement. But you have pulled the race card on me a few times.
5. I don't think the Yakima valley was a sportsmans paradise, but I also don't think it was devoid of biggame. If you think of how arid it is, it really isn't suitable for alot of game animals. I expect there was more game in the winter than the summer. I think the explorers describe it as devoid because compared to where they just came from in their travels to get to the Yakima valley it probably was. In Amy case if there were wolves cougars and bears in the area it definately wasn't a sportsmans paradise. I would have a #6 but Coastal and Plateau can't count that high so theyd get lost, plus I'm sure their attention span ran out ny #3 :chuckle:
Post by: sled on January 07, 2012, 07:55:05 PM
Post by: longknife on January 07, 2012, 08:01:14 PM
So i posted a pic from past events, of what i see on a yearly bassis on the Stilliguamish. The piles of fish rotting dosent save the runs, theres more down stream of you, that you dont see, from tribes wasting! I will let you see it, and get some better pics with people, and plate #'s.
Still cant get over how elk are too smart, and you cant adapt, and overcome, just like we have had to!
Post by: sled on January 07, 2012, 08:11:36 PM
Post by: biggdogg on January 07, 2012, 08:17:32 PM
Post by: biggdogg on January 07, 2012, 08:19:29 PM
Post by: biggdogg on January 07, 2012, 08:20:54 PM
Post by: biggdogg on January 07, 2012, 08:24:38 PM
Post by: sled on January 07, 2012, 08:27:46 PM
Post by: biggdogg on January 07, 2012, 08:32:28 PM
Post by: longknife on January 07, 2012, 08:33:54 PM
i don't know about the hunting part but the fishing part is all bull*hit the non natives pretty much killed of all the salmon runs with dams and over fishing so dont tell me that that natives whiped out the fish runs and if i remember right were the indians the ones that wiped the elk herds and or did non natives. That post was all bull*hit and if u agree with your there is something wrong with u. an interesting piece of history if that's all clockum has to say about it something tells me even he can call bull*hit on that
Well if it dosent mean anything to you, why start to turn other directions on a thread? Its what you posted! Should you post in fishing sections?? If your elk are smarter everyday of the week, what happens when they get too smart, dose their head explode? fall over, and loose their backstraps? I bet the meat tastes smarter! but you probly wouldnt understand.
Post by: biggdogg on January 07, 2012, 08:35:44 PM
Post by: biggdogg on January 07, 2012, 08:37:23 PM
Post by: sled on January 07, 2012, 08:40:09 PM
Post by: longknife on January 07, 2012, 08:40:32 PM
So, really there is no reason to hunt off reservation land, thanks for making my point!
Post by: biggdogg on January 07, 2012, 08:42:03 PM
Post by: longknife on January 07, 2012, 08:45:18 PM
Post by: Skyvalhunter on January 07, 2012, 08:48:27 PM
Post by: biggdogg on January 07, 2012, 08:50:05 PM
Post by: biggdogg on January 07, 2012, 08:55:01 PM
Post by: biggdogg on January 07, 2012, 08:56:32 PM
Post by: longknife on January 07, 2012, 08:58:30 PM
i don't know about the hunting part but the fishing part is all bull*hit the non natives pretty much killed of all the salmon runs with dams and over fishing so dont tell me that that natives whiped out the fish runs and if i remember right were the indians the ones that wiped the elk herds and or did non natives. That post was all bull*hit and if u agree with your there is something wrong with u. an interesting piece of history if that's all clockum has to say about it something tells me even he can call bull*hit on that
Well if it dosent mean anything to you, why start to turn other directions on a thread? Its what you posted! Should you post in fishing sections?? If your elk are smarter everyday of the week, what happens when they get too smart, dose their head explode? fall over, and loose their backstraps? I bet the meat tastes smarter! but you probly wouldnt understand.
Love it! cant coment on what you posted!
Post by: colockumelk on January 07, 2012, 09:48:38 PM
and believe me the hunting on the rez is a lot harder than u think our elk r smart, and don't depend anybody to feed them in the winter( ours r not welfare elk) that's why so many yakamas hunt off rez
So this is the real reason Plateau does his hunting off the rez. Ha ha I knew it. :chuckle:
Post by: HairTrigger on January 07, 2012, 10:36:15 PM
Post by: HairTrigger on January 07, 2012, 11:02:08 PM
Sorry bud but the only hate here is the harvesting issues. But ia am done! Nothing more to say here. :tup:Takr your own advice bud lol
Post by: Limhangerslayer on January 07, 2012, 11:16:08 PM
Post by: sled on January 07, 2012, 11:37:07 PM
i decided that since i know im right im not going to let you ramble on about nonsense bs with out correcting you!Sorry bud but the only hate here is the harvesting issues. But ia am done! Nothing more to say here. :tup:Takr your own advice bud lol
Post by: HairTrigger on January 07, 2012, 11:38:46 PM
Post by: sled on January 07, 2012, 11:49:50 PM
:bdid:oooo. Oh no. Know i did it. Somthing bad is comming.
We will all wait for it!
Post by: biggdogg on January 08, 2012, 12:01:47 AM
Post by: sled on January 08, 2012, 12:23:17 AM
Sled get a life come on man show us pics of your spikes so we can see some non indian ignorance there u go there is the face of ignorancewow. Never fails. Refering back to races. Don't know why you need to do that.
I will check to see if i have a pic for you though. If tha will make you happy. I guess if i had shot many branched antler animals i would be throwing them up too.
Post by: HairTrigger on January 08, 2012, 12:43:28 AM
Post by: sled on January 08, 2012, 12:49:22 AM
Damn that must be nice for you to do that here. I think you should try to rub that in, and try to justify it a little bit more.
Don't worry you can't. Make yourself look any worse. By the way i wasn't the one that called you on blacking out your faces, but anyway to play your game and make you feel better here you go.