Wolf attacks Dog in Twisp, Wa.

[snowpack]

So why not drop a pair into Magnuson Park?  Pretty straight forward, because it would be to dangerous to the local population and their pets.  So why isn't the same consideration afforded to the folks in rural areas?

This guy from the west side says relocate a bunch to the west side and bring this thing to a head.

Let Farmageddon begin you say?  Won't be any livestock/pets left on the wetside either. 

[bearpaw]

Part of the wolf agreement and the promise from the wolf lovers is that livestock damage would be compensated. 

Livestock I can understand. Pets, not so much. Who's paying for this anyway? The wolf lovers? Or the taxpayers?

I don't remember if the promise included pets, but I feel it should.

Wolf lovers have fooled the agencies and the taxpayers, as soon as the wolves were established in the other states the taxpayers have been stiffed. Ya, I don't like it either but I expect the same here, I forgot that part in the wolf fairy tale. 

Grizzly Bears
I don't think there were pronises made about grizzlies like there was for wolves, like comparing apples to oranges!

[bobcat]

Wolf lovers have fooled the agencies and the taxpayers, as soon as the wolves were established in the other states the taxpayers have been stiffed. Ya, I don't like it either but I expect the same here, I forgot that part in the wolf fairy btale. 

Well I don't feel taxpayers should be liable for any of it. I never made any promises to anybody that I and the other taxpayers would compensate them for any losses.

If the wolf loving organizations want to pay for it, more power to 'em!   

[hirshey]

I really hope that part about the WDFW is untrue.  Maybe they just asked to make sure and someone is making it into something it's not?  I hope that's the case.

They assured  me the wolves prey testing me in the Lake Chelan Rec Area were coyotes until I provided photos.  It's that whole "guilty until proven innocent" thing except "any other predator until confirmed a wolf". 

[MtnMuley]

I really hope that part about the WDFW is untrue.  Maybe they just asked to make sure and someone is making it into something it's not?  I hope that's the case.

They assured  me the wolves prey testing me in the Lake Chelan Rec Area were coyotes until I provided photos.  It's that whole "guilty until proven innocent" thing except "any other predator until confirmed a wolf". 

I never saw your wolf photos posted on here.  If there is a link, please post it.  Heard they were in the Eastman's issue, but don't subscribe anymore.  Thanks.

[hirshey]

- There's enough wolves in WA to delist, people could protect themselves and animals if we had an agency that would confirm existing wolves.

Regarding the bolded part of what was said here...  is it illegal for people to protect themselves and/or their animals from wolves?  Would the guy in the story be in trouble if he had shot the wolf?

big time

So if I'm on my own property, fully fenced, and a wolf shows up and attacks me, I can't legally shoot it?

I was told unless I had bite marks ON me it's a good thing I didn't shoot the wolves that accosted me because I could have been in a world of legal trouble.  So from personal accounts, no.

[hirshey]

Ask Hirshey on here if she thinks wolves act like cougar or bear. I can't speak for her and won't try, but anyone who knows about her incident can guess what she might say.

They absolutely do not follow the same rules as other predators. When you have them at 15-20 yards charging you and trying to get at your side/back it is quite frustrating, especially when you feel like your world will change dramatically regardless of your action... if you shoot them, you have two choices: walk away and never tell anyone. OR take photos, hike out immediately, and hope that you aren't sued and hate mailed into oblivion.. If you don't shoot them, you either end up injured or killed if you can't prove you aren't to be eaten.

Bear and cougar (I've seen both and know they've seen me tenfold) have never acted like this towards me.

[smdave]

I am told it is from the front page of todays Omak Chronicle.
http://www.omakchronicle.com/news/frontnewspopup.shtml

[bearpaw]

Wolf lovers have fooled the agencies and the taxpayers, as soon as the wolves were established in the other states the taxpayers have been stiffed. Ya, I don't like it either but I expect the same here, I forgot that part in the wolf fairy btale. 

Well I don't feel taxpayers should be liable for any of it. I never made any promises to anybody that I and the other taxpayers would compensate them for any losses.

If the wolf loving organizations want to pay for it, more power to 'em!   

Hey I feel the same way about not wanting to foot the bill, but you and I and everybody reading this is already paying for wolves. 

[hirshey]

Wolf numbers have not yet reached what the plan calls for, not even close.

So I'd expect for these types of issues to get much worse as time goes on. This is only the beginning.

I certainly agree with the latter part of this statement. As for the wolf numbers... they are highly underestimated/confirmed.

If a plain jane like myself and her significant other can go out and have ... 4 wolf pack sightings in the last 2 years ranging from the Blues to the Sawtooths... with at least 2 unaccounted packs, there's a lot more out there than the state knows about or is willing to release information on. Most likely a combination of the two.

I've seen wolves 30 miles apart up the Methow this winter...  days apart. Still just the lookout pack? *rolls eyes*. Texas Creek, Gold Creek, Golden Doe, Finley Canyon. Two sides of the highway.

[hirshey]

Maybe I should ask, do you think the state can AFFORD to compensate every single person who has any kind of wildlife damage done to their property?

I don't. Whether it's elk, deer, bears, cougars, or wolves. People need to take care if themselves and not rely on the government for everything.

That's the thing.. if they aren't liable for the damages, the realized cost of having wolves in the state lies on the people that most likely don't want them there in the first place.. Can't afford to pay out? Open a hunting season! You're putting the burden on those that would prefer to manage the numbers by hunting. Since hunting isn't allowed, the burden should be placed on those that are restricting the ability to manage numbers and problem animals. 

[saylean]

Maybe it was a bobcat? 

what a crock.

[wolfbait]

The Methow Valley has had several dogs/livestock killed or mangled by WDFW's wolves in the last seven years, WDFW either ignore them or BS their way around them

  In 2009 when WDFW bought the rest of the Golden Doe ranch, the first thing they did was release wolves on it. And the first thing their wolves did was kill a cow and a calf. WDFW and the USFWS ran to the local paper and said:

“By the time we got to the carcass it was too old for me to say yay or nay if it was killed by a wolf,” said Scott Fitkin, wildlife biologist with the Washington Department of Fish and Wildlife. “It was clearly fed on by something, but not much was left but a lot of maggots.” Fitkin and a USDA Wildlife Services agent inspected the carcass on Friday (May 22).
http://www.conservationnw.org/pressroom/press-clips/proof-of-wolf-kill-may-elude-investigators

When experts examined the decomposing cow May 22, it had been so worked over by scavengers that there was little left but hide and hip bones.

Even so, "there was nothing about the carcass to indicate that wolves had anything to do with it," said Doug Zimmer, a spokesman for the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service.

http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/localnews/2009307261_wolves06m.html


As many of you can see there was more to the cow story then WDFW and the USFWS wanted the public to know. And where is the calf, where was it mentioned when WDFW and the USFWS ran to the local paper?






The summer of 2009 was a very bad year for wolves in the Methow Valley, we had them go through our yard and fields all summer long, WDFW's new wolves were even see at the Meat Market in Twisp, heading down to the dumpsters behind Hanks Market. A new mother pushing her baby down the Twisp/Carlton road was followed by three wolves until she came to a house she could enter,  another lady in Twisp took a picture of a wolf standing in her yard, these sighting were in broad daylight. All were ignored by WDFW

Carlton resident says wolves killed chickens-Date: 08-12-2009 
State wildlife biologist Scott Fitkin is skeptical that the predator was a wolf.

“The fact that the animal appeared unafraid, I’m more skeptical that it was a wolf,” said Fitkin. “The fact that she went out and yelled and banged things, it’s not characteristic of wolves, who seem skittish. We’ve not ruled out it being a wolf,” he said. “We have no evidence except her eyewitness, but we are looking for more information.”
http://www.methowvalleynews.com/story.php?id=1878
Ask WDFW why several of them were parked along the county road by the Golden Doe access road with binoculars out watching their newly released wolves run across the hillside.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Funny how WDFW and Conservation NW always make sure the statement that their "wolves migrated to WA on their own" is in every article they publish.

Last fall on the Loup pass two wolves were hit and killed, so according to WDFW's wolf count the Methow should be wolf free.

On the other hand we have had wolves around our place for the last two weeks, we had them within a few hundred yards of our house just last night, and we aren't the only ones. I talk to some folks from church last sunday, one from Libby Cr. said she had wolves howling on one side of the canyon and coyotes on the other. Another one from above Beaver Cr. said they have been hearing wolves practically every night. I have talk to people below Mazama who say the same thing, plus they saw wolves this winter. The lie that there is only one maybe two wolves in the Methow has always been just another lie. WDFW  have refuse to confirm known wolf packs in the Methow Valley for several years now, every wolf seen they claim is part of the Lookout Pack even if the sightings of wolves were on the same day twenty miles apart..

The problem that WDFW has now is, their wolves are starting to eat their way out of natural prey and into pets, livestock and the public eye. As more of this happens WDFW will be forced to leap to their feet in surprise, just like IDFG finally did with their wolf slaughtered elk herds.

 Aren't WDFW suppose to be wildlife managers? If WDFW were managing game animals there wouldn't be the predation problems we are having today. We wouldn't have to worry about our children playing in the backyard or going for hikes in the surrounding countryside like I did as a kid. We wouldn't hear WDFW telling us to lock our dogs up at night to avoid cougars and wolves killing them, and our game herds wouldn't be disappearing at an alarming rate. WDFW needs an overhaul, replace those who are in the pockets of the environmentalist with people who care about all wildlife not just protecting predators.

  Dale, Thanks for writing a letter to WDFW,  Good Job!

[bobcat]

Maybe I should ask, do you think the state can AFFORD to compensate every single person who has any kind of wildlife damage done to their property?

I don't. Whether it's elk, deer, bears, cougars, or wolves. People need to take care if themselves and not rely on the government for everything.

That's the thing.. if they aren't liable for the damages, the realized cost of having wolves in the state lies on the people that most likely don't want them there in the first place.. Can't afford to pay out? Open a hunting season! You're putting the burden on those that would prefer to manage the numbers by hunting. Since hunting isn't allowed, the burden should be placed on those that are restricting the ability to manage numbers and problem animals. 

Even with hunting, there will be problems. They're being hunted in Idaho now, correct? Have wolves stopped killing livestock and pets since the wolf season opened?

You say the burden should be placed on those who are restricting the ability to manage wolves.... so how do we identify who those particular individuals are? And if that's possible, do we then take deductions out of those people's paychecks and place it into a "wolf victim" fund?

Just wondering how all those in favor of wolves are going to be required to pay, while all of us who don't want wolves don't have to pay.

[hirshey]

I really hope that part about the WDFW is untrue.  Maybe they just asked to make sure and someone is making it into something it's not?  I hope that's the case.

They assured  me the wolves prey testing me in the Lake Chelan Rec Area were coyotes until I provided photos.  It's that whole "guilty until proven innocent" thing except "any other predator until confirmed a wolf". 

I never saw your wolf photos posted on here.  If there is a link, please post it.  Heard they were in the Eastman's issue, but don't subscribe anymore.  Thanks.

The majority of the account is on page 6 of the wolf sightings topic. Photo of one of the animals (didn't get both in spotting scope photo)
For some reason it doesn't appear that my photo links are working anymore.