Wolves do affect business

[Sitka_Blacktail]

There is no correlation between the success rates depicted in the chart and overall Elk population either.

No direct correlation. Not an animal to animal correlation. But how many times has it been argued here that lack of success is costing Idaho and other states hunters? So what is more important, how many elk Idaho has, or how many get harvested each year.  I'd say as long as you can maintain it, harvest numbers are more important than total numbers. But that's just me.

Doesn't do you any good to have the woods full of animals if you can't harvest them.

[bearpaw]

There is no correlation between the success rates depicted in the chart and overall Elk population either.

No direct correlation. Not an animal to animal correlation. But how many times has it been argued here that lack of success is costing Idaho and other states hunters? So what is more important, how many elk Idaho has, or how many get harvested each year.  I'd say as long as you can maintain it, harvest numbers are more important than total numbers. But that's just me.

Doesn't do you any good to have the woods full of animals if you can't harvest them.

Pretty simple math for me, if you have 50,000 cows that calf, with a 40% survival you probably add 20,000 calves to the elk population. Hunters can probably take 15,000 or more elk each year.

If that same elk population is reduced by wolves to 20,000 cows calving, and wolves are holding the calf survival down to 10%, then you only add 2,000 calves to the population. If hunters continue to take 15,000 or more elk each year the math isn't going to work very long. 

[KFhunter]

Recess is over, it's time to take your seat.

 

bout time for me to hit the sack

[idahohuntr]

KF- The graph I posted is from the IDFG elk management plan...the same plan/source data bearpaw is posting on recent harvest and population trends.  But thats nice you can draw 

I do believe the long-term trends in any population data, whether its yellowstone or Lolo or Idaho as a whole gives a better sense of some of the points many folks try to make on these forums: elk numbers are dynamic and lots of factors contribute to those changes.  I think we all generally agree on that    It is misleading to think that wolves aren't holding down elk numbers in specific units...it it equally misleading to think that elk numbers will rebound anywhere close to 1980s levels in the Lolo if we just get rid of/or significantly reduce wolves and other predators.

[JLS]

it it equally misleading to think that elk numbers will rebound anywhere close to 1980s levels in the Lolo if we just get rid of/or significantly reduce wolves and other predators.

Burn it to the ground and you might see some significant rebound.

[bearpaw]

KF- The graph I posted is from the IDFG elk management plan...the same plan/source data bearpaw is posting on recent harvest and population trends.  But thats nice you can draw 

I do believe the long-term trends in any population data, whether its yellowstone or Lolo or Idaho as a whole gives a better sense of some of the points many folks try to make on these forums: elk numbers are dynamic and lots of factors contribute to those changes.  I think we all generally agree on that    It is misleading to think that wolves aren't holding down elk numbers in specific units...it it equally misleading to think that elk numbers will rebound anywhere close to 1980s levels in the Lolo if we just get rid of/or significantly reduce wolves and other predators.

It's in the Idaho plan to reduce wolves and improve habitat, can't agree more, but the wolves must be reduced too. 

FYI - We have the same problem in NE WA, over aged forests due to hugger control of our USFS. We need logging and wolf reduction. Why burn it when locals need employment?

[idahohuntr]

it it equally misleading to think that elk numbers will rebound anywhere close to 1980s levels in the Lolo if we just get rid of/or significantly reduce wolves and other predators.

Burn it to the ground and you might see some significant rebound.

 
One of these days I'm going to go hand out fireworks and cases of beer to the camps I encounter when I'm up flyfishing on kelly cr.