2pt minimum

[JPhelps]

So there is a bunch of us on the same page.  How many of you have contacted the wdfw and let them know how you feel?  Nothing will get done unless they know we support the changes. I've been emailing them for several years asking for these exact changes.  Granted nothing has been done, but I still send emails.  If more people do the same I think they might make some changes that help get the blacktail herds heading in the right direction.  I know I received no negative impact by emailing them.  So hit em up....

The reply I got regarding two point or better restriction was "they have this in some other units and it has shown no increase in mature bucks".  HA!  I may not have a degree in wildlife biology but I don't believe them.

Regarding Doe harvest their response is "the harvest of does is necessary for balance of the herd".  Once again a canned answer that I have a hard time believing is founded on any science or population model.

Until the WDFW manages the wildlife without the goal of maximum profit we will continue to get bogus regulations, special permits and non-sense science shoved down our throats.

[billythekidrock]

I would never vote for a 2pt min on BTs, unless it was modern only and Srs/handicap/youth could still shoot spikes.

It would only work the first year and then it would be the same ol' same ol'. People complaining about no big bucks, only with a few more spikes running around.

[BENCHLEG]

i like what your saying polar bear.. 3pt all the way except for youths

[JPhelps]

I would never vote for a 2pt min on BTs, unless it was modern only and Srs/handicap/youth could still shoot spikes.

It would only work the first year and then it would be the same ol' same ol'. People complaining about no big bucks, only with a few more spikes running around.

BTKR,
Do you care to elaborate?  I'm interested in hearing everyone's opinion.

[kentrek]

The reply I got regarding two point or better restriction was "they have this in some other units and it has shown no increase in mature bucks".  HA!  I may not have a degree in wildlife biology but I don't believe them.

Until the WDFW manages the wildlife without the goal of maximum profit.

wouldn't WDFW make more money with a limited permit type system ? how would they make less money if people couldn't shoot spikes/does ? if what all of you are saying is correct wouldn't WDFW realize that, and know more people would want to hunt due to the fact there is more opportunity thus making them more money ??

just some thoughts...no harm intended

 i agree they are trying to maximize profit in every way possible but that would also mean they would want to maximize the deer herd as well 

[Whitpirate]

PS: that "you can't eat the horns" quote makes me sick. But if all you spike killers are truly proud of yourself for killing a deer that's dumber than a bag of skittles, to each his own. lol

I could have done without this comment, now you are putting yourself on a pedestal. The last thing we need to do is divide and judge our fellow hunters. We need to respect each others opinions and stay united to fight the anti's and preserve our rights. Saying the a meat hunters opinion makes you sick is extremely offensive to me and a lot of other fellow hunters. Respect is the key to good discussion, which this thread had up to that point.

    I'm with ya Ripper.

[bobcat]

I would never vote for a 2pt min on BTs, unless it was modern only and Srs/handicap/youth could still shoot spikes.

It would only work the first year and then it would be the same ol' same ol'. People complaining about no big bucks, only with a few more spikes running around.

I could go either way on the 2 point minimum, but I'm positive if we eliminated ALL doe harvest, the blacktail deer population would increase.

[JPhelps]

The reply I got regarding two point or better restriction was "they have this in some other units and it has shown no increase in mature bucks".  HA!  I may not have a degree in wildlife biology but I don't believe them.

Until the WDFW manages the wildlife without the goal of maximum profit.

wouldn't WDFW make more money with a limited permit type system ? how would they make less money if people couldn't shoot spikes/does ? if what all of you are saying is correct wouldn't WDFW realize that, and know more people would want to hunt due to the fact there is more opportunity thus making them more money ??

just some thoughts...no harm intended

 i agree they are trying to maximize profit in every way possible but that would also mean they would want to maximize the deer herd as well 

Maybe they feel that they would lose more hunters than the money they would make off the permits?  I honestly don't know.

[deerslyr]

I would never vote for a 2pt min on BTs, unless it was modern only and Srs/handicap/youth could still shoot spikes.

It would only work the first year and then it would be the same ol' same ol'. People complaining about no big bucks, only with a few more spikes running around.

I could go either way on the 2 point minimum, but I'm positive if we eliminated ALL doe harvest, the blacktail deer population would increase.

I completely agree, i dont think APRs will increase pop at all. Eliminating doe harvest would.

[JPhelps]

I would never vote for a 2pt min on BTs, unless it was modern only and Srs/handicap/youth could still shoot spikes.

It would only work the first year and then it would be the same ol' same ol'. People complaining about no big bucks, only with a few more spikes running around.

I could go either way on the 2 point minimum, but I'm positive if we eliminated ALL doe harvest, the blacktail deer population would increase.

I completely agree, i dont think APRs will increase pop at all. Eliminating doe harvest would.

How not?  If you allow all the spikes that get killed every year a free pass, the population WILL increase.

[deerslyr]

I would never vote for a 2pt min on BTs, unless it was modern only and Srs/handicap/youth could still shoot spikes.

It would only work the first year and then it would be the same ol' same ol'. People complaining about no big bucks, only with a few more spikes running around.

I could go either way on the 2 point minimum, but I'm positive if we eliminated ALL doe harvest, the blacktail deer population would increase.

I completely agree, i dont think APRs will increase pop at all. Eliminating doe harvest would.

How not?  If you allow all the spikes that get killed every year a free pass, the population WILL increase.

No, they will just get killed as 2 points. Just like the stat some one posted early, 27% of the harvest are spikes and 40% are 2 points, putting the theory that a 2 point is smarter than a spike, to rest.

[Jonathan_S]

Phelps, seems like if you were to eliminate spike harvest, doe harvest should be lowered to prevent a ratio imbalance?

[JPhelps]

I would never vote for a 2pt min on BTs, unless it was modern only and Srs/handicap/youth could still shoot spikes.

It would only work the first year and then it would be the same ol' same ol'. People complaining about no big bucks, only with a few more spikes running around.

I could go either way on the 2 point minimum, but I'm positive if we eliminated ALL doe harvest, the blacktail deer population would increase.

I completely agree, i dont think APRs will increase pop at all. Eliminating doe harvest would.

How not?  If you allow all the spikes that get killed every year a free pass, the population WILL increase.

No, they will just get killed as 2 points. Just like the stat some one posted early, 27% of the harvest are spikes and 40% are 2 points, putting the theory that a 2 point is smarter than a spike, to rest.

I disagree!  Every spike that makes it to a 2 point will not be killed, but every spike that is killed as a spike is killed.  Once again that equals a population increase.

[deerslyr]

Well agree to disagree. Ive hunted a handful of 2 pt. min areas and typically notice less or the same amount of animals. My experience has mostly been in the mashel. Ive hunted 654, 667, and 652 my entire life and never noticed much of an increase in trophy quality in 654 either. Definitely less deer in 654 than 667 though and im sure most will agree. 

[Bootfish]

Yes, I agree with Deerslyr, the harvest data shows that success is higher in 667 (no apr) vs. 654 (2pt min).  Thats on top of the fee access and locked gates in most of 654.  Although some nice bucks in the 654, they definitely arent easy or a given.  Dont see tons of spikes either.