2pt minimum

[BiggLuke]

Me too?
A deer is a deer right?
You can't eat Antlers......

[boneaddict]

More in reference to muleys than blacktails.  I suspect with hairloss and other things, the population isn't at its peak.  How do you increase a population...YOU MAKE BABIES.    I am upset with the antlerless muley hunts in the Methow and Okanogan.   I think we need as many babies as possible.  Fires aside.......(whole new topic), range isn't near carrying capacity.  More does equals more bucks, or wolf food.     It has nothing to do with eats.

[JPhelps]

We are way below carrying capacity for blacktail as well.

[Woodchuck]

I agree fully, I havn't taken the time to read the whole thread either. Was curious where it tied into the suggested APR is all.

[bobcat]

Me too?
A deer is a deer right?
You can't eat Antlers......

True, but the only reason to allow the harvest of does, is to decrease, or at least stabilize, the deer population as it currently stands.

Is that what we want? Or do we want the deer population to increase? Because, as others have said, the blacktail (and mule deer) population is well below carrying capacity.

[sirmissalot]

I'm always amazed at the amount of people who say they hunt for the meat. I don't know many people who can kill a deer for less than just buying a partial beef. If you add up all the money you have into a hunting season I seriously doubt it's less than buying beef. If I kill a doe it's not gonna be for meat it's because I like to kill, I think that's the same reason as most people, although most don't want to admit it that way. Don't get me wrong I love wild game and eat plenty of it, but if it came down to it and I needed meat I would much rather eat beef. Buying beef sure isn't as much fun though.

I'm all for a two point restriction as well as statewide draw to hunt.

[Ripper]

I'm always amazed at the amount of people who say they hunt for the meat. I don't know many people who can kill a deer for less than just buying a partial beef. If you add up all the money you have into a hunting season I seriously doubt it's less than buying beef. If I kill a doe it's not gonna be for meat it's because I like to kill, I think that's the same reason as most people, although most don't want to admit it that way. Don't get me wrong I love wild game and eat plenty of it, but if it came down to it and I needed meat I would much rather eat beef. Buying beef sure isn't as much fun though.

I couldn't disagree with you more! When we say we hunt for meat it's because we love game meat, not hormone injected tasteless grocery store beef! We hunt for tradition, to go out and bond with our brothers and sister. And yes to kill a deer for the table, for the meat.

And to answer Bob, yes all hunting methods should have the same regulations for what can be taken. I also think the tribes should follow the same rules, but I don't want to get into that here. That topic has been beat to death.

[grundy53]

I should probably read this whole thread, but since I am for APRs  I'll stick to the end statements. 

STOP KILLING DOES!

[deerslyr]

You can definitely hunt for meat if your an efficient hunter IMO. Ive done it before. Might not be possible for some one who lives in the city though.

[sirmissalot]

You can definitely hunt for meat if your an efficient hunter IMO. Ive done it before. Might not be possible for some one who lives in the city though.

I'm not saying you can't hunt for meat. I'm just saying you would be money ahead buying meat. Also not saying I buy beef. I agree some people can meat hunt and be money ahead, but not many if you add up the cost of everything involved. In my opinion it's not about that, it's about the hunt, and I'm not afraid to admit I like to kill things, but it's also not all about that either. If I fished for the meat I can tell you I'd be way money ahead just buying it, same concept, but again I don't buy fish and rarely go without. 

[bobcat]

Here's the way I look at that aspect of it. I'm going to hunt no matter what. I'm going to be spending the money on the license, tags, fuel, trail cameras, etc. I really spend very little. My guns I've owned for years and I don't ever buy new ones so that doesn't even come into consideration.

So the deal is, I'm going to hunt and spend what I spend, and say I kill a small deer and end up with 50 pounds of boneless meat. I'm not even sure what meat costs in the store, but let's say $5 average, per pound. That makes $250 that I don't have to spend on meat at the store, and that definitely helps to offset the money it cost me to harvest that deer.

For that reason I will take any legal deer, especially towards the end of the season. Like two years ago, I shot a doe with my muzzleloader on Thanksgiving. Yes, it makes me a hypocrite, because I would rather they didn't allow the harvest of does in the unit I was hunting. And I also would not mind if they made it 2 point minimum, but yes, I would still shoot a spike if legal, at the end of the season. I figure if I don't, someone else will.

I just really think that especially the doe harvest needs to be totally eliminated. Archery hunters and muzzleloaders take a lot of does. I'd guess even more than are accounted for in the harvest reports. Many don't get reported, and quite a few are wounded and lost. So I feel if they put an end to doe hunting in most of the blacktail deer areas, the population would increase drastically after just a couple of years.

[billythekidrock]

You can definitely hunt for meat if your an efficient hunter IMO. Ive done it before. Might not be possible for some one who lives in the city though.

I'm not saying you can't hunt for meat. I'm just saying you would be money ahead buying meat. Also not saying I buy beef. I agree some people can meat hunt and be money ahead, but not many if you add up the cost of everything involved. In my opinion it's not about that, it's about the hunt, and I'm not afraid to admit I like to kill things, but it's also not all about that either. If I fished for the meat I can tell you I'd be way money ahead just buying it, same concept, but again I don't buy fish and rarely go without. 

Not always true.
 I know I was way ahead of the spending / buying curve for most of my hunting life.

A single rifle for deer, bear and elk. Usually got 2 out of the 3 every year.
Hunt deer from the house or within 15 minutes of the house. Minimal driving to hunt.
Hunt bear for a week from a camp that was only 2 hours from home. Minimal driving to hunt.
Hunt elk for a week from camp that was only 2 hours from home. No driving around to hunt.
My wife killed deer and bear with the same rifle for awhile.

Yea, so I had to drive to camp. I don't count that. It was my vacation and it was cheaper than Vegas or Hawaii.

Now once I started buying more rifles, better binos, GPS, Trail cams, etc.......I definitely when in the hole per pound.

But I am sure there are guys that have close access to prime country that use the same (minimal equipment) that do good on the pounds to dollar ratio.

[sirmissalot]

Well I guess I'm the exception then, because I know I spend way more than $5 a pound in order to fill my tags if you consider all the money I spend on keeping my rifle and bow tuned up and shooing well at the range and 3d shoots, traveling for scouting and hunting (I have good hunting nearby but not within 15 minute drive) replacement cost of worn out gear, gas, license fees including special permits... Etc. I just come nowhere close to being money ahead, but again for me that's not why i do it.

Bobcat does have a good point that I will be out there anyways, so might as well have something to show for it, and I agree with that. I guess I just have enough meat in the freezer that I don't have to shoot does or little spikes to make it seem worth my while. To each their own.

[Bootfish]

Some interesting thoughts here, I guess I am surprised by the number of folks who want more regulation.  I feel we are regulated to death as it is.
From the 2011 hunting stats on WDFW's web page, there were around 120,000 deer hunters last year.  Around 23,300 reported bucks harvested, and only 5772 Antlerless harvested.  I realize the data may be skewed, doesnt include poaching or Tribal harvest, but an overall success of 23% is pretty darn low. 
I would suggest that everyone who buys a hunting license be required to shoot at least one coyote.  That would save a heck of a lot more deer than further clamping down on the license buyers who fund what pitifully little "game management" we have in this state.

[grundy53]

Me too?
A deer is a deer right?
You can't eat Antlers......

For each doe allowed to live the population goes up exponentially. If one doe has 6 fawns in her life and half of them are does and they each have 6 fawns and half are does and the have 6 fawns in perpetuity. Now lets say you kill that ONE doe. Look how many deer you actually killed. Think of how many of those fawns would have been bucks? I understand that killing does is part of sound herd management when the herd is AT OR ABOVE carrying capacity (speaking of blacktails and mulies). I don't think any of our gmu's save for the islands are at or above (or even close) to carrying capacity. I personally think if we didn't allow the killing of does we wouldn't even be having this 2 point minimum discussion... just my