Ranchers skeptical of new cougar hunting rule

[RoyBoy]

Must be some of that liberal math...

  that is the biggest pile of Bull manure i have ever read! 

[bearpaw]

Many people have agendas and that includes some people in our agencies. A person can manipulate a study to produce the results they are looking for. I question the integrity of Wielgus and his study. Does his history indicate that he's a man who should be conducting an unbiased study that is used as the basis to set WDFW cougar management policy. Could this biologist be better suited as a biologist for a green hugger group looking for distorted study results to further their agenda. There are a lot of red flags about this whole Wielgus study.

A suspect a different biologist would guarantee much different study results and cougar management policy.

[ICEMAN]

This approach does not quite match the one taken recently on the Wedge pack.

Others theorize that when you kill off a bunch of predators, game stocks previously impacted seem to have a higher rate of survival.

Silly professor.

Now the big question is why the department would approve of his approach, yet fuel up a chopper and chase down and kill of a pack of wolves....

[NW-GSP]

News release wsu says allowing more sex offenders near elementary schools will reduce sex crimes in the area. 

I am aware that I went to the extreme but I do not see the logic

[pianoman9701]

This is very discouraging. We just got the rules changed and we're getting back door-ed on the word of this hoser, lefty prof with an agenda.  Cougars will grow to their full carrying capacity, as they have, and adolescent males will encroach into more populated areas as they get pushed out by the reigning adults. We had a cougar in downtown Vancouver last year as a result of this. Who's going to take responsibility for increased incidents when we find out this is a lie? Certainly not the honorable (sarc) professor.

[Skyvalhunter]

It doesn't really matter because the wolves will eat what the cougars don't!!

[pianoman9701]

Here's the key piece in debunking this skewed "science". Hounds were taken out of the picture in 1996 and the cougar population has increased ever since. Less have been killed by far and the population is now at full carrying capacity everywhere in the state except four units. The real numbers are in direct opposition to this fabricated "evidence" produced by a well known cougar protector/anti-hunter.

[Special T]

It seems they took a little of Kains thoughts and documentation and corrupted it. As i remeber He talked about making the season year round with no personal limits on tags, just quotas for each area.... Even with those restrictions we could not reach our harvest goals from the states own conservative numbers...

[pianoman9701]

Another point to be made here is that if increased hunting actually makes cougar populations increase, why limit hunting at all? Why not just have an open season on cougars and that'll make everyone happy, just like coyotes? The cougar lovers will have more animals to look at, the hunters will have more to shoot at. The only ones hurt would be the cattlemen, and I think they've given their preference - kill all you see. This should be an easy one to decide.

[Special T]

They use contradicting information so often it makes it hard to have a LOGICAL argument with them!     If only it were just so easy to just point out their own contradictory information and motives! 

[bearpaw]

Another point to be made here is that if increased hunting actually makes cougar populations increase, why limit hunting at all? Why not just have an open season on cougars and that'll make everyone happy, just like coyotes? The cougar lovers will have more animals to look at, the hunters will have more to shoot at. The only ones hurt would be the cattlemen, and I think they've given their preference - kill all you see. This should be an easy one to decide.

Excellent rationale....

[denali]

Thank you for the responses, I feel the same as many of you that his theories and conclusions are full of holes.

Recently I went to the region 3 WDFW meeting and a retired Bio blasted the department for their cougar numbers in the Blue Mountains, saying that the bios needed to put away their laptops and models and do real field work.

Today the dept. is chasing a cougar in Finley, we have had three news worthy incidents in the area within the last year.

At one time WDFW had a cougar habitat map on the cougar page, I can’t find it now, they probably pulled it down because they knew it was useless, according to the map we in the Basin would need to travel to heavily forested areas to be in cougar habitat.

The professor’s work has been picked up by anti hunting blogs and sites and has become the gospel for any form of predator management.

[Kain]

This is not really news guys.  This study and these numbers are exactly why we got the cougar harvest numbers we already have this year.  Each unit had a number of allowable cougar harvest based on the 14%+/-2% of "estimated" populations.  The WDFW embraced this study a long time ago and designed an overly complex season based off of it. 

For most of the units hunters have NEVER harvested enough cougars to meet that number in the first place.  Hunters would not reach this number even with unlimited tags and a year round season.  Until hunters start getting more involved, this is the garbage we will continue to be handed.

[Kain]

That 30-40% garbage was in one very small unit and only part of the Pilot program not across the whole state.   The reason that amount of cougar was allowed to be harvested was an experiment to see what effect it would have on cougar populations.  It had no effect on total cougar populations but did effect the ages of cougars that made up the population.

[Special T]

I find it amazing Kain that with this kind of info that THEY produced they still have the balls to tell us we need these under achieving rules for cougar hunting.    What is more amazing is their silence when confronted with questions about this...