another stupid game reg

[demontang]

Seems like some people get to defensive over these things. I never said that I was going to go and fight to legalize electronics, and I dont think bow should have any kind of electronics that help you shoot any better. I wouldnt be so jumpy about your fellow hunters . We dont need to fight over anything the anti's will jump on any weak point they see.

[Ray]

Who's Jumpy? You maybe? My blood pressure is just fine. I'm stating my opinion as well as intent. If someone's got to the have the electronics then I feel obligated to blockade that. Simple as pie. Hate me for it. I could care less if someone hates me for that but I warn you that I would be a worthy opponent.

[Colville]

At the end of the day it's not really a primative vs modern trad/compound issue. I know that debate goes in circles all the time, but his isn't about elitism when it comes to the technology. It's no more or less "fair" to kill a deer at 350 yards with a scoped rifle than a deer killed (assuming it was really ethical) by a capable compound at 90 yards. Dead is dead. One hunter one deer.

The real problem is about resource allocation. The trade off for using primitive archery and muzz can be longer/more seasons better season timing and less restrictive sex/point restrictions. They know very well that X % give or take within each weapon type will be successful.  They know because of it how many hunter days by group will fit within their system. They can map out their units, the hunter pressure, weapon type etc and then allocate days afield by each providing for a lot of overall opportunity for each group.

But what happens when you turn a trad muzz into a scoped 1 moa rifle out to 250 yards? You have just tuned up the killing efficiency of that group dramatically. Maybe they aren't exactly MF rates, but no longer can you afford to give them the season timing/length that you did before. Now because they are more efficient it cascades and you have to reduce the opportunity of the other groups as well.  Bottom line, there's X game that are harvestable within a system. They can't provide unlimited hunting equipment efficiency to each group and maintain the hunter days in the field. Something has to give.

So if you are for scoped Muzz or laser rangefinder equipped bows you'll have to know that you'll still be hunting but you'll pay for it in days, dates, sex/antler reqs. There's no free lunch.

[Ray]

I agree Colville, it is not usually a primitive vs. modern issue when taken from a larger view. However when it boils down to it.. well it is. I can see a lot of common sense in your point of view and it is a pretty accurate analysis for the most part.

[Missing]

  :yike:Wow that went a completely different direction than I thought it would!! You see I use my bow for all kind of hunting, grouse, coyote, rabbit, even deer and elk. I end up shooting a lot of aniamls during the year and the bulk of those are in heavy brush (rabbits, grouse and coyotes) I was just looking for an easier way to recover my $15 arrows not start archery war 3, kinda sorry I made the statement now.

I have been bow hunting for 25 years and we are still a fairly small group, I think if you shoot a stick from a string we should stick together

[demontang]

I dont see what advantage having a light nock is but to help find your arrow? I could see some people trying  to push other things though if you could use them though. And like I said if the traditonal archers dont want to hunt with the more modern archer's then they should split the to up so theres no hard feelings between the two.

[Hoytstaffshooter83]

exactly, what advantage does it give you? personally my hunting arrows are about 25 bucks a piece and my bow shoots clean through 99% of the game I shot with it, I would love to always find my arrow and not lose money.. how is that a advantage in any way, everything evovles... thats technology, not liking compound bows is like not liking cell phones or faster computers, compounds are more effective.. whats not to like? if my nocks were lighted Im sure id find more arrows.... seems a no brainer to me....

[Ray]

It's not advantage. That's the problem with your line of thought. It is principle. Electronics = leave it at home with nintendo.

[Hoytstaffshooter83]

im not seeing your  line of thought on this, why would you not want a better  way to recover something that is expensive? it isnt like  the lighted arrow shoots the deer for you, they would save me lots of money..... how can you look at it any other way? arrows have a strange way of dissapearing after a hit on game...

[STIKNSTRINGBOW]

The thing everybody seems to be missing is the reg. is not about Luminoks. They are a great tool for being able to see your arrow in flight, impact point, and finding it after the shot. ALL good sound archery basics. The reg was written about mounted electronics ie. laser sights etc. Luminocks just happen to fit the criteria ( electronic) The reason for those regs. and the stark reality we must face today is whether we want bowhunting to be a primitive sport with long seasons and limited kills or whether we want just another way to efficiently dispatch game. The amount of individual effort put into becoming proficient at finding, stalking, ambushing, and generally taking game is the real key to hunting success. The use of technological gadgetry to decrease or eliminate this amount of effort is flat-out betrayal of the sport. Look how upset people get about steroids in professional sports. The problems developing are the results of an attitude rather than actions. This attitude is one that not only allows the prostitution of the sport but actually encourages it. It is an attitude that has come about because the bowhunters who really care about the sport are outnumbered by those who think success is measured by the amount of blood drawn or tags filled and are not too particular how it is done. I got a little carried away....

[STIKNSTRINGBOW]

 :yike:Wow that went a completely different direction than I thought it would!!  I was just looking for an easier way to recover my $15 arrows not start archery war 3, kinda sorry I made the statement now.

This is excactly what these forums are for

[Ray]

Well I did explain myself on the first page. That is my line of thought.

Keep the electronics off the hunting weapons. As much as you feel the urge to put it on there it isn't necessary and I believe people will be more likely to make poor shots in the evening kind of like a hail mary pass. Having 30 days for an early archery season for example will leave people ample time to get their animal. There is no rush to take a bad shot at darkness.

When hunting seasons and weaponry is set they use the regulations to limit harvests and give us long seasons. the more modernized the equipment becomes the shorter our seasons will be due to how success rates will rise. In addition to that I believe that electronics are a bad image problem for hunters in general. We do have an image problem and this only makes it worse that we need electronics to aid in our weaponry.

On top of that I don't want to be associated with people who want to call themselves archers using electronic devices on their bows and arrows. It is not even close to what I am doing in the woods. It is not sporting and it is not better. It is worse.

[waoutdoorsman]

I personally dont think the luminoks do anything to increase the oppurtunity of harvesting an animal, its more for the hunter-(after the shot) not the hunted.

I personally dont use them, but whenever i find myself chasing blacktails through the extremely thick and dense forests with canapoy covers (which can be very dark during broad daylight!) i often think of how great it would be great for locating the arrow which is the first step to locating the animal (confirms with blood what type of hit was made). I would never think of using one on the eastside of the state because its simply not needed over there.

I think anything that aids in locating a downed animal quicker is a good thing, its not like they make the hunter more successful or kill the animal better its just for the hunters convienence. I dont use them and never will but i wouldnt shun those who would.

[Ray]

The good thing is that the regs are not so easy to change. Glad we have what we have. People lived without luminocks for many years. I believe the next generation can also learn to live without them and still harvest animals cleanly. Certainly permitting them is not a step forward from my point of view.

[Hoytstaffshooter83]

I agree 100% although on the east side it still could be usefull if you were to miss and the arrow took a little flight on you, all it does is help you recover the arrow thus recover the game and that = a good thing