New rules... 21

[BiggLuke]

Just in case some of our newer duck hunters missed this...

On August 9th, WDFW posted this years regs.

and guess what?   

THAT'S RIGHT!   

The Possesion limit is now 21 ducks!!!   woo hoo!   

go check it out....
https://m.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10151539435416761&id=385127436760&set=a.390652606760.166104.385127436760&refid=17

[7mmfan]

Great, this is going to start 15 more threads over the next 6 months on what possession limit vs daily limit means and how you can technically have 21 dead birds in your boat/truck/rv/go-kart/igloo cooler/yurt/whatever. And if they're not all made into pepperoni and consumed you can't go shoot anymore!

[Fishnclifff]

The DAILY limit is still 7 ducks

The aggregate limit is 21.

That means us wetsiders can go hunt the potholes on a 3 day weekend and be legal coming home.

Definite improvement. Someone up there is starting to listen.

[hdshot]

The DAILY limit is still 7 ducks

The aggregate limit is 21.

That means us wetsiders can go hunt the potholes on a 3 day weekend and be legal coming home.

Definite improvement. Someone up there is starting to listen.

If limits were that easy only 14 would not stop them.

I see it helping out the club hunters the most.

[syoungs]

The DAILY limit is still 7 ducks

The aggregate limit is 21.

That means us wetsiders can go hunt the potholes on a 3 day weekend and be legal coming home.

Definite improvement. Someone up there is starting to listen.

If limits were that easy only 14 would not stop them.

I see it helping out the club hunters the most.

I see it as a overall good thing, I know there has been times where I wished I was good enough and had 3 days in a row where I could worry about traveling with 21 ducks 

no seriously though, I think it makes sense for the guys who travel to be able to shoot for 3 days, if you had 2 good days and limited on both the 3rd you couldnt shoot at all. now the guy that has 18 ducks to take home doesnt have to worry.

[hdshot]

The DAILY limit is still 7 ducks

The aggregate limit is 21.

That means us wetsiders can go hunt the potholes on a 3 day weekend and be legal coming home.

Definite improvement. Someone up there is starting to listen.

If limits were that easy only 14 would not stop them.

I see it helping out the club hunters the most.

I see it as a overall good thing, I know there has been times where I wished I was good enough and had 3 days in a row where I could worry about traveling with 21 ducks 

no seriously though, I think it makes sense for the guys who travel to be able to shoot for 3 days, if you had 2 good days and limited on both the 3rd you couldnt shoot at all. now the guy that has 18 ducks to take home doesnt have to worry.

Possesion limit also counts whats in the freezer as well.  Hunting is really down and the state is trying to get more licenses sold for revenue is all, not help the hunter succeed in the blind with more fowl in the air.

[xd2005]

I got into this on another thread but the way that I interpret the regs that the possession limits applies from the place where the game is taken(field)  to your personal abode, or temporary domicile, or temporary transient place of lodging.

This is from the WDFW website.

"For upland birds and waterfowl, the daily bag limit is the maximum number of birds that can be harvested in a single day. In some cases the bag limit can be an aggregate of species, but other times it is limited by species and sex. The appropriate Hunting Regulation Pamphlets should be consulted. The possession limit is the number of daily limits allowed to be kept in the field or in transit."

So on a three day hunt as long as you return to your camp (RV, Tent, Hotel, cardboard box, etc.) you've done all that the WDFW asks to comply with they're possession limit requirements Therefore we've always been able to limit out on a three day hunt and be legal.

Here we go again

Was it the federal rules that were different? Trying to recall...

[Fishnclifff]

The DAILY limit is still 7 ducks

The aggregate limit is 21.

That means us wetsiders can go hunt the potholes on a 3 day weekend and be legal coming home.

Definite improvement. Someone up there is starting to listen.

If limits were that easy only 14 would not stop them.

I see it helping out the club hunters the most.

I see it as a overall good thing, I know there has been times where I wished I was good enough and had 3 days in a row where I could worry about traveling with 21 ducks 

no seriously though, I think it makes sense for the guys who travel to be able to shoot for 3 days, if you had 2 good days and limited on both the 3rd you couldnt shoot at all. now the guy that has 18 ducks to take home doesnt have to worry.

Possession limit also counts whats in the freezer as well.  Hunting is really down and the state is trying to get more licenses sold for revenue is all, not help the hunter succeed in the blind with more fowl in the air.

The statement in bold:
This is the feds position, but, they can't back it up with the Mig. Waterfowl Act or any other regulation.
I spent some time last year trying to get them to do just that. It is their "opinion" that is what the rule means. That is all I could get from the feds is an opinion, nothing in writing.

Here is the wording from the reg. book. It is under the heading" Summary of Federal Regulations".


Field possession limit:
No person shall possess, have in custody, or
transport more than the daily bag limit or
aggregate daily bag limit, whichever applies, of
migratory game birds, tagged or not tagged, at
or between the place where taken and either:
a) His automobile or principal means of land
transportation; or
b) His personal abode or temporary or
transient place of lodging; or
c) A migratory bird preservation facility; or
d) A post office; or
e) A common carrier facility.

The part in bold, means:

The field possession limit ends when you leave your blind and put the ducks in your car.

This is being debated and discussed by hunting groups all over. I've talked to guys from Texas to the SE.
All agree with the field possession limit in bold letters. All states have something similar.

[hdshot]

The DAILY limit is still 7 ducks

The aggregate limit is 21.

That means us wetsiders can go hunt the potholes on a 3 day weekend and be legal coming home.

Definite improvement. Someone up there is starting to listen.

If limits were that easy only 14 would not stop them.

I see it helping out the club hunters the most.

I see it as a overall good thing, I know there has been times where I wished I was good enough and had 3 days in a row where I could worry about traveling with 21 ducks 

no seriously though, I think it makes sense for the guys who travel to be able to shoot for 3 days, if you had 2 good days and limited on both the 3rd you couldnt shoot at all. now the guy that has 18 ducks to take home doesnt have to worry.

Possession limit also counts whats in the freezer as well.  Hunting is really down and the state is trying to get more licenses sold for revenue is all, not help the hunter succeed in the blind with more fowl in the air.

The statement in bold:
This is the feds position, but, they can't back it up with the Mig. Waterfowl Act or any other regulation.
I spent some time last year trying to get them to do just that. It is their "opinion" that is what the rule means. That is all I could get from the feds is an opinion, nothing in writing.

Here is the wording from the reg. book. It is under the heading" Summary of Federal Regulations".


Field possession limit:
No person shall possess, have in custody, or
transport more than the daily bag limit or
aggregate daily bag limit, whichever applies, of
migratory game birds, tagged or not tagged, at
or between the place where taken and either:
a) His automobile or principal means of land
transportation; or
b) His personal abode or temporary or
transient place of lodging; or
c) A migratory bird preservation facility; or
d) A post office; or
e) A common carrier facility.

The part in bold, means:

The field possession limit ends when you leave your blind and put the ducks in your car.

This is being debated and discussed by hunting groups all over. I've talked to guys from Texas to the SE.
All agree with the field possession limit in bold letters. All states have something similar.

Feds also have no laws that ban spinners as well.  In the WA waterfowl regs just says "possession limit" and nothing else that I see.  Possession limit is very broad that covers every scenario of harvested birds a hunter has whether in the field, transport, home, or even your Mom's house before consumed or prepared.   

[Fishnclifff]

The DAILY limit is still 7 ducks

The aggregate limit is 21.

That means us wetsiders can go hunt the potholes on a 3 day weekend and be legal coming home.

Definite improvement. Someone up there is starting to listen.

If limits were that easy only 14 would not stop them.

I see it helping out the club hunters the most.

I see it as a overall good thing, I know there has been times where I wished I was good enough and had 3 days in a row where I could worry about traveling with 21 ducks 

no seriously though, I think it makes sense for the guys who travel to be able to shoot for 3 days, if you had 2 good days and limited on both the 3rd you couldnt shoot at all. now the guy that has 18 ducks to take home doesnt have to worry.

Possession limit also counts whats in the freezer as well.  Hunting is really down and the state is trying to get more licenses sold for revenue is all, not help the hunter succeed in the blind with more fowl in the air.

The statement in bold:
This is the feds position, but, they can't back it up with the Mig. Waterfowl Act or any other regulation.
I spent some time last year trying to get them to do just that. It is their "opinion" that is what the rule means. That is all I could get from the feds is an opinion, nothing in writing.

Here is the wording from the reg. book. It is under the heading" Summary of Federal Regulations".


Field possession limit:
No person shall possess, have in custody, or
transport more than the daily bag limit or
aggregate daily bag limit, whichever applies, of
migratory game birds, tagged or not tagged, at
or between the place where taken and either:
a) His automobile or principal means of land
transportation; or
b) His personal abode or temporary or
transient place of lodging; or
c) A migratory bird preservation facility; or
d) A post office; or
e) A common carrier facility.

The part in bold, means:

The field possession limit ends when you leave your blind and put the ducks in your car.

This is being debated and discussed by hunting groups all over. I've talked to guys from Texas to the SE.
All agree with the field possession limit in bold letters. All states have something similar.

Feds also have no laws that ban spinners as well.  In the WA waterfowl regs just says "possession limit" and nothing else that I see.  Possession limit is very broad that covers every scenario of harvested birds a hunter has whether in the field, transport, home, or even your Mom's house before consumed or prepared.   

Not true.
The WDFW and Fed DFW have told me--state law is is similar but not more stringent than fed law.
The state law reads word for word as the fed law and mig. waterfowl act.
In 2 yrs of debating this, no one in any capacity in the Fish and game regulatory offices, both state and federal, can disprove the statement that possession is between place taken and your car etc....

[Fishnclifff]

As for the spinners?

The fed mig. act allows states to set seasons and harvest rules according to the population counts in their states.
WA is not the only state that does not allow motorized decoys.

[Ned]

As for the spinners?

The fed mig. act allows states to set seasons and harvest rules according to the population counts in their states.

WA is not the only state that does not allow motorized decoys.

1. They DO NOT set limits by the population of the state.

2. 48 states allow motorized decoys.

Please carry on

[Fishnclifff]

As for the spinners?

The fed mig. act allows states to set seasons and harvest rules according to the population counts in their states.

WA is not the only state that does not allow motorized decoys.

1. They DO NOT set limits by the population of the state.

2. 48 states allow motorized decoys.

Please carry on

Actually they do.
After they get the survey results, they set seasons and limits.
They also decide on any special rules for us hunters.

[Ned]

As for the spinners?

The fed mig. act allows states to set seasons and harvest rules according to the population counts in their states.

WA is not the only state that does not allow motorized decoys.

1. They DO NOT set limits by the population of the state.

2. 48 states allow motorized decoys.

Please carry on

Actually they do.
After they get the survey results, they set seasons and limits.
They also decide on any special rules for us hunters.

They dont set limits by the states bird population. They are MIGRATORY birds and the count and limits are set BEFORE the birds ever reach Washington.
The STATE sets limits within the boundries allowed by what the Pacific Flyway Council allows.
Seasons are not set based on bird counts.

Yes they set set the rule on electonic decoys based on recomendations by the retards on the WAG committee.

Where do you get your info?

.

[BiggLuke]

All very good points.
I still think it's pretty sweet though that now we can take photos from camp of 21 birds per person.
For example....
If Myself and 2 friends all get 21 each...
Thats a pretty nice looking photo of 63 birds.

Well, a guy can hope.  Right?

[hdshot]

The DAILY limit is still 7 ducks

The aggregate limit is 21.

That means us wetsiders can go hunt the potholes on a 3 day weekend and be legal coming home.

Definite improvement. Someone up there is starting to listen.

If limits were that easy only 14 would not stop them.

I see it helping out the club hunters the most.

I see it as a overall good thing, I know there has been times where I wished I was good enough and had 3 days in a row where I could worry about traveling with 21 ducks 

no seriously though, I think it makes sense for the guys who travel to be able to shoot for 3 days, if you had 2 good days and limited on both the 3rd you couldnt shoot at all. now the guy that has 18 ducks to take home doesnt have to worry.

Possession limit also counts whats in the freezer as well.  Hunting is really down and the state is trying to get more licenses sold for revenue is all, not help the hunter succeed in the blind with more fowl in the air.

The statement in bold:
This is the feds position, but, they can't back it up with the Mig. Waterfowl Act or any other regulation.
I spent some time last year trying to get them to do just that. It is their "opinion" that is what the rule means. That is all I could get from the feds is an opinion, nothing in writing.

Here is the wording from the reg. book. It is under the heading" Summary of Federal Regulations".


Field possession limit:
No person shall possess, have in custody, or
transport more than the daily bag limit or
aggregate daily bag limit, whichever applies, of
migratory game birds, tagged or not tagged, at
or between the place where taken and either:
a) His automobile or principal means of land
transportation; or
b) His personal abode or temporary or
transient place of lodging; or
c) A migratory bird preservation facility; or
d) A post office; or
e) A common carrier facility.

The part in bold, means:

The field possession limit ends when you leave your blind and put the ducks in your car.

This is being debated and discussed by hunting groups all over. I've talked to guys from Texas to the SE.
All agree with the field possession limit in bold letters. All states have something similar.

Feds also have no laws that ban spinners as well.  In the WA waterfowl regs just says "possession limit" and nothing else that I see.  Possession limit is very broad that covers every scenario of harvested birds a hunter has whether in the field, transport, home, or even your Mom's house before consumed or prepared.   

Not true.
The WDFW and Fed DFW have told me--state law is is similar but not more stringent than fed law.
The state law reads word for word as the fed law and mig. waterfowl act.
In 2 yrs of debating this, no one in any capacity in the Fish and game regulatory offices, both state and federal, can disprove the statement that possession is between place taken and your car etc....

Well I can help you out.  Webster's Dictionary, Possession n act of possessing; thing possessed; ownership.

[Fishnclifff]

The DAILY limit is still 7 ducks

The aggregate limit is 21.

That means us wetsiders can go hunt the potholes on a 3 day weekend and be legal coming home.

Definite improvement. Someone up there is starting to listen.

If limits were that easy only 14 would not stop them.

I see it helping out the club hunters the most.

I see it as a overall good thing, I know there has been times where I wished I was good enough and had 3 days in a row where I could worry about traveling with 21 ducks 

no seriously though, I think it makes sense for the guys who travel to be able to shoot for 3 days, if you had 2 good days and limited on both the 3rd you couldnt shoot at all. now the guy that has 18 ducks to take home doesnt have to worry.

Possession limit also counts whats in the freezer as well.  Hunting is really down and the state is trying to get more licenses sold for revenue is all, not help the hunter succeed in the blind with more fowl in the air.

The statement in bold:
This is the feds position, but, they can't back it up with the Mig. Waterfowl Act or any other regulation.
I spent some time last year trying to get them to do just that. It is their "opinion" that is what the rule means. That is all I could get from the feds is an opinion, nothing in writing.

Here is the wording from the reg. book. It is under the heading" Summary of Federal Regulations".


Field possession limit:
No person shall possess, have in custody, or
transport more than the daily bag limit or
aggregate daily bag limit, whichever applies, of
migratory game birds, tagged or not tagged, at
or between the place where taken and either:
a) His automobile or principal means of land
transportation; or
b) His personal abode or temporary or
transient place of lodging; or
c) A migratory bird preservation facility; or
d) A post office; or
e) A common carrier facility.

The part in bold, means:

The field possession limit ends when you leave your blind and put the ducks in your car.

This is being debated and discussed by hunting groups all over. I've talked to guys from Texas to the SE.
All agree with the field possession limit in bold letters. All states have something similar.

Feds also have no laws that ban spinners as well.  In the WA waterfowl regs just says "possession limit" and nothing else that I see. Possession limit is very broad that covers every scenario of harvested birds a hunter has whether in the field, transport, home, or even your Mom's house before consumed or prepared.   

Can you show anyone this definition in the state, federal law or Mig. Waterfowl act?

[Fishnclifff]

As for the spinners?

The fed mig. act allows states to set seasons and harvest rules according to the population counts in their states.

WA is not the only state that does not allow motorized decoys.

1. They DO NOT set limits by the population of the state.

2. 48 states allow motorized decoys.

Please carry on

I shouldn't but what the hell.

Here is the link for the Mig. Bird Treaty.
Let's see who does what, shall we?
http://www.fws.gov/southeast/birds/faq.htm#HuntingSeasons
 

All migratory birds are listed as a trust species for the Department of the Interior according to the Migratory Bird Treaty Act of 1916.  The U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service has the primary responsibility
Hunting Seasons
Through a regulatory process that begins each year in January and includes public consultation, the Service establishes the frameworks that govern all migratory bird hunting in the United States. Within the boundaries established by those frameworks, State wildlife commissions have the flexibility to determine season length, bag limits, and areas for migratory game bird hunting.  Each state has primary responsibility and authority over the hunting of wildlife that resides within state boundaries The State fish and wildlife agencies that sell hunting licenses are the best source of information regarding hunting seasons, areas open/closed to hunting, etc.

[Fishnclifff]

God I'm bored. Sucks having a sprained arm and a cold.

Okay so I started this mess again. Let's see, how bout this one.

http://wildlife.state.co.us/SiteCollectionDocuments/DOW/Hunting/Waterfowl/FederalRegulationsforhuntingmigratorygamebirds.pdf

Can't copy and paste from this one

Read "termination of possesion".

My wife loves it when I bring her gifts.

[hdshot]

God I'm bored. Sucks having a sprained arm and a cold.

Okay so I started this mess again. Let's see, how bout this one.

http://wildlife.state.co.us/SiteCollectionDocuments/DOW/Hunting/Waterfowl/FederalRegulationsforhuntingmigratorygamebirds.pdf

Can't copy and paste from this one

Read "termination of possesion".

My wife loves it when I bring her gifts.

Our state of WA just states the possession limit part of the Fed law and leaves out the field possession law in the WA waterfowl regs. 

That gives the states power on how to enforce laws and our state just says possession limit unless lost is some fine print.  States always have more strict laws than the Feds do but states can't be more relaxed than the feds.  That's why this new marijuana law is making so much noise is because 2 states are telling the Feds to fly a kite.  Just because the Feds say ok the state can say no.  For some states a nonresident to free lance hunt waterfowl they have to enter draw.  So if the hunter doesn't draw the hunter can't turn around and say I have a treaty that says I can hunt waterfowl there.  Even Feds say it's legal but the hunter will still have no daily bag, no season, no possession limit, and even no field possession limit.

Only thing I see is possession limit in the WA regs and that is the only legal method our state will recognize and nothing else.

Let's go to South Dakota and hunt some green heads this fall.  Oh crap Federal laws and treaties can't even make that happen this year.

http://www.outdoornews.com/May-2013/South-Dakotas-Nonresident-Waterfowl-License-Numbers-Tundra-Swan-Season-Finalized/

   

       

[NWgamehunter]

14 or 21..... still gonna get eyes rolled at me in february when we turn in the breast meat for processing...

[Fishnclifff]

Our state of WA just states the possession limit part of the Fed law and leaves out the field possession law in the WA waterfowl regs. 

Page 35 of the WA state reg, lists, the fed field possession limit.

The page heading is  SUMMARY OF FEDERAL REGULATIONS

Field possession limit rules are on the right side of the page.

[hdshot]

Our state of WA just states the possession limit part of the Fed law and leaves out the field possession law in the WA waterfowl regs. 

Page 35 of the WA state reg, lists, the fed field possession limit.

The page heading is  SUMMARY OF FEDERAL REGULATIONS

Field possession limit rules are on the right side of the page.

Hold the phone man!

You better read the field possession limit law better like I just did.  Only covers the daily bag limit or aggregate daily bag limit laws.  Says nothing about possession limit laws.

[Fishnclifff]

Our state of WA just states the possession limit part of the Fed law and leaves out the field possession law in the WA waterfowl regs. 

Page 35 of the WA state reg, lists, the fed field possession limit.

The page heading is  SUMMARY OF FEDERAL REGULATIONS

Field possession limit rules are on the right side of the page.

Hold the phone man!

You better read the field possession limit law better like I just did.  Only covers the daily bag limit or aggregate daily bag limit laws. Says nothing about possession limit laws.

Back about 4 or 5 posts, I listed a PDF. On that PDF it defines all the possession terms.
Under the heading "termination of Possession ", it says possession ends when the birds are gifted or taken to a facility described in the text.
There is NO fed rules or laws , other than that text, that describe possession.
There are certainly no laws restricting how many birds you can have in your freezer or home.

So after your hunt, you cannot transport more than 21 birds at a time.
The field possession rule ends at your car.
The aggregate possession rule ends when you go home and say " honey, I brought you a gift".

There is some noise out of Texas about getting a fed rule, similar to our salmon rule, about processed game, but,

the PDF clearly defines the terms and restrictions.

[hdshot]

I'm going to write up a scenario how field possession limit and possession limit works.

Hunter Joe in is going to take a 3 day duck hunting trip.  First day he harvested 2 mallard drake and 2 hen mallards.  The field possession law allows him to carry his birds from the blind to his camper. But now he has 4 ducks in his possession with 2 hen mallards.  Day 2 he harvested 3 mallard drakes and 2 hen mallards and takes his birds to the camper following the field possession law that didn't exceed 7 ducks or 2 hen mallards but now has 9 ducks in his possession with 4 hen mallards.  Day 3 harvested 3 mallard drakes and 2 hen mallards and he now has 14 ducks in his possession with 6 hen mallards.  Well on day 3 while he was carring his field possession of 3 drakes and 2 hens back to the camper he finds the mother load of ducks in a pond he has never seen a duck before.  So he calls in sick but he knows he has his possession limit 6 hen mallards and had a nice hunt by getting (2 pintail 1 hen 1 drake) and 5 mallard drakes and could of been limited two hours early because he had to let the hen mallards go and had to watch his shots because the sun was in his eyes all morning.  He now has his first daily bag limit and field possession limit to take to the truck and head for home with a possession limit of 21 ducks, possession limit of 6 hen mallards, and buys his dog a treat as thanks for not finding a duck cripple in the brush during the trip. 

Now he gets home prepares his birds into jerky which is ready to be eaten and saves some for his next hunting trip when his buddy and son can go.       

[hdshot]

Our state of WA just states the possession limit part of the Fed law and leaves out the field possession law in the WA waterfowl regs. 

Page 35 of the WA state reg, lists, the fed field possession limit.

The page heading is  SUMMARY OF FEDERAL REGULATIONS

Field possession limit rules are on the right side of the page.

Hold the phone man!

You better read the field possession limit law better like I just did.  Only covers the daily bag limit or aggregate daily bag limit laws. Says nothing about possession limit laws.

Back about 4 or 5 posts, I listed a PDF. On that PDF it defines all the possession terms.
Under the heading "termination of Possession ", it says possession ends when the birds are gifted or taken to a facility described in the text.
There is NO fed rules or laws , other than that text, that describe possession.
There are certainly no laws restricting how many birds you can have in your freezer or home.

So after your hunt, you cannot transport more than 21 birds at a time.
The field possession rule ends at your car.
The aggregate possession rule ends when you go home and say " honey, I brought you a gift".

There is some noise out of Texas about getting a fed rule, similar to our salmon rule, about processed game, but,

the PDF clearly defines the terms and restrictions.

Yes there are loop holes, agreed. But if something were to happen you better have stories straight with others involved.  I'm just stating what the law is.  Yes I can see someone else legally possessing the birds you lawfully taken because is says possessed only by any one person in possession limit law.  Doesn't specify that one person even needs a hunting licence, just lawfully taken.  Yes I can see a non-hunting wife take possession of the birds her husband lawfully taken, as example.   

[Fishnclifff]

I'm going to write up a scenario how field possession limit and possession limit works.

Hunter Joe in is going to take a 3 day duck hunting trip.  First day he harvested 2 mallard drake and 2 hen mallards.  The field possession law allows him to carry his birds from the blind to his camper. But now he has 4 ducks in his possession with 2 hen mallards.  Day 2 he harvested 3 mallard drakes and 2 hen mallards and takes his birds to the camper following the field possession law that didn't exceed 7 ducks or 2 hen mallards but now has 9 ducks in his possession with 4 hen mallards.  Day 3 harvested 3 mallard drakes and 2 hen mallards and he now has 14 ducks in his possession with 6 hen mallards.  Well on day 3 while he was carring his field possession of 3 drakes and 2 hens back to the camper he finds the mother load of ducks in a pond he has never seen a duck before.  So he calls in sick but he knows he has his possession limit 6 hen mallards and had a nice hunt by getting (2 pintail 1 hen 1 drake) and 5 mallard drakes and could of been limited two hours early because he had to let the hen mallards go and had to watch his shots because the sun was in his eyes all morning.  He now has his first daily bag limit and field possession limit to take to the truck and head for home with a possession limit of 21 ducks, possession limit of 6 hen mallards, and buys his dog a treat as thanks for not finding a duck cripple in the brush during the trip. 

Now he gets home prepares his birds into jerky which is ready to be eaten and saves some for his next hunting trip when his buddy and son can go.       

You just described a perfectly legal 4 day hunt, which would not have been 4 days without the change.
So

[Fishnclifff]

Our state of WA just states the possession limit part of the Fed law and leaves out the field possession law in the WA waterfowl regs. 

Page 35 of the WA state reg, lists, the fed field possession limit.

The page heading is  SUMMARY OF FEDERAL REGULATIONS

Field possession limit rules are on the right side of the page.

Hold the phone man!

You better read the field possession limit law better like I just did.  Only covers the daily bag limit or aggregate daily bag limit laws. Says nothing about possession limit laws.

Back about 4 or 5 posts, I listed a PDF. On that PDF it defines all the possession terms.
Under the heading "termination of Possession ", it says possession ends when the birds are gifted or taken to a facility described in the text.
There is NO fed rules or laws , other than that text, that describe possession.
There are certainly no laws restricting how many birds you can have in your freezer or home.

So after your hunt, you cannot transport more than 21 birds at a time.
The field possession rule ends at your car.
The aggregate possession rule ends when you go home and say " honey, I brought you a gift".

There is some noise out of Texas about getting a fed rule, similar to our salmon rule, about processed game, but,

the PDF clearly defines the terms and restrictions.

Yes there are loop holes, agreed. But if something were to happen you better have stories straight with others involved.  I'm just stating what the law is.  Yes I can see someone else legally possessing the birds you lawfully taken because is says possessed only by any one person in possession limit law.  Doesn't specify that one person even needs a hunting licence, just lawfully taken.  Yes I can see a non-hunting wife take possession of the birds her husband lawfully taken, as example.

I don't understand the loop holes you refer to.

The possession rules are for lawful hunters with a hunting license. These are the limitations placed on the hunter by the fed. mig. treaty. ie  what you can shoot, how many you can shoot, and how many you can possess at a time.
The rules do not apply to other citizens-- unless they are transporting birds.
Possession ends when you gift them to anyone.

[hdshot]

Our state of WA just states the possession limit part of the Fed law and leaves out the field possession law in the WA waterfowl regs. 

Page 35 of the WA state reg, lists, the fed field possession limit.

The page heading is  SUMMARY OF FEDERAL REGULATIONS

Field possession limit rules are on the right side of the page.

Hold the phone man!

You better read the field possession limit law better like I just did.  Only covers the daily bag limit or aggregate daily bag limit laws. Says nothing about possession limit laws.

Back about 4 or 5 posts, I listed a PDF. On that PDF it defines all the possession terms.
Under the heading "termination of Possession ", it says possession ends when the birds are gifted or taken to a facility described in the text.
There is NO fed rules or laws , other than that text, that describe possession.
There are certainly no laws restricting how many birds you can have in your freezer or home.

So after your hunt, you cannot transport more than 21 birds at a time.
The field possession rule ends at your car.
The aggregate possession rule ends when you go home and say " honey, I brought you a gift".

There is some noise out of Texas about getting a fed rule, similar to our salmon rule, about processed game, but,

the PDF clearly defines the terms and restrictions.

Yes there are loop holes, agreed. But if something were to happen you better have stories straight with others involved.  I'm just stating what the law is.  Yes I can see someone else legally possessing the birds you lawfully taken because is says possessed only by any one person in possession limit law.  Doesn't specify that one person even needs a hunting licence, just lawfully taken.  Yes I can see a non-hunting wife take possession of the birds her husband lawfully taken, as example.

I don't understand the loop holes you refer to.

The possession rules are for lawful hunters with a hunting license. These are the limitations placed on the hunter by the fed. mig. treaty. ie  what you can shoot, how many you can shoot, and how many you can possess at a time.
The rules do not apply to other citizens-- unless they are transporting birds.
Possession ends when you gift them to anyone.

That is what I said, but they better tell the law man they took possession of the lawfully taken waterfowl if any thing comes up so they don't leave you holding the bag.  But the hunter can't go harvest more on the same day that would exceed daily bag limits.  A person doesn't need a license to possess lawfully taken waterfowl as you stated as anyone.  But they better understand possession limit as well.

[hdshot]

I'm going to write up a scenario how field possession limit and possession limit works.

Hunter Joe in is going to take a 3 day duck hunting trip.  First day he harvested 2 mallard drake and 2 hen mallards.  The field possession law allows him to carry his birds from the blind to his camper. But now he has 4 ducks in his possession with 2 hen mallards.  Day 2 he harvested 3 mallard drakes and 2 hen mallards and takes his birds to the camper following the field possession law that didn't exceed 7 ducks or 2 hen mallards but now has 9 ducks in his possession with 4 hen mallards.  Day 3 harvested 3 mallard drakes and 2 hen mallards and he now has 14 ducks in his possession with 6 hen mallards.  Well on day 3 while he was carring his field possession of 3 drakes and 2 hens back to the camper he finds the mother load of ducks in a pond he has never seen a duck before.  So he calls in sick but he knows he has his possession limit 6 hen mallards and had a nice hunt by getting (2 pintail 1 hen 1 drake) and 5 mallard drakes and could of been limited two hours early because he had to let the hen mallards go and had to watch his shots because the sun was in his eyes all morning.  He now has his first daily bag limit and field possession limit to take to the truck and head for home with a possession limit of 21 ducks, possession limit of 6 hen mallards, and buys his dog a treat as thanks for not finding a duck cripple in the brush during the trip. 

Now he gets home prepares his birds into jerky which is ready to be eaten and saves some for his next hunting trip when his buddy and son can go.       

You just described a perfectly legal 4 day hunt, which would not have been 4 days without the change.
So

So, you seem to interpret possession limit is a travel limit which is not true and no such thing.     

[Fishnclifff]

I'm going to write up a scenario how field possession limit and possession limit works.

Hunter Joe in is going to take a 3 day duck hunting trip.  First day he harvested 2 mallard drake and 2 hen mallards.  The field possession law allows him to carry his birds from the blind to his camper. But now he has 4 ducks in his possession with 2 hen mallards.  Day 2 he harvested 3 mallard drakes and 2 hen mallards and takes his birds to the camper following the field possession law that didn't exceed 7 ducks or 2 hen mallards but now has 9 ducks in his possession with 4 hen mallards.  Day 3 harvested 3 mallard drakes and 2 hen mallards and he now has 14 ducks in his possession with 6 hen mallards.  Well on day 3 while he was carring his field possession of 3 drakes and 2 hens back to the camper he finds the mother load of ducks in a pond he has never seen a duck before.  So he calls in sick but he knows he has his possession limit 6 hen mallards and had a nice hunt by getting (2 pintail 1 hen 1 drake) and 5 mallard drakes and could of been limited two hours early because he had to let the hen mallards go and had to watch his shots because the sun was in his eyes all morning.  He now has his first daily bag limit and field possession limit to take to the truck and head for home with a possession limit of 21 ducks, possession limit of 6 hen mallards, and buys his dog a treat as thanks for not finding a duck cripple in the brush during the trip. 

Now he gets home prepares his birds into jerky which is ready to be eaten and saves some for his next hunting trip when his buddy and son can go.       

You just described a perfectly legal 4 day hunt, which would not have been 4 days without the change.
So

So, you seem to interpret possession limit is a travel limit which is not true and no such thing.   

He would not have been able to hunt the 4rth day with out the change.
On day 3, he had his aggregate limit of 14 ducks under the old rule.

I'm not sure what you are getting at with the travel rule.

[Fishnclifff]

I don't understand the loop holes you refer to.

The possession rules are for lawful hunters with a hunting license. These are the limitations placed on the hunter by the fed. mig. treaty. ie  what you can shoot, how many you can shoot, and how many you can possess at a time.
The rules do not apply to other citizens-- unless they are transporting birds.
Possession ends when you gift them to anyone.
[/quote]

That is what I said, but they better tell the law man they took possession of the lawfully taken waterfowl if any thing comes up so they don't leave you holding the bag.  But the hunter can't go harvest more on the same day that would exceed daily bag limits.  A person doesn't need a license to possess lawfully taken waterfowl as you stated as anyone.  But they better understand possession limit as well.
[/quote]

Once a hunter 'gifts" the waterfowl to someone, whomever that is, they become their property, and are no longer subject to the fed rules in the mig.act. The "act of gifting would take place at the place of abode of the gifter or the giftee to be legal.
The birds would then cease to exist.

If the person is transporting the birds to a facility, then they have to have tags on each bird as proof they were harvested legally. The tags have the info of the person who "took" the birds legally.
I have no idea what kinda tag they talk about, but it is required.

There is no limit of how many"birds" you can transport to the butcher shop.

You made this assertion before:

Possession limit also counts whats in the freezer as well.

Can you show me where you got this from?

[BiggLuke]

As far as I've learned, from both law and friends, You can "Harvest" 7 ducks every day of the season if it's open to do so.
Once you've taken them back to your home and "processed" them, they are now food, and no longer birds.

From what I am to understand... that means your freezer can be filled with meat, but not filled with Feathered birds.

There are no loop holes.
And yes... you need a signed note in this state to accompany any birds you gave away. Which includes your name, wild id, drivers license (if you have one), and time and place of harvesting.
This is only necessary if for instance; you, your wife, your brother-in-law, and his friend all go hunting together on a saturday, and you bring home all 28 ducks on sunday for a Big 'ole BBQ. 

I've been told in the field by Mr. Gamewarden that they have cards available for this purpose, but it is unnecessary, and you can make up a card of your own on anything, including a paper napkin.
 

[Fishnclifff]

As far as I've learned, from both law and friends, You can "Harvest" 7 ducks every day of the season if it's open to do so.
Once you've taken them back to your home and "processed" them, they are now food, and no longer birds.

From what I am to understand... that means your freezer can be filled with meat, but not filled with Feathered birds.

There are no loop holes.

This was the issue I raised last year with the Feds.
 It is also the wording Texas is pushing for to be added to the Fed. rules

The fed. lady kept insisting they were still birds if made into pepperoni. There are 2 legal cases where guys were cited for having killed some birds and their pepperoni sticks put them over the limit.
I haven't been able to get a follow up on those cases.
Her stand point was the birds have to be eaten to not exist anymore.
She couldn't back it with a reg. or law, but it was her opinion that was what the law meant.

[Tealer]

As far as I've learned, from both law and friends, You can "Harvest" 7 ducks every day of the season if it's open to do so.
Once you've taken them back to your home and "processed" them, they are now food, and no longer birds.

From what I am to understand... that means your freezer can be filled with meat, but not filled with Feathered birds.

There are no loop holes.

This was the issue I raised last year with the Feds.
 It is also the wording Texas is pushing for to be added to the Fed. rules

The fed. lady kept insisting they were still birds if made into pepperoni. There are 2 legal cases where guys were cited for having killed some birds and their pepperoni sticks put them over the limit.
I haven't been able to get a follow up on those cases.
Her stand point was the birds have to be eaten to not exist anymore.
She couldn't back it with a reg. or law, but it was her opinion that was what the law meant.

If that is the case I'm probably still over the possession limit. I have about 12 pounds of pepperoni left over after the season. I have never heard of any one busted for processed birds in the freezer.

[BiggLuke]

So in her opinion... would she be breaking federal mining laws by wearing a gold ring in an area where someone else has rites to the gold in the ground? How could she prove she didin't just make the ring on the spot with gold she stole from the mining company??

lol.....   

[Fishnclifff]

If that is the case I'm probably still over the possession limit. I have about 12 pounds of pepperoni left over after the season. I have never heard of any one busted for processed birds in the freezer.
[/quote]

I found a bill in the CA legislature. that got passed out of committee for further info, on the same subject. Shoulda saved it.
Seems they are up in arms over the freezer rule. Some senator trying to get a clear definition out of the feds.

The pepparoni stick bust was in S Carolina, but I havent seen any outcome, but there was an article stating citations were issued.

[hdshot]

If that is the case I'm probably still over the possession limit. I have about 12 pounds of pepperoni left over after the season. I have never heard of any one busted for processed birds in the freezer.

I found a bill in the CA legislature. that got passed out of committee for further info, on the same subject. Shoulda saved it.
Seems they are up in arms over the freezer rule. Some senator trying to get a clear definition out of the feds.

The pepparoni stick bust was in S Carolina, but I havent seen any outcome, but there was an article stating citations were issued.
[/quote]

So then why are you so sure you know everything about these possession limit law?   

[hdshot]

I'm going to write up a scenario how field possession limit and possession limit works.

Hunter Joe in is going to take a 3 day duck hunting trip.  First day he harvested 2 mallard drake and 2 hen mallards.  The field possession law allows him to carry his birds from the blind to his camper. But now he has 4 ducks in his possession with 2 hen mallards.  Day 2 he harvested 3 mallard drakes and 2 hen mallards and takes his birds to the camper following the field possession law that didn't exceed 7 ducks or 2 hen mallards but now has 9 ducks in his possession with 4 hen mallards.  Day 3 harvested 3 mallard drakes and 2 hen mallards and he now has 14 ducks in his possession with 6 hen mallards.  Well on day 3 while he was carring his field possession of 3 drakes and 2 hens back to the camper he finds the mother load of ducks in a pond he has never seen a duck before.  So he calls in sick but he knows he has his possession limit 6 hen mallards and had a nice hunt by getting (2 pintail 1 hen 1 drake) and 5 mallard drakes and could of been limited two hours early because he had to let the hen mallards go and had to watch his shots because the sun was in his eyes all morning.  He now has his first daily bag limit and field possession limit to take to the truck and head for home with a possession limit of 21 ducks, possession limit of 6 hen mallards, and buys his dog a treat as thanks for not finding a duck cripple in the brush during the trip. 

Now he gets home prepares his birds into jerky which is ready to be eaten and saves some for his next hunting trip when his buddy and son can go.       

You just described a perfectly legal 4 day hunt, which would not have been 4 days without the change.
So

So, you seem to interpret possession limit is a travel limit which is not true and no such thing.   

He would not have been able to hunt the 4rth day with out the change.
On day 3, he had his aggregate limit of 14 ducks under the old rule.

I'm not sure what you are getting at with the travel rule.

Can't believe you said that because I typed in clear English no such thing as travel rule.

But you have been saying possession limit ends after the hunter travels home.

Also you are defining the hunters home or freezer can't be in the specified geographical area.  How are you so sure of that?

What aggregate limit are you talking about?   

[bigtex]

Feds also have no laws that ban spinners as well. 

Not really true. While there is no federal ban on "spinners" (motorized decoys), there is a provision of the federal migratory bird treaty act which prohibits violating state laws while migratory bird hunting.

50 CFR 20.72
No person shall at any time, by any means or in any manner, take, possess, transport, or export any migratory bird, or any part, nest, or egg of any such bird, in violation of any applicable law or regulation of any State.

USFWS officers have said that if you are using a "spinner" and have shot (taken) a migratory bird then they can charge you with this offense because you shot the bird with the aid of an illegal decoy per state law. What the officer will do is cite you for 50 CFR 20.72 and adopt the state offense.

[Fishnclifff]

[/quote]

So then why are you so sure you know everything about these possession limit law?   
[/quote]

Never said I do. I have researched this for 2 yrs and no one can absolutely define the possession law out side of the definition given in the Sate rule book under " Summary of federal Rules"
Also the definition of when possession ends in the links I have provided.

But you have been saying possession limit ends after the hunter travels home.
No. Possession in the field ends at your car. Possession ends when you gift your birds to anyone at your home or theirs, or take them to a taxidermy.

Also you are defining the hunters home or freezer can't be in the specified geographical area.  How are you so sure of that?
Never said that. Your home can be near the place taken-ie-- you hunt your private pond and take yor birds to the house when done.

What aggregate limit are you talking about? 
Aggregate daily limit. Which is now 3 times the daily limit.
You may now be in possession of 21 birds on a 3 day hunt, instead of 14.