Another pen raised trophy kill trying to get attention as new world record...

[bearpaw]

Do we want to control nature that much, so that wild animals are 100% disease free?

That's a good question that requires considerable thought. Disease certainly drives evolution so perhaps we don't want all wild animals to be vaccinated and disease free, however, hoof rot probably should be a major consideration before it spreads further. 

I think there is a place for private herds, in fact some species would be extinct if it wasn't for private herds. I guess that we just have to find ground in the middle that works out for the most people and for the animals. I'm sorry it bothers you that someone in Idaho owns an elk herd, as long as they keep them contained and disease free it doesn't bother me in the least. In fact, just like fish hatcheries, I'm glad we have them. 

[bobcat]

What species were saved by private herds? I can't think of any. Unless you're talking about some other continent.

Another thing about elk farms, in my opinion, is that they give all hunters a "black eye." People who live in the city know nothing about hunting, and already think hunters hunt only because they enjoy KILLING things. Then they hear about these canned hunting operations, and their ideas about hunting are reinforced.

As I said before, luckily Washington state does not allow game farming. It's illegal in other states as well- Wyoming for one.

[bobcat]

As for fish hatcheries- I do think we very well may have been better off if we hadn't come to rely on them so much for keeping our rivers and oceans full of fish. Without hatcheries, people would have been forced into taking care of the most important thing of all- quality habitat. Then we could have plenty of wild fish and no need for hatcheries. But, it's too late now, the damage has been done, and we're stuck with hatcheries, for the most part.

[JLS]

As for fish hatcheries- I do think we very well may have been better off if we hadn't come to rely on them so much for keeping our rivers and oceans full of fish. Without hatcheries, people would have been forced into taking care of the most important thing of all- quality habitat. Then we could have plenty of wild fish and no need for hatcheries. But, it's too late now, the damage has been done, and we're stuck with hatcheries, for the most part.

Couldn't agree more with this one.  We ignored the canary in the coal mine in order to keep fisherman happy.

[Kazekurt]

If someone is hunting on a game farm for their trophies , then they probably aren't competing  for animals with most of us on this site so perhaps  these  types of  hunts are helping to spread us out.  Everyone's definition of a quality hunt is different , but I'm glad the good lord blessed me with great health, and a father  that taught me to find enjoyment and success in the hunt and not just in the  animal.  Not all trophy hunts involve trophy animals and not all trophy animals involve a trophy hunt.  To each their own but I'm rolling old school:-)

[_TONY_]

Game farms and fish hatcheries are two completely different things and I don't think they should be compared to each other...

Game farms are privately owned and the stocks are contained within the facility. Where as hatcheries are tax payer funded and stocks are released into wild rivers by the millions, and thus out competing gravel born wild smolts for available food. If some of the few returning fish do not make it into the collection, they will ultimately make it to the gravel and mix with wild stock creating an inferior spawn... Btw for each fish that returns costs the tax payers roughly 1000  or more...

Still think hatcheries are good?

I have no issues with game farms, but that's as long as the herd stays whithin the facility and has no way of interbreeding with wild stocks.

I wonder if anyone's ever had a mount done that included the plastic ear tag 

Tony

[Blue Mountain Adventures]

To each their own, as far as hunting high fenced farms or fair chase. What I have an issue with is a growing trend of world records getting killed that were obviously raised on a game farm, only to be released to get killed "fair chase" so they could be the new "world record". Its an ego trip to the "hunter" and the guides. Its all about ego and money.

Its sad deer like this one in question are even in question! I hope Lemon comes forward and explains this situation. If he is guilty of what allot of people think....his reputation is tarnished forever.

[rosscrazyelk]

Rule #1  of Kazekurt 's standard of trophies and trophy hunts.

If you have to lie, exaggerate, or misrepresent the facts to make people think you or your accomplishments are great..., your not and they're not.  If they were worthy of praise you would have no problem being truthful and if you're willing to break this rule you're admitting  your accomplishment  requires embellishment to be noteworthy.

I like the way you think

[blacktailer]

Apparently it scored 226"
I wouldn't worry about a record being broken.

one of the articles I read said it beat the old world record by over 5 inches.  226 3/8 vs 221 2/8

  Time to study the record books.

The Burris buck netted 226 1/2.  Someone mentioned earlier that record books are meant to honor the animal and not the hunter.    I mostly agree with this, and that is why I have always liked the B & C scoring system.  Hunted trophies need to be taken under fair chase rules.  Deadheads are also allowed but are noted as such.  There is no place for canned or high fence trophies in the B & C.  The SCI has a place for these trophies and are noted as such in their record keeping. 
High fences aren't for me, but I don't have any problem with them.   To each their own as long as they are being regulated and are not cross contaminating our wild herds.  Still haven't head an answer on Bearpaws question of whether or not the Lemon's claimed this buck to be a wild, free ranging deer???

[Damnimissed]

To me public land, DIY hunts are the best and hold the most weight for a trophy, even if they don't score the highest

Seriously, any public land Rosie bull or 3pt blacktail is trophy to me. The trophy is in the eye of the beholder.

[bearpaw]

Btw for each fish that returns costs the tax payers roughly 1000  or more...

I'm wondering where you got this number?

To each their own, as far as hunting high fenced farms or fair chase. What I have an issue with is a growing trend of world records getting killed that were obviously raised on a game farm, only to be released to get killed "fair chase" so they could be the new "world record". Its an ego trip to the "hunter" and the guides. Its all about ego and money.

Its sad deer like this one in question are even in question! I hope Lemon comes forward and explains this situation. If he is guilty of what allot of people think....his reputation is tarnished forever.

I still have to play devil's advocate, has anyone come up with any solid evidence about these rumors and speculation or is that all they are? What record animals are documented to have been raised domestically and then released in the wild? Just looking for some solid evidence other than rumors!

Game farms and fish hatcheries are two completely different things and I don't think they should be compared to each other...

Seem like the same principal to me. 

As for fish hatcheries- I do think we very well may have been better off if we hadn't come to rely on them so much for keeping our rivers and oceans full of fish. Without hatcheries, people would have been forced into taking care of the most important thing of all- quality habitat. Then we could have plenty of wild fish and no need for hatcheries. But, it's too late now, the damage has been done, and we're stuck with hatcheries, for the most part.

I'm not so sure habitat is the issue, could it be that humans (all humans) and predators are simply taking too many fish?

What about trout hatcheries that are raising fish for lowland lakes?
What about pheasants, turkey's and our sheep herds that were transplanted?
What about the wolves that were brought in form Canada and released?
What about the Mexican wolves that were raised domestically and released?

Now we even have sturgeon hatcheries that are replenishing sturgeon!

[bobcat]

What about trout hatcheries that are raising fish for lowland lakes?

I will only comment on this. The way I see it, actually I can't believe they have done what they've done without environmental organizations complaining, and filing lawsuits.

 I can't imagine that planting non-native trout in many lowland lakes has not caused the extinction of several native species. I know the native cutthroat trout in some of the lakes in this area are gone, and I assume it's due to the state planting rainbow and brown trout.

When man tries to "help" nature it's not always such a good thing.  IMO

[Todd_ID]

Here's some food for thought on this buck: notice the date of the article and the text saying SCI.

http://www.huntingreport.com/hunting_article_details.cfm?id=2238

[Bullkllr]

While I'm not sure that planted fish and farmed elk are really equitable, more and more hatchery plants are being shut down because of ESA listings/wild fish impacts.

Interesting read here http://www.huffingtonpost.com/david-petersen/canned-hunting_b_1507706.html

Exerpt from noted biologist Valerius Geist: "Game farming is utterly incompatible with the maintenance of free-roaming wildlife on this continent, standing in direct opposition to all four basic tenets of the North American Model of Wildlife Conservation and democratic hunting"

One thing is clear to me; it's a rather complicated issue...

[bearpaw]

Here's some food for thought on this buck: notice the date of the article and the text saying SCI.

http://www.huntingreport.com/hunting_article_details.cfm?id=2238

I don' know him at all, but I'm wondering if someone isn't just spreading bad rumors to discredit Lemon because they don't like him? Nobody has shown any evidence to substantiate these rumors are at all true?