HB 2143 Genetically Engingeered Fish

[bigtex]

HB 2143 regarding genetically modified fish was introduced by Rep Condotta (R) this week. The bill would make it a fish and wildlife gross misdemeanor for each genetically engineered salmon that is produced. It would also make it illegal under the state health code to sell genetically engineered salmon.

(1) The legislature finds that nature has provided little to the people of the Pacific Northwest with a greater cultural, ecological, and economic value as the native runs of wild salmon that nurse in our local waters and, after an unimaginable journey, return home to repeat the ageless cycle. Although the natural rhythm of the salmonid pulses without human intervention, choices made by the residents of Washington can have a dramatic effect on the continuance of the very species that has served as a cornerstone of northwest culture for countless generations.
(2) The legislature further finds that the value of salmon exceeds culture, economy, and even the environment. Salmon, as a food source, represent a very need of human existence. So much so that an important and well-intended industry has taken to Washington waters and harnessed its clean, cool properties to raise salmon and other finfish in net pens.
(3) The legislature further finds that, although great investments continue to be made in net pen technology to avoid escapes, the use of genetically modified finfish in net pens create an unacceptable risk to the native salmon of the Pacific Northwest; genetics that are developed specifically and irreplaceably for each individual run of salmon.

(1) "Genetically engineered" means any organism or organisms in which the genetic material of the organism or organisms has been changed through the application of in vitro nucleic acid techniques or the direct injection of nucleic acid into cells or organelles of the organism or organisms.

(1) No person may produce genetically engineered finfish in state waters.
(2) A violation of this section is a gross misdemeanor. Each instance of a genetically engineered salmonid being produced is an individual violation of this section.

http://apps.leg.wa.gov/documents/billdocs/2013-14/Pdf/Bills/House%20Bills/2143.pdf

[huntnphool]

No more triploids?

[bigtex]

No more triploids?

Honestly, I have no clue 

The bill is so confusing that it really needs to be reviewed.

[mossback91]

No more triploids?

Triploids aren't necessarily genetically engineered though are they? From what I understand a triploid could happen naturally. Nothing is removed or applied to the cells and so on.

All they do is change water temp the eggs are in

[Special T]

Possibly, Triploids have an extra chromozone preventing breeding making them grow much larger. IDK the process used however.

[mossback91]

I think it is mainly referring to the atlantic salmon that has Chinook salmon dna stuck into it.

Triploids are made by changing water temps the fertilized eggs are in or changing pressure in it.

[jackmaster]

i wish they would genetically alter salmon so they can come up river and spawn and then head back out to sea, that would so awesome, could you imagine fighting a 200 king, that is chrome bright and wants to live  oh snap, what a fight that would be, bring it on, triploids are genetically altered arent they? yep....

[snowpack]

No more triploids?

Triploids aren't necessarily genetically engineered though are they? From what I understand a triploid could happen naturally. Nothing is removed or applied to the cells and so on.

All they do is change water temp the eggs are in

  Could happen in a number of species naturally, but they do it with water temps.  It is genetic engineering in a sense, just not in vitro, which looks like this bill focuses on.

[arees]

Rep. Condotta should give up their legislative position so they can have more time to focus on bad poetry.  The first three items could be replaced with "the use of genetically modified finfish in net pens create an unacceptable risk to the native salmon of the Pacific Northwest" in order to save the environmental cost of wasted paper and wasted time spent reading this drivel.

What does "produce" mean in the 3rd item (1)?  If I hatch them elsewhere were the produced there and just grown here?

[wapiti hunter2]

No more triploids?

How are Triploids made?

If the egg is physically shocked shortly after fertilisation occurs, then it is possible to produce a fish with three sets of chromosomes, a triploid fish. The egg does not in fact manufacture an extra set for itself. The extra genetic information actually comes from the female parent and is present before fertilisation. Under normal unshocked fertilisation this information is lost from the egg as it is fertilised. But a shock, such as an increase in temperature, physical shaking or an increase in environmental pressure prevents this information leaving the fertilised cell. There is no genetic modification. Genes have not been changed or manufactured. The number of chromosomes are increased because a set are not lost on fertilisation. The fertilised egg is left with three copies of genetic information rather than two. Two from the mother, and one from the father. Triploid fish grow and develop as normal. After all they have the same information within them as diploid fish. But when it comes to producing eggs for themselves, the three sets of information do not divide conveniently and so no viable eggs are produced by hen fish. Triploid males do not produce viable sperm.

[Dhoey07]

No more triploids?

Honestly, I have no clue 

The bill is so confusing that it really needs to be reviewed.

The bill says salmon, not trout.  Also, would this bill apply to the general public, wdfw and tribe hatcheries, or just the general public?

[Knocker of rocks]

The bill says salmon, not trout.  Also, would this bill apply to the general public, wdfw and tribe hatcheries, or just the general public?

I think you could make the argument that trout are a salmon


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trout

[Dhoey07]

The bill says salmon, not trout.  Also, would this bill apply to the general public, wdfw and tribe hatcheries, or just the general public?

I think you could make the argument that trout are a salmon


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trout

I don't think you could. The state considers trout a game fish

 (4) "Salmon" means all species of the genus Oncorhynchus, except
7 those classified as game fish in RCW 77.08.020, and includes:
8 SCIENTIFIC NAME COMMON NAME
9 Oncorhynchus tshawytscha Chinook salmon or king salmon
10 Oncorhynchus kisutch Coho salmon or silver salmon
11 Oncorhynchus keta Chum or "keta" salmon
12 Oncorhynchus gorbuscha Pink salmon
13 Oncorhynchus nerka Sockeye or "red" salmon
14 Salmo salar (in other than Atlantic salmon

I think what the bill is trying to do is get the farming of atlantic salmon out of Washington since it does not include triploids, tiger trout,  or tiger musky

[Knocker of rocks]

Makes sense

[fastdam]

I agree with any law that protects life from eugenics programs.  I like this law. I hope it has teeth.

[Knocker of rocks]

Eugenics is something completely different 

[nwwanderer]

A tool in the box that feeds billions.  Let us just throw it out because it is not understood.  Can you imagine the pressure on wild stocks without artificial food production?  Is this guy going to pick the billions that starve to death?  Stay tuned, he is on witch hunt.

[Knocker of rocks]

Is he the only one on a witch hunt?

[pianoman9701]

I think the bill is too broad. There are new farming techniques which filter the water and render waste, use tanks to keep the fish confined and unable to escape at all. Although the intent of the bill is good, I believe they need to consider that there are currently eco-safe farming techniques which are being employed that could benefit our economy and not hurt our native stocks.

It's interesting that the depleting of natural wild stocks of fish through hatchery production is not addressed at all. This has already proved to be a far bigger threat to our wild salmon and steelhead stocks than farmed fish, in my opinion.

[nwwanderer]

Many witch hunters out there.  This is a strange mix of political types.  Some of the most extreme conservatives and most rabid liberals are aligned.

[fastdam]

Eugenics is something completely different 

No its not.all genetic science is a continuation of Nazi eugenics programs.   as a christian i would also call geneticly engineered animals abominations.  God made life. The Devil corrupts it. Men are arrogant.   Genetic engineering is a giant threat to all life on the planet.

  Geneticly engineered fish are not going to keep populations from starving. Permaculture farming practices would help with that.

[pianoman9701]

Eugenics is something completely different 

No its not.all genetic science is a continuation of Nazi eugenics programs.   as a christian i would also call geneticly engineered animals abominations.  God made life. The Devil corrupts it. Men are arrogant.   Genetic engineering is a giant threat to all life on the planet.

  Geneticly engineered fish are not going to keep populations from starving. Permaculture farming practices would help with that.

Really? On what do you base that opinion other than god, the devil, and abominations? Food technology absolutely helps feed more people every day and genetic engineering to increase yield is part of that.

[fastdam]

It is large agri-business that prevents people from taking care of themselves. The government often pays farmers to NOT farm thier fields. We all know that. Big agri-business uses toxic farming practices that hurt the land, and support legislation which interferes with the individuals ability to successfully produce food crops.  Thier bottom line is ALWAYS profit and has nothinh to do with feeding hungry people.  Large corporations work hand in hand with government. Both have been involved in depopulation efforts and that is the reason for many starving populations.  Its poitical.   Geneticly engineered fish farms are ran by these institutions and will have disregard for anything but profit.    If you dont believe it then watch some documentaries. There is plenty of info out there that explains it.

 Also, i dont need another reason other than God to for that opinion. There is no better reason.   God makes life and does a great job of it.  Politics cause people to go hungry. Not a shortage of fish.

[singleshot12]

 

[pianoman9701]

It is large agri-business that prevents people from taking care of themselves. The government often pays farmers to NOT farm thier fields. We all know that. Big agri-business uses toxic farming practices that hurt the land, and support legislation which interferes with the individuals ability to successfully produce food crops.  Thier bottom line is ALWAYS profit and has nothinh to do with feeding hungry people.  Large corporations work hand in hand with government. Both have been involved in depopulation efforts and that is the reason for many starving populations.  Its poitical.   Geneticly engineered fish farms are ran by these institutions and will have disregard for anything but profit.    If you dont believe it then watch some documentaries. There is plenty of info out there that explains it.

 Also, i dont need another reason other than God to for that opinion. There is no better reason.   God makes life and does a great job of it.  Politics cause people to go hungry. Not a shortage of fish.

I personally know of farms that aren't connected to big agra business, so using that scare tactic doesn't work. I'm also glad you have confidence in God, but using religion as a justification for passing laws is something the founding fathers were against. I am too. I have no intention of ignoring technology simply because someone's beliefs say it's evil. I'll stop short of giving my opinion about that.

[huntnphool]

 AquaBounty Technologies proposes cultivating only sterile females. They claim escapees could not reproduce, either natively or by interbreeding with wild stocks, because they are all triploid, with three sets of chromosomes. They plan to provide farmers with eggs rather than fish, and proposed that AquaAdvantage fish only be raised in land-based facilities

[fastdam]

People rely on thier personal ideals to decide if they support laws or do not. Religion has a huge impact on peoples ideals. There is nothing wrong with that. Nor did the founding fathers have a problem with people practicing thier religion the way they see fit.

 The general notion that scientists have to create un-natural experimental lab creations to feed hungry people is absurd. Its only one food source and fish are abundant. The ocean is huge and has lots and lots of life in it.

 You are what you eat, literally. I choose to trust God,nature and natural selection as opposed to politicians, scientists, corporations and governmental buerocrocies. You asked why i believed the way i believed and so i answered you.
 

[wapiti hunter2]

The bill says salmon, not trout.  Also, would this bill apply to the general public, wdfw and tribe hatcheries, or just the general public?

The Bill states:

NEW SECTION. Sec. 3. A new section is added to chapter 77.125 RCW
23 to read as follows:
24 (1) No person may produce genetically engineered finfish in state
25 waters.
26 (2) A violation of this section is a gross misdemeanor. Each
27 instance of a genetically engineered salmonid being produced is an
28 individual violation of this section.

[wapiti hunter2]

The biggest scare is accidental release into the wild. A quote I came across in an article. "According to a Purdue University computer model that tracked the effects of releasing just 60 "Frankenfish" into a population of 60,000, there was a complete extinction of the normal fish in just 40 fish generations. It appears the larger size, which attracted mates more easily, combined with a slight reduction in survival rates, was a killer combination." The Canadians are in an uproar over this.

It only takes a few to escape and breed. Once that happens, AquaBounty will legally own every salmon in the ocean. The potential for accidental release is huge.  There is no such thing as a release proof hatchery. It will only take a few. Also, No sterilization technique is 100%. AquaBounty: "sterilization technique is not foolproof."  Especially when you are dealing with millions of eggs at a time.

Another quote I came across in an article.

In June 2011, NOAA Administrator Dr. Jane Lubchenco released a National Aquaculture Policy to guide how marine aquaculture proceeds in our ocean waters. While the policy includes some strong environmental provisions, it does not categorically prohibit the growing of GE fish in the ocean. It should.  The profit models for this fish to produce big bucks all require growing in the ocean.  As soon as that happens, the seals/sea lions will tear the nets to shreads just like they do today with the atlantic salmon.  It will all be over with in a flash.

There is no requirement to label these fish in the market place. They will be labeled  Salmon.

[pianoman9701]

People rely on thier personal ideals to decide if they support laws or do not. Religion has a huge impact on peoples ideals. There is nothing wrong with that. Nor did the founding fathers have a problem with people practicing thier religion the way they see fit.

 The general notion that scientists have to create un-natural experimental lab creations to feed hungry people is absurd. Its only one food source and fish are abundant. The ocean is huge and has lots and lots of life in it.

 You are what you eat, literally. I choose to trust God,nature and natural selection as opposed to politicians, scientists, corporations and governmental buerocrocies. You asked why i believed the way i believed and so i answered you.

The ocean has far less life in it than it did only 20 years ago. The notion that there's plenty of fish and we don't need to do anything to sustain that is at best, uninformed, as evidenced by dwindling stocks of sea bass, different species of tuna, and many other species which were formerly abundant. If the world continues to eat fish and our population continues to grow, aquaculture will be increasingly necessary to meet demand. Because I don't subscribe to the belief that the world is coming to its end as fulfillment of prophecy and dwindling sea resources are just a symptom of that, I want to see advances in seafood production, advances which include anything that will safely and responsibly produce more fish.

I do respect your beliefs. We just don't share the same ones. We'll have to disagree on this one, Fast. Thanks for the civil discourse. 

[pianoman9701]

The biggest scare is accidental release into the wild. A quote I came across in an article. "According to a Purdue University computer model that tracked the effects of releasing just 60 "Frankenfish" into a population of 60,000, there was a complete extinction of the normal fish in just 40 fish generations. It appears the larger size, which attracted mates more easily, combined with a slight reduction in survival rates, was a killer combination." The Canadians are in an uproar over this.

It only takes a few to escape and breed. Once that happens, AquaBounty will legally own every salmon in the ocean. The potential for accidental release is huge.  There is no such thing as a release proof hatchery. It will only take a few. Also, No sterilization technique is 100%. AquaBounty: "sterilization technique is not foolproof."  Especially when you are dealing with millions of eggs at a time.

Another quote I came across in an article.

In June 2011, NOAA Administrator Dr. Jane Lubchenco released a National Aquaculture Policy to guide how marine aquaculture proceeds in our ocean waters. While the policy includes some strong environmental provisions, it does not categorically prohibit the growing of GE fish in the ocean. It should.  The profit models for this fish to produce big bucks all require growing in the ocean.  As soon as that happens, the seals/sea lions will tear the nets to shreads just like they do today with the atlantic salmon.  It will all be over with in a flash.

There is no requirement to label these fish in the market place. They will be labeled  Salmon.

I agree with this wholeheartedly. There are three salmon farms in BC right now which are being used to write the new Canadian standards for commercial fish farming. They have solved problems of waste and contamination, parasite introduction, and escape. The government has closely monitored their success. In the US with some in WA, there are quite a few new plants designed in the same fashion.