Don't waste your time looking at the 2013 harvest report.

[HoofsandWings]

The report is totally wrong. WDFW has been notified. As an example, it shows cows have antlers.
Also, the number of animals by category, spike, 3, 4, 5 and 6 point plus do not add up to the number of animals harvested.

[bobcat]

Right. I posted about that same issue last night. It's only the general season elk data. Special permit deer and elk data appears to be fine, as well as the general season deer data.


I do believe the success rates shown for general season elk are correct, so it is still somewhat useful if you want to compare units, or compare 2013 data to 2012 data.

[snowpack]

I have to wonder how it gets so hosed up?  Most people enter their data from a computer.  Do some still do it by phone?  When I enter in all my animals it is in an electronic format for them.  I doubt they have a person re-entering it into another system.     Just seems like the tech is there to have harvest reports done and 100% by 11 days after the last hunt of the year.

[HoofsandWings]

I have to wonder how it gets so hosed up?  Most people enter their data from a computer.  Do some still do it by phone?  When I enter in all my animals it is in an electronic format for them.  I doubt they have a person re-entering it into another system.     Just seems like the tech is there to have harvest reports done and 100% by 11 days after the last hunt of the year.

Most likely, someone had the formula wrong in an excel spreadsheet. Wrong column or wrong row was used in the summary calculations.
Also, there was a possible error in importing the data into excel.
The data was most likely stored in a SAS dataset, but there are other statistical languages out there.

[HoofsandWings]

I have to wonder how it gets so hosed up?  Most people enter their data from a computer.  Do some still do it by phone?  When I enter in all my animals it is in an electronic format for them.  I doubt they have a person re-entering it into another system.     Just seems like the tech is there to have harvest reports done and 100% by 11 days after the last hunt of the year.

Qcing or quality control checking is an art form. I do not know what is like now, but years ago, the qc person had a print out of the raw data (per person reporting, per animal)
He would then hand calculate all of the numbers you see in the harvest report, but he would select only some units.
The art form comes in when he chooses which units to hand check.
There are people out there when given a whole lot of stuff, choose one or two and those turn out to be the ones with the bad data. I have seen them with my own eyes. Companies when they discover such a person, pay them much more than the going wage. I have seen it when the guy saves the company millions of dollars due to his gift.
And the problem is those guys don't work for the government unless money is not a motivator.

[bbarnes]

Copy and paste look at the bulls killed in the Lewis river unit.Its all BS they think hunters are stupid,it's all about them justifying tags sales to the law makers.Just look what they did this year with cow tags on the east side,after they killed off 70 % of the elk in SW Washington.If there looking for revenue charge archers for a cow tag or doe tag.

[bearpaw]

I wondered about the increase in Colockum cow elk tags, isn't this an area where the elk herd is under objective? Seems that has been a hot topic in the recent past?

[bobcat]

It's fixed now.


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[rtspring]

Harvest reports are false! Always have been.  If a guy constantly kills a animal in a unit, do you really think that he turns in a true report? I know many who don't.

Next thing you know they will change the regs to limit your harvest.  I have said it all along, their counting of animals and harvest reports are greatly mistaken by many.

Rtspring.

[D-Rock425]

Harvest reports are false! Always have been.  If a guy constantly kills a animal in a unit, do you really think that he turns in a true report? I know many who don't.

Next thing you know they will change the regs to limit your harvest.  I have said it all along, their counting of animals and harvest reports are greatly mistaken by many.

Rtspring.

its a conspiracy right?

[ballpark]

I thought I forgot how to count   Was questioning myself waiting for someone to see what I was seeing.  Glad to see I haven't I can still count. 

[rtspring]

Harvest reports are false! Always have been.  If a guy constantly kills a animal in a unit, do you really think that he turns in a true report? I know many who don't.

Next thing you know they will change the regs to limit your harvest.  I have said it all along, their counting of animals and harvest reports are greatly mistaken by many.

Rtspring.

its a conspiracy right?

Conspiracy? Not sure bout that, but misleading wrong information yes! They the WDFW haved lied to us hunters more times than we can count.  I just don't believe their numbers

[bobcat]

The numbers they provide are the numbers they get from us when we do our harvest reports. If it's inaccurate, that's on us, not the WDFW.

Any of you who provide false information in the harvest reports should be ashamed of yourselves, and you have no room to complain about the management of wildlife in this state.

[h20hunter]

But but but but they are the bad guys! But but but but they are to blame for wolves! But but but but but I have to buy a discover pass.

Good point....lets lie to them and then b&m that they do a bad job.

[D-Rock425]

The numbers they provide are the numbers they get from us when we do our harvest reports. If it's inaccurate, that's on us, not the WDFW.

Any of you who provide false information in the harvest reports should be ashamed of yourselves, and you have no room to complain about the management of wildlife in this state.

[D-Rock425]

It seems rtspring and the game department aren't friends   I wonder why?

[buckfvr]

I wish my memory served me better, but I do know I read where wdfw uses a mathematical formula with actual reports to cover non reports.............so in esence, you are seeing a contrived report.

[rtspring]

The numbers they provide are the numbers they get from us when we do our harvest reports. If it's inaccurate, that's on us, not the WDFW.

Any of you who provide false information in the harvest reports should be ashamed of yourselves, and you have no room to complain about the management of wildlife in this state.

Wrong! They get unit herd numbers by flyovers, and bio's counting elk and such.  Those numbers are wrong. As for accurate harvest reports by individuals, those numbers are wrong! Bash all you want, believe what you want.

Fact, some of us have had enough of the unfair BS we get! Indians dont give reports on how many spikes, branch antlered bulls, cows, calves they take? So tell me please Mr. Do Gooder why the heck should I? 

They lied for years about wolves behind all of our backs! And they still are? You are buying a license and a tag to kill a elk, but yet WDFW are telling you one thing but doing another!  So tell me how that is fair?

You go buy a car and are told it comes with 4 tires, but yet after you sign the dotted line it comes out and only has three!! Their misleading you when you buy tags in this state! 

To each is his own, but I'm not ashamed of anyone who gets one over on the WDFW! I have spent thousands and donated more time and money to the wildlife in this state and refuse to sit back and listen to their lies. 

PS. You can check my reports anytime about my kills, I report. But many do not. Thats a fact..

When it becomes a fair playing field for all, I will climb aboard the train, until then I will go solo.

[D-Rock425]

I wish my memory served me better, but I do know I read where wdfw uses a mathematical formula with actual reports to cover non reports.............so in esence, you are seeing a contrived report.

I don't think so because they never have 100% of the reports turned in.  It tells you the number of reports submitted.

[rtspring]

It seems rtspring and the game department aren't friends   I wonder why?

This has nothing to do with that deal. Its over and done with.  But I can promise you I spend more time in 346 than any bio or gamie does. I know the animals and for years have said their numbers are misleading.  Can I prove it, no because a truely accurate number is unachievable. 

I know my stuff when it comes to that unit, cocky? No but seems funny how I seem to have a vast knowledge of the animals there. It has come with time in the field. 

[boneaddict]

Lets just say I paid my 10 bucks this year.   OOoops.   You guys trying to use this data to come to an informed decision are screwed.   

[buckfvr]

I wish my memory served me better, but I do know I read where wdfw uses a mathematical formula with actual reports to cover non reports.............so in esence, you are seeing a contrived report.

I don't think so because they never have 100% of the reports turned in.  It tells you the number of reports submitted.

I read it for a fact................you cant pick one number to justify the whole report...the equation doesnt have to represent 100%.

[RB]

I wish my memory served me better, but I do know I read where wdfw uses a mathematical formula with actual reports to cover non reports.............so in esence, you are seeing a contrived report.

I don't think so because they never have 100% of the reports turned in.  It tells you the number of reports submitted.

I read it for a fact................you cant pick one number to justify the whole report...the equation doesnt have to represent 100%.

I believe they do the same for Halibut can't check every boat so an estimate is done. Ten boats go out with 3 guys each that means 50 Halibut were caught averaging 100 pounds a piece which means 10,000 pounds of Halibut were caught and season is only open for two days. I think my math is correct???

[snowpack]

Lets just say I paid my 10 bucks this year.   OOoops.   You guys trying to use this data to come to an informed decision are screwed.   

I see lots and lots and lots of guys paying the $10 right before deer season.  Most say the same thing.  "I aint no good with them dern computers.  I told me youngins to do it fer me." 

[matt345]

The numbers they provide are the numbers they get from us when we do our harvest reports. If it's inaccurate, that's on us, not the WDFW.

Any of you who provide false information in the harvest reports should be ashamed of yourselves, and you have no room to complain about the management of wildlife in this state.

 

[bbarnes]

Let me do the math for you in the Lewis river in 2012 they said,in there trends and status report there were 295 bulls harvested.The WDFW also says 1 out of 25 elk is a bull.They also say there is 12,500 total elk in the Mt.Saint Helens herd.That stretches from the COAST to GLENWOOD WASHINGTON,a lot of GMUS and square miles.So if we go 295 x 25 that equals 7,375 total elk in Lewis River GMU.That leaves 5,125 for all the other units?So I can tell you there numbers are way off,and this is what they base there TAGS on.We all want a quality of hunt in this state I know I do,at this rate good luck.The real formula is we have a budget with X amount of employees and wages,we need vehicles, gas ,uniforms ,office equipment ,etc, etc.Untill people start calling the director and Dave Ware,and holding them accountable for there actions ,nothing is going to change except LESS WILDLIFE.Get involved if you have time to type and look at all these forums you can make a call.Tell them you want facts and figures ,and answers.

[Bwana Bob]

On the goat hunts Chelan North and Lincoln cliffs had zero success but had the the # of goats seen but no hunter days, strange. I can't believe that those 3 hunters did not hunt for goats.
I think hunters that draw oil tags should get dinged $50 if they don't supply info on their hunt. With so few tags ever body's  data is important.

[coachcw]

just another way a state system wastes money , winter counts are the best way , spring fly overs give a close count to where the elk are during fall hunts . guys that expect harvest reports to help them are looking for a free cookie . pound the trails boys .

[bobcat]

Harvest reports aren't a waste of money. It's the most inexpensive  method they have of gauging population and harvest trends. The numbers may not be 100% accurate, but looking at those numbers as they increase or decrease over time sure can be very beneficial in knowing whether populations are going up, down, or remaining relatively stable. You might notice the WDFW isn't the only state game department that keeps track of the number of animals harvested by hunters and hunter success rates.


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[northwesthunter84]

You know what I have learned for the areas that I hunt less than 2x the number of rifle hunters to archery hunters but on average 4.5x the number of bulls killed goes to rifle hunters.  Thank God we get to shoot some cows and they don't.  There wouldn't be an elk herd at all.

[huntnnw]

never looked at them never will

[Fullabull]

All I know is they have successfully reduced the Archery success rates to a point where they can't hide behind the numbers they provide. I still want them to provide a breakdown of all the special hunts so we can really see how many more branch bulls the MF harvest compared to archery. But they won't do that because its way in their favor! They show you want they want you to see!

[bobcat]

I still want them to provide a breakdown of all the special hunts so we can really see how many more branch bulls the MF harvest compared to archery.

You mean like this data?


http://wdfw.wa.gov/hunting/harvest/2013/reports/elk_hunt_name.php

[Fullabull]

Sorry Bobcat, I said it incorrectly. You are correct, they do break it down well. I wanted to say I would like them to show the numbers like they do for general season (without the breakdown). By bad! I think it would be good for them to show the numbers both ways so people can get a good idea of the branch bull harvests for all hunting methods.

[bobcat]

General season? They have that data as well. That is if I'm understanding you correctly.

http://wdfw.wa.gov/hunting/harvest/2013/reports/elk_gmu_all.php

[snowpack]

It was interesting to see that the numbers of elk hunters overall increased in 2013 after years of a downward trend.  All kinds of predictions of a further loss with timber company permits, disco passes, license increases, etc.

[bobcat]

Fullabull, so are you saying you'd like to see the data so it's not broke down by GMU, and only by hunting method?


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[snowpack]

I think he wants the third table down on the main elk page--between general and multiple tag.
It shows the totals for special permits.

[Fullabull]

Yes, sorry for the confusion. Would like to see special draw information combined but so everyone can see the branch bull numbers. I think it would be good to show the %'s of branch bulls taken for each weapon. Just like they show but separate what each weapon category and add up the columns also.
Kind of like this:
4 point   5 point   6 point   Total   
221            272           106            599     AR
729            545           187           1461   MF

[dis_pat_]

The data needs to be in a database accessed with Microsoft SSRS with customizable reporting via the web.  Excel has too many limitations.

All states' data needs to be loaded into a single system in the same format.  Where's the damn business model for this?

ETA: screw Oracle, Teradata and Linux
ETA2: and IBM Cognos

[Fullabull]

OK, lets see if this works. This is what I'm talking about showing for special permits. They always make things look equal for General season but they never show these numbers because it really shows the disparity between Archery and the other two hunting methods.
This is from the 2013 Harvest report numbers:

Quality Bull Hunt MF         
Hunters   251   Permits   305   
Spike  2 Point   3 Point   4 Point   5 + Point
8        3              6             20             116
Total Bulls   153   Success   61%   
   Branch Bull Success   54%   

Quality Bull Hunt AR         
Hunters   406   Permits   580   
Spike     2 Point   3 Point    4 Point    5 + Point
5        2          0              5              57
Total Bulls   69   Success   17%   
   Branch Bull Success   15%   

Quality Bull Hunt ML         
Hunters   108   Permits   141   
Spike     2 Point   3 Point    4 Point    5 + Point
3        2              0              3               42
Total Bulls   50   Success   46%   
   Branch Bull Success   41%   

Bull Elk Permits MF         
Hunters   482   Permits   598   
Spike     2 Point   3 Point    4 Point    5 + Point
16        8         8             30              146
Total Bulls   208   Success   43%   
   Branch Bull Success   36%   

Bull Elk Permits AR         
Hunters   60   Permits   87   
Spike     2 Point   3 Point    4 Point    5 + Point
   2        0              2              0              13
Total Bulls   17   Success   28%   
   Branch Bull Success   22%   

Bull Elk Permits ML         
Hunters   48   Permits   71   
Spike    2 Point   3 Point    4 Point    5 + Point
 2               0             0                1               11
Total Bulls   14   Success   29%   
   Branch Bull Success   25%