Youth Left Behind

[mhbrewster71]

I am new to this site and this email may stir up some controversy, but I am sending this on behalf of OUR youth. I read the posts for youth elk permits, which is what prompted me to join this site. On April 30th 2014 I sent a letter to DFW in regards to our youth-the future of conservation/hunting/fishing in our great State. DFW has not responded as of yet. I did, at a later date, send the same email to Senator Parlette and Representative Condotta. Both replied promptly and said they'd keep me informed. I am copying and pasting the original email I sent to DFW, below. The letter is fairly self-explanatory, but deals with more youth cow elk permits out of the increased cow permits in the Yakima/Ellensburg cow permit increases. And, allowing youth to harvest any mule deer buck.

I am hoping that DFW will increase the youth elk permit totals and allow youth to harvest any muley buck, and to make these changes prior to the permit submittal date of 5/22. Hopefully if enough of us get behind this, we can get these opportunities out there for OUR YOUTH.

Date: Wednesday, April 30, 2014
To: director@dfw.wa.gov, commission@dfw.wa.gov, wildthing@dfw.wa.gov


Dear Director Anderson, Commission members and Wildlife Program. As I go through the new hunting pamphlet I can't help but notice that once again it seems our youth, the future of our hunting and fishing and conservation in Washington State have once again been left behind. Our youth are still competing with adults for 3 point or better muley bucks in most areas. Why is that? DFW can give many reasons as to the WHY, I am sure. But if you want youth to continue to participate in big game hunting, having them compete with adults at the same time for the same deer is very discouraging. I know this because I have a son. I also have my nephews and friends who have children who are already discouraged with big game hunting because although we all enjoy the experience of being outdoors, teaching our children to be ethical and moral conservationists, the lack of success in actually harvesting an animal is disheartening. True, it's more than harvesting an animal, but why is it not ANY buck for youth in muley country? Are you concerned with parents shooting the animal and having their children tag it? Every parent I know who is a hunter would be on the phone calling DFW, state patrol or county Sherriff’s if we were to see this happen!!!! A young person who is successful, including a good clean harvest is more likely to continue the tradition of being a good conservationist and outdoorsman and pass it on to their children. Is it because the buck to doe ratio is out of whack? I clearly remember the day 30+ years ago harvesting my 1st buck! A 2 point muley! To me, it was the biggest buck in the world! From that day forward, I was hooked, as were many young men and women in my small town who were able to have similar experiences with their family and friends!! It was the TOTAL experience, a memory that will not be forgotten!!!

And, looking at the cow permit increases in the Teanaway, Colockum, Cowiche, Manastash, Little Naches, Umtanum, and those areas, between Muzzleloader, archery and rifle seasons, once again DFW dropped the ball, in my opinion. There are nearly 2000 more cow permits available in those areas, which as an adult I truly appreciate! But as a parent, am totally disheartened and disappointed that not ONE of the nearly 2000 increased permits were given to the youth!!! What would it have hurt to have given 10% of the allotment to our youth and allowed them to have the opportunity to draw a cow permit and then allow them to hunt during the bull permit season with those hunters who drew a bull tag, or at least allow them to start their hunt on the opening day of spike season so they have a somewhat better opportunity of harvesting a cow, rather than the later date with those who drew a cow permit. I am sure DFW has several responses that can appeal and oppose my thoughts, but I assure you, I AM NOT ALONE in my thoughts and concerns for the future of our youth!

I have heard that one of the concerns that DFW has is with hunter recruitment and hunter retention. If this is true, not focusing more on youth opportunities will not help in hunter recruitment and retention. I do not believe it is too late this year to do the right thing and add these for OUR youth before the permit deadline this year. It might be as simple as adding to the CHANGES page listed on your website under the Hunting Rules and Regulations Pamphlet.
Sincerely
Concerned Parent

[pianoman9701]

MH, I agree with parts of your post and disagree with some. I agree that some of those additional cow tags could be given to youth hunters and that would be an awesome use. However, when you talk about any buck in units that are 3 point and better, I have to disagree. They're limiting the bucks because they want to improve the overall population and genetics. It's one of the few times the DFW has made a decision based on biology and not which way the wind is blowing. A great lesson for youth is to teach them the importance of conservation and proper wildlife management, using hunters as a tool to achieve specific management goals. Although I agree that it would be easier for the youth if they were able to shoot any buck, I don't see that it 1. teaches them something valid about conservation, and 2. uses them, as we use all hunters, in the proper and science-based management of wildlife.

I think you're coming from a great place with your letter. I just don't particularly agree with all parts of it. Good luck in your efforts and please keep us posted on your responses and progress.
PMan

[Bullkllr]

 

Also, timing...comment period for this year's changes is well past.

[Karl Blanchard]

I agree with Pianoman.  I personally think that the central washington units should be permit only.  Our deer herds are hurting, but for the sake of the all mighty dollar, general seasons continue.  Now the cow elk hunts you hit spot on!  Youth should get their own separate, LONG, season for those cow permits too!  Antlerless permits are a tool used to keep bull:cow, buck:doe ratios in check, so give them ample time to themselves to have a quality hunt where they are not competing with the rest of the pumpkin patch!  Good stuff sir

[bobcat]

It's way too late for any changes to the permits for this year. They just can't change things after people have begun submitting their applications. Which has been going on for about three weeks now.

I don't know why more elk permits weren't allocated to the youth category. However, it's not the end of the world- kids can apply in the regular antlerless category as well. So it's not like they don't have a chance at drawing some of those cow permits this year.

[ghosthunter]

I too agree with youth cow tags.

But years ago they did a any buck youth hunt in Okanagan.
It was a disaster.

The game agent told me they wrote the highest amount of tickets for adults shooting the kids deer ever. (Party Hunting)

Just saying, It will not be any better today.

[dscubame]

I think our youth of today already has enough of the entitlement mindset.  I am for hunting equality across all ages.

[Bob33]

I'm a large advocate of youth...

However, I don't agree they should receive more permits or tags.

Animal harvest is a zero sum game: when one group gets more, another group gets less. Youth get more: who gets less? Do you take the permits away from seniors who've hunted and supported the state for 50 years? Do you take them away from disabled hunters? Which user group gets hit: modern, muzzleloader, or archery?

If I were to give more permits to any group, it would be seniors. The youth have a whole lifetime ahead of them; seniors don't.

Young hunters need to be taught that hunting is far more than killing and harvest. If they don't understand that, they will not be lifelong hunters anyway.

They also need to be taught that every animal is worthwhile: buck, doe, fawn.

My son has hunted with me since age seven. He has killed a few deer, and I'm thrilled that he has. He's drawn one youth permit (which he didn't fill), and one regular permit (which he didn't fill either.) 

Flame on.

[h20hunter]

Tough to flame that one.....well said.

[Special T]

I'm a large advocate of youth...

However, I don't agree they should receive more permits or tags.

Animal harvest is a zero sum game: when one group gets more, another group gets less. Youth get more: who gets less? Do you take the permits away from seniors who've hunted and supported the state for 50 years? Do you take them away from disabled hunters? Which user group gets hit: modern, muzzleloader, or archery?

If I were to give more permits to any group, it would be seniors. The youth have a whole lifetime ahead of them; seniors don't.

Young hunters need to be taught that hunting is far more than killing and harvest. If they don't understand that, they will not be lifelong hunters anyway.

They also need to be taught that every animal is worthwhile: buck, doe, fawn.

My son has hunted with me since age seven. He has killed a few deer, and I'm thrilled that he has. He's drawn one youth permit (which he didn't fill), and one regular permit (which he didn't fill either.) 

Flame on.

Not a flame but a large disagreement.

WDFW missed the boat because they COULD have given some of the permitts to youth...
I remeber my first Deer and elk kill, and hunted MANY years after those killings havesting nothing to try and replicate it. NOTHING gets a kid hooked like the first few good experiences. NOTHING... While its not the end of the world, it is further proof that what the WDFW says they want is NOT what thier actions would indicate.

I think the Cow elk permits and Any deer are completely different topics. I agree with the posters assesment of the cow elk and Disagree about the deer.

[Bob33]

Take a youth bird or small game hunting, and they will likely get far more shooting.

[Igottanewknee]

My daughter, who is now 20, is 9 points deep in quality elk points. I put in for her in youth permits for 5 years in whatever elk tag they had and never got drawn. I wish they youth had a few more permits..... Don't know if I should put her in this year though, baby due mid July. Her luck she would get drawn and not really have the time to do it. 

[Bob33]

My daughter, who is now 20, is 9 points deep in quality elk points. I put in for her in youth permits for 5 years in whatever elk tag they had and never got drawn. I wish they youth had a few more permits..... Don't know if I should put her in this year though, baby due mid July. Her luck she would get drawn and not really have the time to do it. 

At a minimum she can buy a ghost point.

[Special T]

Take a youth bird or small game hunting, and they will likely get far more shooting.

I agree that Bird hunting go t me more interested in hunting than big game from day one. However after killing my first deer and elk hooked me into big game and payed the state more $ than makes $ sense. I see both sides of the equation... I am VERY surprised that youth tags we not increased along with the general hunting populations and would guess that it was over looked. 

[pianoman9701]

1 post from the OP and nothing?