Vane choice for drop away rest

[Band]

I'd like to pick up some new arrows with helical (or at least offset) vanes for better arrow stabilization and I'm wondering whether I can switch to 4" vanes.  Someone told me anything longer than 2" (blazers or whatever) is asking for trouble with a drop away and I'd like a 2nd opinion.  Anyone using 4" vanes with a drop away successfully?

[KillBilly]

FOBs would be your best choice...

The FOB is a single part that replaces any type of three or four fletch application, either vanes or feathers that are normally applied to arrow shafts.

http://www.starrflight.com/

[JBar]

I shoot Flexfletch 360 with 4 vanes no issues at all. 4" should not be a problem!

[coachcw]

Three two inch max hunter vanes are all you need . I used to shoot a four fletch blazer set up it worked but I found the max hunters to come in a bit lighter and work just as well.

[Band]

Thanks for the suggestions.  While researching the vanes mentioned I ran into an interesting article comparing quite a few options that I think is worth taking a look at - http://archeryreport.com/2009/10/fletching-review-speed-drop/ . There are a couple more good articles linked from the bottom of the page that talk about accuracy and speed of straight vs. helical vanes.

Those FOB's certainly look interesting but there are a couple of drawbacks I want to avoid with them.  I'm thinking I might go with helical blazers or max hunters.  I just need to figure out whether I want to invest in a fletching jig or have a shop do the dirty work for me.

Hey Coach, one reviewer of the max hunters said they were a bit on the noisy side in flight.  Have you noticed that?  Not sure whether it is even that much of a concern.

[RadSav]

Hey Coach, one reviewer of the max hunters said they were a bit on the noisy side in flight.  Have you noticed that?  Not sure whether it is even that much of a concern.

I've killed a lot of critters using the Max Hunter vanes.  They didn't seem to care.  I also missed a nice buck with a Max Hunter fletched arrow.  He flinched just a little bit as the arrow went over his shoulder.  Then went back to feeding.  I remembered to make my down hill cut the second shot.  His reaction was a little more pronounced after he lost the top of his heart.

Most fall away rests will clear 4" vanes very well.  Smaller vanes have a better chance of clearing if the rest is prone to bad bounce back.  However, most rests these days don't have much bounce so I wouldn't worry much about that.

The real advantage to shooting the Blazer or Max Hunter vane is Flutter, FOC and Cross Wind.  Max Hunter is a little heavy, but still much lighter than the average 4" vane giving you a better FOC.  Both have a serious reduction in drift in the wind compared to just about any 4" vane.  And, if your bow shoots extremely fast most 4" vanes flutter in flight much more than a stiff 2" vane giving them a serious stability advantage!

The above mentioned Flex-Fletch 360 vane is a great alternative if you want a longer fletching profile.  We transitioned to them as we slowly went from 4.18" fletching to the Blazer and Max Hunter.  Shot the 360 both four fletched and three fletched.  We stacked up quite a few freezers full of wild critters using the 360!  Only real reason we continued to go smaller after that was the wind drift issue.  We saw such a huge improvement when shooting on the range we went 2" and have never looked back

[Band]

Sounds like even RadSav thinks I'm on the right track, so I should be good to go!

[demontang]

Yea all I shoot is the little vanes. 

[Come Get Some]

All we shoot is Max hunters, Shot my 55th elk last year. Noise is not a problem. Max bond is a great glue. I have never lost a vane and they are very tough.There is no prep required with max hunters and max bond. Unlike Flex Fletch. Flex Fletch als will take a set or wrinkle. You will not have that problem with AAE

[RadSav]

Shot my 55th elk last year ... There is no prep required with max hunters and max bond.

Wow,  All the sudden my 31 archery elk seem inadequate!  I better start eating more meat so I can tag some more
 
I agree 100%!  I do not think there is a better vane for simple glue and stick than any AAE vane.  I've never cleaned one and never lost one other than shooting it off with a broadhead.  The Bohning Helix tower doesn't much care for them due to tightness and the ribs.  Fletches them great, but you really have to allow the glue to dry well or you pull the vane off with the clamp/arm.  In the Bitz...  

I have been playing with the Max Pro vane four fletched.  Lower profile same basic shape.  So far it has been outstanding.  Even with larger broadheads I did not expect it handle well.

I'm still a Saunders NPV fan, but I have had good luck with the MaxBond sample they gave me a few years ago.  Dang close to the results I've had with Gorilla Impact Tough cyanoacrylate gel.  Same company probably makes them both   I know they called me and asked us to put our label on it.  They gave me a long list of others who have done the same.  It was a long list with a lot of familiar names!  But I can not remember if AAE was on that list or not.

[lamrith]

I agree 100%!  I do not think there is a better vane for simple glue and stick than any AAE vane.  I've never cleaned one and never lost one other than shooting it off with a broadhead.  The Bohning Helix tower doesn't much care for them due to tightness and the ribs.  Fletches them great, but you really have to allow the glue to dry well or you pull the vane off with the clamp/arm.  In the Bitz...  

So you like them better than the blazers it sounds like.  I am getting ready to start fletching, and was looking at blazers, but ease of use is important.  Price difference is insignificant, so the easier to use the better!

[RadSav]

I agree 100%!  I do not think there is a better vane for simple glue and stick than any AAE vane.  I've never cleaned one and never lost one other than shooting it off with a broadhead.  The Bohning Helix tower doesn't much care for them due to tightness and the ribs.  Fletches them great, but you really have to allow the glue to dry well or you pull the vane off with the clamp/arm.  In the Bitz...  

So you like them better than the blazers it sounds like.  I am getting ready to start fletching, and was looking at blazers, but ease of use is important.  Price difference is insignificant, so the easier to use the better!

The Blazer is a very good vane!  But to make them fletch friendly they have them coated in a primer.  Age, UV light and some glues tend to break down this primer.  So what may be a great bond today isn't always the best bond come late season.  Some batches have been better than others.  Some colors seem to be better than others.  But, I have found the only way to get good long term bonding with Blazers has been to strip the primer from the base with a quality Lacquer thinner!  The type used by your best automotive paint shops being the best.

The other thing that drives my OCD mad is that the 2" Blazers come in 20 different profiles and twenty different weights!  A few years ago Bohning put a crud load of money into reworking their process.  And for a while it was fantastic!  Eventually, though, we have the same issues today we had five years ago.  To be completely honest it probably makes almost no difference in arrow flight.  But for someone with my anal retentive nature it absolutely drives me nuts 

As a comparison I've probably fletched more than a few thousand AAE vanes since the Max Hunter came out.  And other than a tool change shape at the rear of the vane I have never seen a variance in weight or shape.

[Dr. Death]

Flex fletch flash vanes have worked well for me since they've come out. Very durable vanes...

[RadSav]

Flex fletch flash vanes have worked well for me since they've come out. Very durable vanes...

Other than not holding up to the hairy hole we have enjoyed the Flash vane quite a bit!  Absolutely love the base width and the colors are fabulous!!.  You do have to clean the bases well!  Most of the animals I've killed using the A/C/C 360 have been fletched with four Flash vanes at 90 degrees.  Helical set to max on the Bitz.  Noisier than I expected them to be, but none of the animals seemed to care!

CL used them for quite some time on lighter weight arrows three fletched.  Also with full to max helical on the Bitz.  Not sure why he changed other than they aren't as easy to find on a dealer shelf.  His animal numbers while using them was impressive!

[lamrith]

RAD, That is good enough reason for me!
Where do you all typically buy vanes, etc?
I am thinking an az ez-Fletcher mini in right helical and a few boxes of max hunters be a great starter kit..

Sent from my LG-D800 using Tapatalk

[RadSav]

RAD, That is good enough reason for me!
Where do you all typically buy vanes, etc?
I am thinking an az ez-Fletcher mini in right helical and a few boxes of max hunters be a great starter kit..

I have the luxury of buying them direct.  But they are getting easier and easier to find on dealer shelves as well as online.  Perhaps Come Get Some can help you out better than I can on that.



For clarity sake, all three vanes listed are very good.  Some require more prep work than others.  Some require a bit more sorting for those with OCD.  But all three (Max Hunter, Flash & Blazer) will give you great results.  Each have a niche they fill better than the other.  Each has a weakness.

Advantages:

Blazer = Absolutely the best for the Hairy Hole.  Available everywhere.  Good weight.  Great adhesion if base primer is stripped.  Perfect for four fletch.  Works well with all fletching jigs.

Flash = Best colors.  Beautiful thin base.  Lightest of the three.  Great for four fletch.

Max Hunter = Most stable in three fletch.  No equal when shooting heavy arrows and proper FOC.  Easiest to Fletch (other than with the Helix Tower). No base cleaning required.  Most consistent in weight and shape.  Most Durable.  Stiffest of the three!

Disadvantages:

Blazer = Primer gets brittle with age and/or UV light.  Inconsistent shape and weight.  Average durability.  Requires base primer removal for best results.  Best four fletched when using heavy arrows.

Flash = Poor durability on target pass thru and Hairy Hole.  Color fades rapidly when exposed to UV.  Base must be cleaned with extreme care for consistent adhesion.  Does not like cyanoacrylate glues.  Base size does not work well with Helix tower or EZ fletcher.  Hard to find supply source.  Have a flutter at extreme speeds.  Hardest to fletch.  Best four fletched when using heavy arrows.

Max Hunter = Heavy.  Large profile can be problematic with Hairy Hole.  Four fletch requires special attention to FOC.  Arrows should be heavier than average when four fletched (9.5 GPI +).  Problematic when using Helix Tower.  Getting better but supply sources are limited.  Turkey feathers slice them apart like they're made of butter
 

[demontang]

So your telling me my ocd of cleaning my blazers was with good reason

[Band]

I'm a little afraid to ask but what do you mean by "hairy hole", Rad.

[stromdiddily]

Its an endearing term for whisker biscuit I believe 

Rad what kind of problems did you have with max and helix jig combo?

[RadSav]

Its an endearing term for whisker biscuit I believe 

Rad what kind of problems did you have with max and helix jig combo?

For some reason I can never spell "biscuit" right.  So it's much easier on my brain and fingers to type "hairy hole"

When AAE retooled to make the Max Hunter more automatic jig compatible they also added stiffening ribs to the vane.  While this improved the vane dramatically for speed freaks it did cause the vane to become thicker.  The Helix Tower is designed without a clamp like most jigs.  Fletching goes into a sweet little helical slot perfect for placing the vane perfect on just about any arrow shaft. But the slot is a little too thin for the ribs on the Max Hunter vane.  With a little effort they do fit.  And the vane does fletch amazingly well with the Tower.  But you can not easily remove the tower arm without applying force to the fletch.  Problem then becomes if the glue is not 100% dry and set you can pull the fletching off the shaft very easily.

I do use the Helix Tower with AAE vanes quite often.  But I only fletch two arrows a day when doing it.  Where with Blazers I can fletch three dozen a day and have time to spare.