Early camp set up

[turkeyfeather]

If you feel the need to destroy or tamper with anyones personal property for your own personal gain, you have issues.   Thats what Im saying.

People break laws all the time, that dont give you the authority to discard property.  So a chair hasnt been used in three days or one hour. Big deal. Find another spot.

Im guessing this is mostly a wetside deal?

And Coach, Im only packing backstraps out now and then heading home, with said backstraps!!!!

Never said anything about destroying any property. It's just cleaning up litter that has been left to keep of forests as they are supposed to be. Ever heard of "leave only footprints". A chair that has been left in the woods is a big deal or there wouldn't have been a law put in place to deal with it. Lastly, if it's no big deal to find another spot then you will have no problem with that when you arrive to camp AND hunt. 

[Jacque]

I've never had not had a private place to hunt deer or elk in the NE corner   

That includes camping too.

If you camp where you hunt, you are doing it wrong    unless it's not a good spot to hunt in which case, again, you're doing it wrong.

Weird success within the regulations doesn't seem wrong, maybe just differing styles.

[bowhuntersd]

Wow, the arrogance displayed here in this topic is unbelievable. 

I second that. The audacity some people have is insane. I don't get it. Is it that important to camp in THAT SPOT?   

[Hunter Dug]

http://www.fs.usda.gov/Internet/FSE_DOCUMENTS/stelprdb5291562.pdf

Someone please show me where in this government document is says you have to occupy the camp site.  I don't care what any FS guys says about this or that because 9/10 times they don't now their back side from a hole in the ground and expect you to believe what they say is true.  What I see and am reading is a bunch of guys making up rules that they heard from someone else.  The bottom line is this document by the Forest service/government does not even remotely state that you have to occupy the camp sight within a 24 hour period. So for you early camp guys print this off and bring it with you.   

[washelkhunter]

Why dont you just drive over to the GPNF hdqs and talk to them, theyll set you straight. Go in there huffin and puffin, bangin on the counter top and tell those idjuts theys morons. Pianoman stated the facts, and hes rarely if ever mistaken.

[BetoBow]

This might help

http://apps.leg.wa.gov/wac/default.aspx?cite=352-32-030

[Hunter Dug]

Why dont you just drive over to the GPNF hdqs and talk to them, theyll set you straight. Go in there huffin and puffin, bangin on the counter top and tell those idjuts theys morons. Pianoman stated the facts, and hes rarely if ever mistaken.

I don't need to stop by the GNFS I have the same pamphlet they are going to give me right here.  And again it in no way shape or form states the campsite has to be occupied.

[h20hunter]

http://thenationalforests.com/the-national-forests/national-forest-camping-rules.html

•Campers may stay up to 14 consecutive days within a 21-day period. Campers may not stay in the National Forests in excess of 30 days total in a calendar year.
•At least one person must occupy a camping area during the first night after camping equipment has been set up. Camping equipment cannot be left unattended for more than 24 hours.


 

[Hunter Dug]

http://thenationalforests.com/the-national-forests/national-forest-camping-rules.html

•Campers may stay up to 14 consecutive days within a 21-day period. Campers may not stay in the National Forests in excess of 30 days total in a calendar year.
•At least one person must occupy a camping area during the first night after camping equipment has been set up. Camping equipment cannot be left unattended for more than 24 hours.


 

The regulation you posted are from 2000.  The rules I quoted were from 2008.   

[Hunter Dug]

This might help

http://apps.leg.wa.gov/wac/default.aspx?cite=352-32-030

The laws you quoted are for state parks and state land, we are talking about NF which is federal land. whole different animal.

[pianoman9701]

Is it hunting season yet? I hope it comes soon before the hunters in here start using the emoticons to murder each other in cyberspace. Oh the carnage!           

How about this scenario: You've been using the same campsite for 20 years. Three generations of hunters are in your party and it's a great group. You get up to the place the weekend before to "reserve" your spot with a couple of tents and chairs. When you get up there, someone else has the whole place taken with tents and chairs already - there's absolutely no room or place to set up your traditional 20-year camp without removing the tents. No one's around and they won't be, either. You look in the tents and they're uninhabited, in fact a squirrel has taken up residence in one of them. Now, how do you feel about holding spots? I guess the tent's on the other spot now, huh?

[northcoast]

http://thenationalforests.com/the-national-forests/national-forest-camping-rules.html


•At least one person must occupy a camping area during the first night after camping equipment has been set up. Camping equipment cannot be left unattended for more than 24 hours.


 

That is only for developed recreation areas (i.e. pay campgrounds).  Not sure why the "anti dummy camp" guys keep trying to twist things so they don't look like jackholes for messing with people's stuff. 

If you take my stuff and set up your own camp, that's theft.

If you like the spot and think it's "abandoned" then report it but know this...the FSO can't remove my stuff until 5 days after a written notice if he knows my name and address.  If he doesn't know who's stuff it is then he/she has to wait 3 days after public notice.

Code of Federal Regulation Title 36 Part 262.12 (Current as of 7/31/2014)

(a) Automobiles or other vehicles, trailers, boats, and camping equipment and other inanimate personal property on National Forest System lands without the authorization of a Forest officer which are not removed therefrom within the prescribed period after a warning notice as provided in this regulation may be impounded by a Forest officer. Whenever such Forest officer knows the name and address of the owner, such impoundment may be effected at any time five days after the date that written notice of the trespass is mailed by registered mail or delivered to such owner.

(b) If the local Forest Officer does not know the name and address of the owner of property in trespass, impoundment may be effected at any time 72 hours after a notice of intention to impound the property in trespass is posted in at least one place in the vicinity of the property.


If someone get's there before me and takes the spot I was planning on camping at, oh well, that's their right.  Bottom line is 14 days is the limit and then you need to move 5 miles. That's it.   

[Hunter Dug]

Is it hunting season yet? I hope it comes soon before the hunters in here start using the emoticons to murder each other in cyberspace. Oh the carnage!           

How about this scenario: You've been using the same campsite for 20 years. Three generations of hunters are in your party and it's a great group. You get up to the place the weekend before to "reserve" your spot with a couple of tents and chairs. When you get up there, someone else has the whole place taken with tents and chairs already - there's absolutely no room or place to set up your traditional 20-year camp without removing the tents. No one's around and they won't be, either. You look in the tents and they're uninhabited, in fact a squirrel has taken up residence in one of them. Now, how do you feel about holding spots? I guess the tent's on the other spot now, huh?

I would feel the same way I always feel every year when going to set up camp.  If its got tents and chairs then im !#$% out of luck and find a new one. I counted 3 pup tents and a chair last year and it didn't bother me a bit and that was just on the road we camp.

[pianoman9701]

http://thenationalforests.com/the-national-forests/national-forest-camping-rules.html


•At least one person must occupy a camping area during the first night after camping equipment has been set up. Camping equipment cannot be left unattended for more than 24 hours.


 

That is only for developed recreation areas (i.e. pay campgrounds). Not sure why the "anti dummy camp" guys keep trying to twist things so they don't look like jackholes for messing with people's stuff. 

If you take my stuff and set up your own camp, that's theft.

If you like the spot and think it's "abandoned" then report it but know this...the FSO can't remove my stuff until 5 days after a written notice if he knows my name and address.  If he doesn't know who's stuff it is then he/she has to wait 3 days after public notice.

Code of Federal Regulation Title 36 Part 262.12 (Current as of 7/31/2014)

(a) Automobiles or other vehicles, trailers, boats, and camping equipment and other inanimate personal property on National Forest System lands without the authorization of a Forest officer which are not removed therefrom within the prescribed period after a warning notice as provided in this regulation may be impounded by a Forest officer. Whenever such Forest officer knows the name and address of the owner, such impoundment may be effected at any time five days after the date that written notice of the trespass is mailed by registered mail or delivered to such owner.

(b) If the local Forest Officer does not know the name and address of the owner of property in trespass, impoundment may be effected at any time 72 hours after a notice of intention to impound the property in trespass is posted in at least one place in the vicinity of the property.


If someone get's there before me and takes the spot I was planning on camping at, oh well, that's their right.  Bottom line is 14 days is the limit and then you need to move 5 miles. That's it.

I posted the email response I got from the NFS regarding abandoned campsites. I actually copied and pasted without "twisting" anything. And, like I said, I'm not removing anything.

I get that a traditional spot is just that. It's just that an expectation of having it year after year without someone else ever being able to use it is unreasonable - no one is entitled to a specific piece of public land. If you want a space like that, you have to buy some land.

[Fl0und3rz]

http://thenationalforests.com/the-national-forests/national-forest-camping-rules.html

•Campers may stay up to 14 consecutive days within a 21-day period. Campers may not stay in the National Forests in excess of 30 days total in a calendar year.
•At least one person must occupy a camping area during the first night after camping equipment has been set up. Camping equipment cannot be left unattended for more than 24 hours.


 

The regulation you posted are from 2000.  The rules I quoted were from 2008.   

In addition to what northcoast points to . . . .

Hunter Dug, you may be on to something, but you may not.  While looking into the CFRs for the "24 hour" rule, the only place that I can find a specific listing is for Developed Recreation Sites.  You typically know these as the ones with signs, improvements, fire rings, etc.


36 CFR 261.16 - Developed Recreation Sites.

36 CFR 261.16 - Developed Recreation Sites.

However, there are some things to note. 

1. You are still subject to the definitions of "camping," which requires overnight occupancy, 
36 CFR § 261.2 ("Camping means the temporary use of National Forest System lands for the purpose of overnight occupancy without a permanently-fixed structure." ), and abandoning personal property, 36 CFR § 261.10 ("The following are prohibited: . . . . (e) Abandoning any personal property . . . .")

§ 261.2 Definitions
http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/CFR-2012-title36-vol2/pdf/CFR-2012-title36-vol2-sec261-2.pdf
§ 261.10 Occupancy and use
http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/CFR-2012-title36-vol2/pdf/CFR-2012-title36-vol2-sec261-10.pdf

2. Despite the "24 hour" limitation being called out specifically for Developed Recreation Sites in the CFR, the CFR also allows and provides for such limitations to be applied to dispersed camping as well. 

36 CFR § 261.50 - Prohibitions in Areas Designated by Order

http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/CFR-2012-title36-vol2/pdf/CFR-2012-title36-vol2-part261-subpartB.pdf

3.  Based on the above, the best way to determine if there is such a "24 hour" limitation is to contact the ranger district for the area and ask them to cite to authority if they can to ensure that they are not simply misconstruing the limitation for the Developed Recreation Sites. 

4.  If you just want to plead ignorance or read into the above whatever you want to justify reserving a national forest spot for yourself that you are not occupying, despite what the regulations require, that is your choice, and all the possibilities (including unwelcome neighbors, theft, loss, damage, removal as abandoned property, fines, disappointment, hurt feelings, etc.) are risks you should happily accept.


Re: http://thenationalforests.com/the-national-forests/national-forest-camping-rules.html is not an official source, and I have some suspicion that it is not trustworthy based on this and based on the fact that the domain registrant cannot be determined. That is, there is no reason to trust this site any more than any random word of an internet stranger.