OPPOSE ANY RESTRICTION ON BAITING - EMAIL TO WDFW

[JimmyHoffa]

Is introducing something that plays on animals most basic survival needs considered fair chase?

When you hunt early archery do you try to hunt close to the rut?  And do you use a bugle and/or cow calls?

[Brad Harshman]

you support a restriction on a legal method of hunting, then good on you for recognizing yourself as an anti hunter
I'm not here to mince words.  To be clear. You are hurting hunting, now go away, this is a save-able issue and I am trying to wake up the sleeping masses.

That this issue has devolved, internally from a few self righteous, arrogant individuals who call themselves hunters is repulsive to me.

Do NOT tell me to go away on an open hunting forum where debate is not only allowed it is encouraged.

You do NOT know where I stand because you are so busy being a preachy _________ you are not willing to listen to people who actually support your effort. Instead you declare exactly how things will go like a giant dicktater instead of inviting people to join you and offering a means of doing that.
You will NOT speak for me even if I agree with your position.

I have already written in opposition of any further restrictions without all your huff an puff but thanks for making more enemies and further eroding the hunting world.  Have a great day

have a great day

I agree with these gentlemen.
I'm trying to figure this out because I'm not really a big game hunter. Im an avid waterfowl hunter. I CAN'T BAIT!!! But I'm willing to learn and research before I give my opinion on the topic at hand. That being said your original post does nothing but incite conflict. If you represent the baiting community then, based on pure reaction to your words, I'd oppose baiting. I don't think I'd like to meet or talk to you in the woods.  You fail to promote a healthly community for hunters. You immediately create enemies by telling everyone who doesn't agree to go away.  This reflects poorly on all of hunters.  More so then guys who use salt blocks or bales of hay to increase their odds.

I'm interested to find any research about the benefits or impacts of baiting for ungulates. I encourage everyone to search through the science community and share their findings; pros and cons.

[Sitka_Blacktail]

To those who are opposed to baiting: how does baiting adversely affect you?

Personally, I'm ambiguous as far as baiting goes.

That said, if you're pulling animals off public land onto private land it affects others.

[idahohuntr]

That said, if you're pulling animals off public land onto private land it affects others.

I hear (and am very attentive) to this criticism of baiting.  My observation is that hunting pressure on public land pushes game to less pressured private land and is far more significant in influencing deer behavior than baiting.      

[Bango skank]

To those who are opposed to baiting: how does baiting adversely affect you?

Personally, I'm ambiguous as far as baiting goes.

That said, if you're pulling animals off public land onto private land it affects
others.

You have a point, but lets look at the reality of the situation.  A lot of private land has feed out for livestock that attracts deer.  This law wont stop that and would be nearly impossible to enforce as far as prosecuting somebody who shoots a deer on their land that came in to eat the livestock feed.  Ive been looking to kill a big buck in my area for 3 years now.  I finally found him this year where he hangs out before the snow hits, on public land very near a bunch of private land.  The private land nearby will have feed out for livestock no matter what, and it will continue to attract does, which will in turn pull bucks onto private in november.  I decided that ghe only chance i had was to fight fire with fire and set a bait pile hoping to keep some of the does on ghe public land.  Well the big boy (gross 162 and sime change) was at my bait pile before light on the 19th, but still wandered down onto thd private and got killed that night with only ten minutes left in the season
.  I guess my point is that private land feed will continue luring deer off of public land
  Now that we cant utilize baiting to counter that effect the only people who will be at a disadvantage are the public land hunters.  3 years ive been after this buck and now its done.  And the no baiting law wont keep deer from seeking feed on private lands.

[j_h_nimrod]

I think baiting is a very fair and reasonable hunting method. As hunters we are always using forms of baiting to find our animals, some are natural and some enhanced but as hunters we are trying to attract animals or find the things they are attracted to. Decoys, scents, water seeps, alfalfa fields, berry patches, natural mineral licks, orchards, and so on are forms of bait. The only difference is that some people don't have access to a corn field or apple tree so they buy a bag of corn or bushel of apples and take it some place they do have access to. Many times it works and brings game in and many times you throw away $12 on a bag of corn. I would much rather have a guy sitting in a blind watching a pile of apples than cruising up and down every road in the area. Some people are just plain lazy so they throw out a bait pile and watch it, others are disabled in some way, some have access to private land and want their land a little more enticing, others are limited on time and/or hunting area and try to improve their odds, or you just like hunting this way.  Whatever the reason I say go for it.

This year I put ~75 miles on the boots in early general season and came up empty. So in late season I went over out of Spokane where I had a second deer tag to fill and harvested a nice doe over some apples and then a nice buck across a tilled field running a doe. I didn't feel as proud as if I had harvested a nice animal up in the hills and packed it out but in the end that apple fed doe tastes a lot better than that tough old hill deer would have.

My .02

[huntnnw]

complete idiot...greenie troll.

[Jonathan_S]

To those who are opposed to baiting: how does baiting adversely affect you?

Does something have to directly affect you to have an opinion on it? Other than my ethical objection to it, it hurts the public opinion of hunters as a whole, which like it or not adversely affects all of us.

ethical?  Please explain how baiting is unethical and while you're at it please explain just how detrimental baiting is to the public perception of hunters as a whole.

What adversely affects you and I is a loss of opportunity; you're advocating for a loss of that opportunity for many hunters who choose to bait for one reason or another. 

I guarantee you that eventually -as opportunity is chipped away- something will be on the chopping block that you cherish as your personal hunting tradition.   You'll be up in arms screaming on HW how your being adversely affected by a stupid rule and I'll gently remind everyone how you and others on HW advocated to have baiting removed; doing your part to help usher in more rules and less opportunity to hunt for fellow hunters and huntresses.


We must stop foolishly advocating for further losses to our hunting privileges and start helping secure more opportunity for future generations of hunters.

Is introducing something that plays on animals most basic survival needs considered fair chase? You are right I am advocating for the loss of this opportunity because it is an opportunity that should never have been had. Obviously explaining myself isn't going to change anyone's opinion on HW. Let us agree to disagree on the matter.

Hello God, nice to see you one here.

[mfswallace]

you support a restriction on a legal method of hunting, then good on you for recognizing yourself as an anti hunter
I'm not here to mince words.  To be clear. You are hurting hunting, now go away, this is a save-able issue and I am trying to wake up the sleeping masses.

That this issue has devolved, internally from a few self righteous, arrogant individuals who call themselves hunters is repulsive to me.

Do NOT tell me to go away on an open hunting forum where debate is not only allowed it is encouraged.

You do NOT know where I stand because you are so busy being a preachy _________ you are not willing to listen to people who actually support your effort. Instead you declare exactly how things will go like a giant dicktater instead of inviting people to join you and offering a means of doing that.
You will NOT speak for me even if I agree with your position.

I have already written in opposition of any further restrictions without all your huff an puff but thanks for making more enemies and further eroding the hunting world.  Have a great day

have a great day

I agree with these gentlemen.
I'm trying to figure this out because I'm not really a big game hunter. Im an avid waterfowl hunter. I CAN'T BAIT!!! But I'm willing to learn and research before I give my opinion on the topic at hand. That being said your original post does nothing but incite conflict. If you represent the baiting community then, based on pure reaction to your words, I'd oppose baiting. I don't think I'd like to meet or talk to you in the woods.  You fail to promote a healthly community for hunters. You immediately create enemies by telling everyone who doesn't agree to go away.  This reflects poorly on all of hunters.  More so then guys who use salt blocks or bales of hay to increase their odds.

I'm interested to find any research about the benefits or impacts of baiting for ungulates. I encourage everyone to search through the science community and share their findings; pros and cons.

What is the difference between baiting to get ungulates where you can see what's in an area and using decoys to get waterfowl to land in a specific area??

[Bango skank]

To those who are opposed to baiting: how does baiting adversely affect you?

Personally, I'm ambiguous as far as baiting goes.

That said, if you're pulling animals off public land onto private land it affects others.

If some animals leave public land to feed on bait they do it at night. Any decent bucks are back to where they feel comfortable during legal shooting hours. Mature bucks know how to stay alive. This has nothing to do with baiting, but for years we leased some prime whitetail land in NE WA. Since it was just us hunting pressure was very light. Every year we hunted that place we would see big bucks bedded down in a field at any time of the day on the gravel road going to or from our place. They were on the property that didn't allow any hunting and didn't hunt themselves. At least one of those bucks we would see just laying there in the wide open was a book buck. And they were only a few hundred yards from where we could have shot them legally.

You could have dumped a dump truck load of apples on our property. They may have came in there at night and ate them. But they still would have been laying there by morning where we couldn't touch them, smiling at us as we drove by.

You say theyll do it at night... that may be generally true for eating the bait, but when the feed on private propetty lures all the does off the public land all bets are off on what dumb moves the bucks will make during daylight hours.  Ive seen it plenty oc times

[Turner89]

To those who are opposed to baiting: how does baiting adversely affect you?

Personally, I'm ambiguous as far as baiting goes.

That said, if you're pulling animals off public land onto private land it affects others.

If some animals leave public land to feed on bait they do it at night. Any decent bucks are back to where they feel comfortable during legal shooting hours. Mature bucks know how to stay alive. This has nothing to do with baiting, but for years we leased some prime whitetail land in NE WA. Since it was just us hunting pressure was very light. Every year we hunted that place we would see big bucks bedded down in a field at any time of the day on the gravel road going to or from our place. They were on the property that didn't allow any hunting and didn't hunt themselves. At least one of those bucks we would see just laying there in the wide open was a book buck. And they were only a few hundred yards from where we could have shot them legally.

You could have dumped a dump truck load of apples on our property. They may have came in there at night and ate them. But they still would have been laying there by morning where we couldn't touch them, smiling at us as we drove by.

You say theyll do it at night... that may be generally true for eating the bait, but when the feed on private propetty lures all the does off the public land all bets are off on what dumb moves the bucks will make during daylight hours.  Ive seen it plenty oc times

My experience has been different I guess? I have spent more than a bit of time hunting the big 3 species of deer in this state among others. I sure haven't seen a shortage of does or a real disproportionate number of them on public land compared to neighboring private lands that have some bait out? Maybe I am just not lucky enough to catch all these big bucks that got big by not making dumb moves all of a sudden doing it? Baiting has been legal in this state for a long time. Change my mind, show us all some pic's of the big bucks that you shot because they all of a sudden got stupid.

I would bet the bucks I have hanging on my wall not many on this forum could match. Most of them were shot at elevations you will most likely never hunt at, and there was no bait involved. But I sure don't have a problem with a guy that wants to use bait. Reality is the people that complain about different methods of hunting are for the most part the guys that don't do well hunting. So they take out the fact that they can't hunt by trying to say they way others do it isn't right.

Well said cboom!  It really blows my mind that outdoorsman of all kinds can't stand together on these things. There's lot's of different styles of hunting, fishing, camping, whatever I shake my head at, but would never think of participating in abolishing any legal way of doing it. I would defend it as if it were my own style of hunting/fishing, or whatever.   
  This may have already been said previously above, but I think I-594 is a pretty good example of how the antis keep picking away at us. They have no problem coming out and saying that 594 is just the beginning........they will keep picking away until they have all our guns. They are doing the same with hunting/fishing. One slice at a time

[Bango skank]

Youre taking my response out of context by asking me to post pics of big bucks ive caught slipping up to come into my bait.  Look back a few posts and youll see the buck i posted that i was hunting on public land this year.  VERY near private baited land.  Well he slipped up chasing one of yhe MANY does onto private land that were lured to the bait there.  But your obvious attempt to toot your own horn didnt go unnoticed, congrats on being the best deer hunter in washington i hope that works out for you.  And if you read my post im not against baiting, in fact im saying that keeping baiting legal helps level the playing field for guys who hunt on public land that borders private.  I am in no way slandering baiting.  And as far as you having so many trophy bucks that were shot at elevations you say ill never hunt at, well, color me impressed, you must be such a stud!  I didnt know that a mans penis size was dictated by the average elevation of his hunting area but now that i know that ill just refer to you as karl hungus from here on out

[Seabass]

The elephant in the room finally gets recognized. The success or lack there of has to be explained or blamed on something other than an individual's abilities. We see it all the time don't we?! That guy or group of guys is more successful than I am and there has to be some explanation behind it. It couldn't possibly be that they are just better at something than me. It has to be an unfair advantage and that should be "fixed".

I believe there is more of this type of thinking going on than we are willing to admit. I'm not painting all opposed with the same broad brush but I do believe it is at the root of some of this debate. I hear about it from folks that I know quite a bit. When I share trail cam pics of giant bucks (none of which I have killed) a common response is, "well if I could afford to bait like you do then......." Or "if I had the time to run as many baits ayou do then".....

Class warfare has been incredibly effective in politics. It is that way because humans are innately that way. Most of us would never admit how we truly feel about another man's success. It is much more prevalent or evident today because of social media and websites just like this one. 15 years ago none of us knew what the other was doing other than rumors. Now we all share it with the world every day. Jealousy used to be reserved for the photo board at the local sporting goods store.

[Turner89]

The elephant in the room finally gets recognized. The success or lack there of has to be explained or blamed on something other than an individual's abilities. We see it all the time don't we?! That guy or group of guys is more successful than I am and there has to be some explanation behind it. It couldn't possibly be that they are just better at something than me. It has to be an unfair advantage and that should be "fixed".

I believe there is more of this type of thinking going on than we are willing to admit. I'm not painting all opposed with the same broad brush but I do believe it is at the root of some of this debate. I hear about it from folks that I know quite a bit. When I share trail cam pics of giant bucks (none of which I have killed) a common response is, "well if I could afford to bait like you do then......." Or "if I had the time to run as many baits ayou do then".....

Class warfare has been incredibly effective in politics. It is that way because humans are innately that way. Most of us would never admit how we truly feel about another man's success. It is much more prevalent or evident today because of social media and websites just like this one. 15 years ago none of us knew what the other was doing other than rumors. Now we all share it with the world every day. Jealousy used to be reserved for the photo board at the local sporting goods store.

[Bango skank]

okay so maybe im not being clear.  the point im trying to make is that baiting DOES, at least around here, lure a lot of does off of public land.  And when the does move off, the bucks follow, at least during the rut.  But I'm not saying that baiting should be banned because of that, I'm saying that regardless of the law this will continue to happen as does go after livestock feed, and that allowing public land hunters to bait is the best way they can level the playing field when theyre hunting near private land that is heavily baited.  for the record i am NOT against baiting, I have used it to some degree, but dont rely on it as my sole means of hunting, and im not some guy who is bitter over a lack of success as I fill my buck tag every year, even since this 4x minimum rule has gone in i always fill my tag.  im just stating that banning baiting hurts public land hunters who hunt land adjacent to baited private land, and helps the guys who own 500 acres bordering public land, and leave feed out for their livestock.  banning baiting favors those who already have all the advantages.  i think maybe we want the same thing but just look at it from different perspectives.  sorry if i was a bit ugly on the last post.

this post might be hard to understand as "does" (pronounced doze) and "does" (pronounced duzz) are spelled the same, it may cause some confusion.