What caliber for the most effective long range rifle?

[WoodlandShooter]

http://www.dtic.mil/ndia/2009infantrysmallarms/tuesdaysessioniii8524.pdf

[CAMPMEAT]

Camp, I think that was a joke. 6.8x64 = 270 win.

Thanks Curly. I hate jokesters.............

...............and for you WoodlandShooter, I'm not done with you............. .

[coachcw]

Camp, I think that was a joke. 6.8x64 = 270 win.

yes, the 6.8x64 is a 270 WIN!! it was a joke...

However, it's potential is not a joke, you just have to build it to perform. Factory 270's are stuck with a 10 twist barrel.

The other problem is there are only ~ 6 bullets out there that work. 175 Matrix VLD (0.650 BC), 165 Matrix VLD(0.638 BC), Nozler 150 grain Long Range (0.569 BC per Litz), and Sierra 135 grain SMK. I have no experience with any Cutting Edge bullets or some of the other bore-rinders.

I only have experience handloading with the 150NABLR and the 165 Matrix and 130 grain Accubonds. The 175 is probably best used in a 270 AI, or a 270 WSM.

Nozler says the 10 twist will work with the NABLR, but Litz posted that the stability is marginal in a 10 twist. The 165 Matrix also needs faster than 10 twist.

My rifle will shoot ~.5 MOA with hand loads, and ~1 MOA with factory Winchester Ballistic silvertips with me running it. As the action is a Weatherby MKV, it really cant be tweaked like a Remmy, but it will shoot nonetheless.

so, with all that said, the potential with the 165 matrix is huge. I can push them to ~2850 out of my 9 twist Benchmark barrel. With a velocity of 2850 FPS and a BC of 0.638, 0.5 MOA accuracy, well, it's a shooter. It's not crazy accurate, but it's very usefull. The best part, I can use factory loads to 700 yards consistently, and those loads are always available at Wallyworld. I have taken the 130 Grain Win BST loads to 980 yards, and it's still on target, the issue is the wind...they get blown around like a 223.

IMHO, when it comes to building a rifle, especially in todays world, brass, powder, factory loads etc...etc.. MUST be readily available. Wildcats are cool, but if I have to fire form, cut, trim, use close to 100 grains of powder, etc. etc., well, it's not worth my time.

a 6.8x64  with a 165 matrix is a hammer at 1000 yards and supersonic to 1300 yards at standard conditions. Get some altitude and some higher temps, and that range grows. It's very similar in trajectory and supersonic range to a 300 Win Mag with 210 Bergers. 

really .5 moa is barely acceptable in my mind long rang. I can only imagine re sighting and getting the drops for factory wally world ammo and trying to get consistant on target hits at 700 with a moa set up. plus you must be able to judge wind and know your wind drift. I use a 30 inch pipe with a 1-8 twist for my 6.5 and a 140 vld 52.5 grains od rl19 300 off the lands pushing 3150 fps  . it shoots 1/4 moa or better with a 1.5 lbs trigger , using a 5-20 power scope that has wind holds for my loads im sure its more accurate at 800 yards than most any out of box set ups at 300. remember spin drift ? I set up 1/4 high and left at 200 yards to take the factor out of it in the field spin drift with send most bullets 10-12 inches low right at 1000 yards factor that in with factory ammo and a 700 yard shot moa with wind is a crap shoot that's before you even factor in angles and altitudes . wind is a huge x factor .

[WoodlandShooter]

well, like I said, the groups are with "me" running it. others could do better.

here is my Winchester BST group at 100 yards. Not great, but it's not bad either. 5 shots, ~ 1 MOA

[WoodlandShooter]

Here is a 5 shot 200 yard group with my 150 NABLR Hand loads.

If I wanted to "sound" cooler on the interweb, I could proclaim a 0.25 MOA group with three shots, but in reality, that's just lame.

[WoodlandShooter]

I agree, wind is the big equalizer. I just hope it's not too crasy this weekend in Idaho.

here is my dope card for this weekend DA is 2570'.

Drops really dont change much untill I go past 700 yards with the 165 Matrix pils.

[MP123]

Here is a 5 shot 200 yard group with my 150 NABLR Hand loads.

If I wanted to "sound" cooler on the interweb, I could proclaim a 0.25 MOA group with three shots, but in reality, that's just lame.

Heck, you could claim "one ragged hole" if you eliminated the other two... 

[WoodlandShooter]

lol, the engineer in me wont allow that.

[bearpaw]

Thanks again for all the info.

Does anyone have experience with the .416 Barrett or 50 BMG? Can these cartridges be used in 13 pound rifle with brake without beating you to death?

Any opinions on the 338/378 Weatherby verses the 338 edge or 338 lapua? Seems like it will be a problem getting brass for the edge?

[Jim the Plumber]

Thanks again for all the info.

Does anyone have experience with the .416 Barrett or 50 BMG? Can these cartridges be used in 13 pound rifle with brake without beating you to death?

Any opinions on the 338/378 Weatherby verses the 338 edge or 338 lapua? Seems like it will be a problem getting brass for the edge?

I have owned 5 50BMG rifles.  You do not want a 50 BMG in a 13 pound rifle. Having shot a 416, I would say no to 13#s there as well.
For ease of ammo and components in a 13 pound rifle I would look at the 338 Lapua. Travis built me one that I hunt with have have been successful on bear and coyotes with.

[jaymark6655]

   50 BMG I have shot was 24 lbs and it was not that fun after about 15 rounds and group size started to open up.  It doesn't seem to have all that good for precision unless you want to hand load, even hornady stuff seems to shoot about a 2moa (out of a sled) with a group around 1moa every once in a while.

.338 LM is awesome and to me it seems to have less recoil than .300 WM, more push than snap I guess.  Never have shoot the edge, but have heard that barrel life is better with it than the Lapua.

CheyTec = overpressure

No experience with the .416

[JimmyHoffa]

Thanks again for all the info.

Does anyone have experience with the .416 Barrett or 50 BMG? Can these cartridges be used in 13 pound rifle with brake without beating you to death?

Any opinions on the 338/378 Weatherby verses the 338 edge or 338 lapua? Seems like it will be a problem getting brass for the edge?

There is a compact 50 BMG in a bull pup configuration that gets down to around 15 pounds or so.  But the set up really isn't for long range.  Even the AR conversion 50s are still pretty heavy.
The 338/378 mostly has a case capacity advantage over the others mentioned and gives about a 100 fps advantage over RUM/Edge and 200 fps advantage over Lapua.  If you want choice of brands for reloading brass and loads, the Lapua is generally favored.  The 338/378 with brake/scope/sling can easily run around 10 pounds.

[WoodlandShooter]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.300_Norma_Magnum

[idaho guy]

I have had a 30-378 weatherby for a long time. I think it is a great long range rifle and can shoot targets at 1000 yards accurately and have shot rocks etc at 1200. The farthest I have actually shot animails hunting has been in the 600-700 yard range. With the muzzlebreak it has very little recoil but is loud as heck. I changed from the  turret style scope to one with mill dots and different cross hairs for different ranges. Thompson long range builds these scopes to match up with the 30-378 ballistics for different ranges.  I would definitely recomend getting the thompson system over the turrets because it is so much more simple. scope only goes to 1200 but I dont really need to shoot any farther than that. I like being able to lay down on something and just shoot without having to click up 9 times etc. Also missed a really big mule deer because i had scope set for 600 yards he went over the hill I followed and ran into him at about 100! forgot to readjust i dont have to worry about that with the new scope.
I just bought the scope because I already had the rifle but he sells the whole package too. No trying to advertise for the Thompson guns there are others but I would consider that type of scope.   

[coachcw]

I have the huskima system on my 6.5x284 and its spot on . zero at 200 allows me to shot 300 easy with out adjustment and the wind holds on the turret are really quick . I figure if it's way out there you should have time to set up and shoot or you shouldn't shoot anyway. I know blrman has the vortex on his 300 wsm and has confirmed hits at 700