hunt test / field trials

[jetjockey]

Let me get this straight, your comparing three states to one, and only including AKC and not AF.  Hmmm.  I don't think you will like your "facts" when you compare apples to apples.  AF, the largest sanctioning body of  pointing dog field trials is all but non existent in the PNW.  Not so down here in the South.  I I is you hate those silly "facts".  Sorry, but the AKC isn't the big player in the pointing dog world.  Most Setters and Pointers aren't even AKC registered.

[jetjockey]

Btw.  I just looked and there are 4 AF trials left to run this month in GA alone.  That doesn't include the trials that have already run in January.  That's just what's left, and only in GA.  That doesn't include stuff in Bama, TN, or SC. 

[Bluemoon]

Jet read what was posted above mine then reread mine.
Sorry your not dragging me in....

[jetjockey]

I don't see your point.  You compared AKC and left out the largest sanctioning body of pointing dogs. 

[AspenBud]

Michigan's field trial/hunt test schedule for 2013 on some public grounds...

http://coverdog.blogspot.com/   <---- Scroll down

If I filter out some springer events and a whole bunch of NAVHDA and VHDF events from that list I'm down to 62..I think.

That doesn't include AF, NAVHDA, NSTRA, AKC, BDC, Ruffed Grouse Society Trials, and probably some more that I'm forgetting that are often held on private hunting preserves.

It definitely does not include retriever trials.

At the end of it I don't care. What I do know is finding training groups, trials for total amateurs, and so forth seems to be harder out here. Maybe that's a misperception on my part.

[jetjockey]

Aspen

Those look like some great grounds.  That's another thing I don't see in the PNW.  There seems to be no desire to run on wild birds.  With American Field, they try to run on wild birds, and they also push 1hr trials.  The AKC trials in the PNW are almost all 30 minute trials run on throw down birds.  With the numbers of quail and pheasants, and the size of the area, it's ashame they can't find wild bird grounds where you can let a dog roll for an hour or more!

[AspenBud]

Aspen

Those look like some great grounds.  That's another thing I don't see in the PNW.  There seems to be no desire to run on wild birds.  With American Field, they try to run on wild birds, and they also push 1hr trials.  The AKC trials in the PNW are almost all 30 minute trials run on throw down birds.  With the numbers of quail and pheasants, and the size of the area, it's ashame they can't find wild bird grounds where you can let a dog roll for an hour or more!

That argument goes on even in the eastern states where AF is more prevalent. Dogs from both venues and dogs born from up close trial breedings from both venues are successful on wild birds when hunted on them. There are guys who think they get a better dog if it comes from a line trialed on wild fowl but honestly I think it has a lot more to do with exposure and training. Plenty of wild quail dogs have been brought north over the years and they sucked rocks on lake states grouse. That they had been run on wild birds didn't matter so much as what they had been exposed to. If you talk to bigger names from Cover Dog circles they'll even tell you they start with a healthy dose of pen raised birds before going into the woods with their dogs.

The difference maker to me, is trials that focus on retrieving as a component seem to focus less on the athleticism of the dog. As you say, a lot of AF  events tend to be endurance runs and that seems to bring out dogs that can really handle day in and day out pounding the ground. But again, that rule is not hard fast since plenty of dogs from NSTRA and AKC get used for just that and to be frank, no dog in those two venues is going to rise to the level of champion if it's an inferior athlete. Dogs that break down, dogs that are tired after one brace, they don't last long.

A good dog is a good dog, period. I have a friend whose dog gets run in BDC events, a venue that a lot of purists wrinkle their nose at. That same dog just spent last fall doing some guiding down in AZ going after wild quail. Of course it is a Pointer...but I'm entitled to that bias.   

[Blackjaw]

I hope this isn't to off-topic, but how much land does it take to run a good pointer trial (assuming it is good pointer cover, etc. and assuming planted birds will be used)? Just a random question from a spaniel guy who has only watched one pointer trial in Eastern Washington (Weimaraner trial on the Hanford Reach if that rings a bell for anyone).

[jetjockey]

Id say it depends.  In areas where there isn't a ton of cover, or where cover is fairly low, you need a lot to run a 1hr course.  On grounds like we have out East and down South, you can get away with a lot less since hedge rows and tree lines can really divide up a course and make it seem bigger than it is.  Out West where it's much more open, you dont have as much of that.  Overall, I'd say 1000 acres is about minimum for 1hr grounds, with a lot more being better.  At places like Ames Plantation, they have 12,000 acres and run 6 continues 1 hour courses, or 2 three hour courses.  Wild bird trials need more land because if you run the same course several times a day, you will  push the wild birds right off the course.

[jetjockey]

Here's s pretty good view of the grounds at Hoffman NC.  Hoffman has 6000 acres with 31 miles of courses, or 6 one hour courses.  Break it down and each course is about 5 miles long.  They seed the grounds early in the year with birds, and then no more birds are released during the season. 

[Happy Gilmore]

Can you post a took map to include elevation gains and losses?

[jetjockey]

Nope.  But it's pretty easy to see on google maps if you look up Hoffman and then look a little West.

[Happy Gilmore]

It's a beautiful area in that part of the country. Highest point is the local water towers. If it's 500' in elevation gain it's called a mountain lol

[jetjockey]

What's your point?

[Happy Gilmore]

The groomed forests, flat landscape and mowed pathways are much less physically demanding than running on a mountain with a terrain "factor".