Pack of Scientists Urges Congress to Leave Wolves, ESA Alone

[wolfbait]

Pack of Scientists Urges Congress to Leave Wolves, ESA Alone
 
By Wayne Pacelle - HSUS on February 18, 2015
 
Today, more than 50 world-renowned wildlife biologists and scientists, many of whom have devoted their entire professional careers toward understanding the social and biological issues surrounding wolves in North America, sent a letter to Congress urging members to oppose any efforts to strip federal protections for wolves in the contiguous 48 states. If Congress were to take this adverse action, according to these scientists, it would upend two recent federal court rulings, which criticized the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service for distorting the “plain meaning” of the standards of the Endangered Species Act and admonished several state wildlife agencies for conducting overreaching and dangerous trophy hunting and trapping programs upon federal delisting.
 
The scientists, including Rolf Peterson and John Vucetich of Michigan Technological University, and Adrian Treves of University of Wisconsin, Madison, noted that “wolves are absent from most of the United States, with potentially secure populations in only a handful of states (Idaho, Montana, Wyoming, Wisconsin, Minnesota and Michigan). Yet, in those same states, the loss of federal protections resulted in state-sanctioned seasons on wolves at levels designed to reduce their populations to arbitrary goals, which were based on politics but not the best available science.”
 
Rather than removing wolves’ protections completely, there is a better way forward. A federal downlisting to “threatened” would be a far superior option, allowing “lethal management to resolve wolf-livestock conflicts.” Last month, The HSUS and 21 animal protection and conservation organizations petitioned the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service to reclassify gray wolves as “threatened” throughout their U.S. range south of Alaska (except the distinct Mexican gray wolf subspecies in the southwest which should remain listed as endangered). It’s the right compromise that balances the national interest in protecting wolves, while providing tools to federal and state agencies to allow selective control of wolves to address livestock and property damage.
 
continued:
http://tinyurl.com/ls2po2g

[mkcj]

Wolf,

Isn't this “threatened”  VS  ESA term just a way to take away a states right to control the population and make it a nation wide number before delisting?

[villageidiot]

These wolf groups have no limits.  They are in the same class as the Taliban and ISIS.  They will lie, cheat, steal, bribe and kill to get their way.  They have lied so many times I am not sure why anybody even reads their garbage. I trust a coiled diamondback more than them.

[Knocker of rocks]

These wolf groups have no limits.  They are in the same class as the Taliban and ISIS. 

Do they blow up planes, trains, building, villages and murder with impunity?

Exaggerate much?

[pianoman9701]

These wolf groups have no limits.  They are in the same class as the Taliban and ISIS. 

Do they blow up planes, trains, building, villages and murder with impunity?

Exaggerate much?

There are certainly examples of eco-terrorists blowing up buildings and burning timber equipment/facilities. PETa provided financial aid to the tune of $75K to a guy who blew up an animal testing facility in MI in the 90s. I think it's fair to say that there are extremists who are members of all of these organizations. I don't think it's fair to say that all of these organizations are equal to ISIS.

[Knocker of rocks]

These wolf groups have no limits.  They are in the same class as the Taliban and ISIS. 

Do they blow up planes, trains, building, villages and murder with impunity?

Exaggerate much?

There are certainly examples of eco-terrorists blowing up buildings and burning timber equipment/facilities. PETa provided financial aid to the tune of $75K to a guy who blew up an animal testing facility in MI in the 90s. I think it's fair to say that there are extremists who are members of all of these organizations. I don't think it's fair to say that all of these organizations are equal to ISIS.

How about any?  Non of them have murdered anybody

[pianoman9701]

I can only find one British scientist killed so far, but that's only luck. Sooner or later, people will be killed as the result of an attack. Here's a statement from the Animal Liberation Brigade:
“We gave all of the customers the chance, the choice, to withdraw their business from HLS (Huntingdon Life Sciences). Now you will all reap what you have sown. All customers and their families are considered legitimate targets… You never know when your house, your car even, might go boom… Or maybe it will be a shot in the dark… We will now be doubling the size of every device we make. Today it is 10 pounds, tomorrow 20… until your buildings are nothing more than rubble. It is time for this war to truly have two sides. No more will all the killing be done by the oppressors, now the oppressed will strike back.”

http://www.fbi.gov/news/testimony/animal-rights-extremism-and-ecoterrorism

[HunterStrait]

These wolf groups have no limits.  They are in the same class as the Taliban and ISIS. 

Do they blow up planes, trains, building, villages and murder with impunity?

Exaggerate much?

Animal liberation front does.

[Knocker of rocks]

Fair enough, they are of some danger.  But to compare them to the Taliban or ISIS is ridiculous.  There are threads upon threads on this board correctly telling us the radical Islam is the most dangerous entity on the earth since Hitler, Stalin and Mao.  To equate the dangers of those governments to some hippies is preposterous.  It is best to keep things in perspective.

[jackelope]

ISIS burned 45 people alive the other day. 
Seems not even close to me.

[AspenBud]

There are threads upon threads on this board correctly telling us the radical Islam is the most dangerous entity on the earth since Hitler, Stalin and Mao. 

No that's Putin, mostly because he has the bomb and it would only take one dumb mistake...

But I agree, the comparison is not even close.

[pianoman9701]

There are threads upon threads on this board correctly telling us the radical Islam is the most dangerous entity on the earth since Hitler, Stalin and Mao. 

No that's Putin, mostly because he has the bomb and it would only take one dumb mistake...

But I agree, the comparison is not even close.

Pakistan also has the bomb and her people are becoming more fundamental everyday.  Radical Islam isn't an entity. It is many entities. It's not like all of the extreme Muslims of the world communicate and coordinate. They don't; not even close. That's part of what makes them so dangerous, even more than Putin (who I believe is smart enough not to press the button). We can squash one group and another pops up somewhere else, likely completely unrelated. Then depending on where that is and what they have that we can use/exploit, we go there and another pops up elsewhere.

[Knocker of rocks]

There are threads upon threads on this board correctly telling us the radical Islam is the most dangerous entity on the earth since Hitler, Stalin and Mao. 

No that's Putin, mostly because he has the bomb and it would only take one dumb mistake...

But I agree, the comparison is not even close.

Pakistan also has the bomb and her people are becoming more fundamental everyday.  Radical Islam isn't an entity. It is many entities. It's not like all of the extreme Muslims of the world communicate and coordinate. They don't; not even close. That's part of what makes them so dangerous, even more than Putin (who I believe is smart enough not to press the button). We can squash one group and another pops up somewhere else, likely completely unrelated. Then depending on where that is and what they have that we can use/exploit, we go there and another pops up elsewhere.

Pakistan is by far the worlds most dangerous country.  It could turn into a failed state replete with nuclear weapons without warning, in a matter of days. 

A problem with Putin would happen more akin to Sarajevo in 1914, where everyone just blunders into it.

[Bob33]

That's odd - when I read the title of this thread I thought it was about wolves. My darn reading glasses must be acting up again.

[mkcj]

 

[Spawnstar]

It's crazy how these scientists can rally together over something that doesn't even effect them but us as hunters will scrutinize and loose track of what's going on just because someone throws there opinion out there. Yes I believe the comparison to ISIS is dramatic but these scientists are trying to take down America as we know it. Let's not loose focus and stick together.

[timberfaller]

Ever wonder WHY "scientist" that are listened to, are entrenched into "University's"

There are two types of welfare in this country.

One is for the poor and lazy and the other is the "public" sector positions that COULDN'T make it, if they relied on Private sector for a paycheck!!!

MONEY has a way of creating BIAS. 

Spotted Owl anyone!!

[idahohuntr]

Ever wonder WHY "scientist" that are listened to, are entrenched into "University's"

There are two types of welfare in this country.

One is for the poor and lazy and the other is the "public" sector positions that COULDN'T make it, if they relied on Private sector for a paycheck!!!

MONEY has a way of creating BIAS. 

Spotted Owl anyone!!

I'm durn glad people like you keep pertectin 'Murrica from them evil "University" folk!    It'd be a dad'gum shame if'in them learned fellers in the Public sector  helped protect them'er public resources. 

MONEY has a way of creating BIAS 

Loggers and Miners anyone!!

[wolfbait]

Wolf Delisting

http://idahoforwildlife.com/Charles%20Kay/87-Wolf%20delisting%20the%20legal%20battle%20part%201.pdf

Wolf delisting-The legal Battle part 2

http://idahoforwildlife.com/Charles%20Kay/88-Wolf%20delisting%20the%20legal%20battle%20part%202.pdf

[nwwanderer]

Pro wolf's pack of Phds, mostly environmental types, can fairly easily be covered by a herd of manage the predator type Phds.  We read their stuff almost daily on this site.  At world wildlife management conferences a goodly share of the doctors ask 'what were you thinking when you turned wolves loose in Yellowstone?'.  Around the planet, Kenya, Canada, Kazakhstan, Russia, Spain, France, China, etc., finding top researchers with reams of data positive to predator management is not difficult to source, just time consuming.  This sort of thing stirs the academic pot, good bet a similar list shows up soon on the other side with studies proving their point.  Apply pressure with good solid data at every opportunity and when the wolf has the same status as a coyote we may have a chance.

[timberfaller]

  Ohhhhhhhhh did I hit someone's nerve!!

If the shoe fits, wear it,  is the ole saying!!

Having worked for, around and having to deal with "university" types, I STAND by my comment!!