Bill to Open inaccessible, landlocked federal lands

[idahohuntr]

The breadth of your condescension is impressive. Have you ever thought of having a conversation with people instead of talking down to them?

Oh, you mean like this:

Why don't we just get rid of all privately held property? Let the government own everything. Add a sickle and hammer to the stars and stripes....

[grundy53]

The breadth of your condescension is impressive. Have you ever thought of having a conversation with people instead of talking down to them?

Oh, you mean like this:

Why don't we just get rid of all privately held property? Let the government own everything. Add a sickle and hammer to the stars and stripes....

How is that condescending?

Nice deflection though.

[idahohuntr]

The breadth of your condescension is impressive. Have you ever thought of having a conversation with people instead of talking down to them?

Oh, you mean like this:

Why don't we just get rid of all privately held property? Let the government own everything. Add a sickle and hammer to the stars and stripes....

How is that condescending?

Nice deflection though.

Please don't start with your usual drama stuff and pretend like you're perfect and its always everybody else...lets try and stick to the topic.  If something gets under your skin...maybe just go to a different thread. 

Now, since we have gotten so far off topic...just a reminder, this bill does not force or suggest use of eminent domain.  It uses LWCF funds to purchse land, easements, etc. from willing sellers to provide greater public access to landlocked federal lands.  It is a bill I would think we could all support.   

[grundy53]

The breadth of your condescension is impressive. Have you ever thought of having a conversation with people instead of talking down to them?

Oh, you mean like this:

Why don't we just get rid of all privately held property? Let the government own everything. Add a sickle and hammer to the stars and stripes....

How is that condescending?

Nice deflection though.

Please don't start with your usual drama stuff and pretend like you're perfect and its always everybody else...lets try and stick to the topic.  If something gets under your skin...maybe just go to a different thread. 

Now, since we have gotten so far off topic...just a reminder, this bill does not force or suggest use of eminent domain.  It uses LWCF funds to purchse land, easements, etc. from willing sellers to provide greater public access to landlocked federal lands.  It is a bill I would think we could all support.

Oh I'm far from perfect. Never claimed to be close. I wouldn't be throwing stones about drama.

[lokidog]

The first map you showed it looks like there is plenty of access to the public land? I'm assuming the smaller boxes are the private? If so the public land is not at all landlocked. Doesn't look like one rancher controls any public land in that map. And if I got that backwards and the small boxes are public then the public pieces are very small compared to the private surrounding it.

The small pieces are the "public" land.  The smallest square parcel is likely 1/4 x 1/4 mile or 40 acres.  I see a lot of property that does not have access.  Also, just because there is a little squiggly line to it, does not mean that is an accessible road. 

The problem I see with this bill is that the access might not necessarily be permanent, which it should be IMO, and these landowners could just jack the price whenever they feel like it.

I tried a DIY hunt in WY once where the original area I was going was covered in people, there is a huge amount of "public" land that is not accessible to the public, especially if corner hopping is not allowed. 

[WAcoyotehunter]

just a reminder, this bill does not force or suggest use of eminent domain.  It uses LWCF funds to purchse land, easements, etc. from willing sellers to provide greater public access to landlocked federal lands.  It is a bill I would think we could all support.   

I doubt we can get everyone to agree on anything around here, but I think this bill will receive broad sportsman support.

[idahohuntr]

just a reminder, this bill does not force or suggest use of eminent domain.  It uses LWCF funds to purchse land, easements, etc. from willing sellers to provide greater public access to landlocked federal lands.  It is a bill I would think we could all support.   

I doubt we can get everyone to agree on anything around here, but I think this bill will receive broad sportsman support.

Very true.  I think the only way it gets de-railed in congress is partisan gridlock...and it becomes a casualty of fights over other things.  On its own merits...it should sail through even a dysfunctional congress.

[Sitka_Blacktail]

The pro-wolf crowd is excited about this? 

He's implying of course that Idahohntr is pro wolf.

[Sitka_Blacktail]

It's not a cry for socialism, but public access to public property. Saying that life isn't fair is a cop out.

People have access to public property.  Some might require a helicopter.  You can't blame the guy for not wanting to create a road through his property.  We have property rights in this country.  I can't cut across your yard to get to mine.  It is what it is.  I understand people wanting it, but I respect our rights over some peoples wants.

This is probably a case where eminent domain could be put to use to create a public good, access to public land.

[wolfbait]

The pro-wolf crowd is excited about this? 

He's implying of course that Idahohntr is pro wolf.

just a reminder, this bill does not force or suggest use of eminent domain.  It uses LWCF funds to purchse land, easements, etc. from willing sellers to provide greater public access to landlocked federal lands.  It is a bill I would think we could all support.   

I doubt we can get everyone to agree on anything around here, but I think this bill will receive broad sportsman support.

Very true.  I think the only way it gets de-railed in congress is partisan gridlock...and it becomes a casualty of fights over other things.  On its own merits...it should sail through even a dysfunctional congress.

Global Governance - The Quiet War Against American Independence 3of6
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iOaMazpLbVE#t=127

Sell it to the sportsman, under the guise we are here to help you with your hunting access. Don't mention anything about dumping wolves on states and then pretending that they migrated.

Yep the fraud is alive and well.

[fireweed]

For those who don't think acquiring access to landlocked public land is a good thing, what if many of the current easements into blocks of public land were eliminated? How would you feel about that? Because it seems like some prefer to let private landowners have exclusive access to public lands. So let's get rid of all the access we now enjoy. There's no need for it, correct?

I think acquiring access is a great thing. But no land owner should be forced to provide it. I am all for the land owner selling the access if they chose to.

in SW Washington right now Weyerhaeuser controls all access on existing roads to an entire DNR forest of 35,000 acres plus 7000 of WDFW wildlife area plus thousands of  acres of Forest service land all in one big chunk.  These aren't a bit here and a section there inholdings, but tens of thousands of acres of public forests.  Weyco can charge or block access to this if they want.  They could control exclusive use of all this public land.  Is your position that situations like this  ok and that the government should do nothing and have no authority to pursue an easement here for the public?  No new roads are needed and the existing roads were built by both private and public funds.  Tax shifts were set up to reward the multiple public benefits of timberland. 

Consequently situations like this were set up when the idea that private landowners would charge to cross their land wasn't even considered--open roads and trails went everywhere, regardless of who owned the land.  This pay for entry and/or closing vast open lands is a new idea.   

[idahohuntr]

Good point fireweed.  Landlocked land issues weren't a big issue 30 or more years ago...pay to play and the constant March towards making hunting a rich persons sport is when folks started taking notice.  Every state in the west has a private lands access program today.  Access is constantly cited as a major concern for hunter recruitment and retention.  We can no longer ignore millions of acres of inaccessible public lands.  I'm open to any long term solutions...this bill is in the interest of sportsmen and the hunting heritage.  I can't hunt all of the private land I have access to in a year...many others like me support this bill...this isn't some trivial sour grapes thing where I or others want access to some specific ranch or something.

[WAcoyotehunter]

  Every state in the west has a private lands access program today.  Access is constantly cited as a major concern for hunter recruitment and retention.   

This is not dissimilar to the Block Management program in MT, or the multiple access programs offered here in WA.  Its strange that some people are so blinded by conspiracy and distrust that they wouldn't entertain this idea.... did it occur to anyone that some of these landowners might actually appreciate some $ for allowing access.  We all assume that they don't allow access now... does the idea seem more palatable if you assume they allow access but are getting tired of cleaning up, closing gates ect, without any compensation???

[grundy53]

  Every state in the west has a private lands access program today.  Access is constantly cited as a major concern for hunter recruitment and retention.   

This is not dissimilar to the Block Management program in MT, or the multiple access programs offered here in WA.  Its strange that some people are so blinded by conspiracy and distrust that they wouldn't entertain this idea.... did it occur to anyone that some of these landowners might actually appreciate some $ for allowing access.  We all assume that they don't allow access now... does the idea seem more palatable if you assume they allow access but are getting tired of cleaning up, closing gates ect, without any compensation???

Like I've said a dozen times already. I'm all for more access and working with landowners to obtain it. Where I jump off the wagon is when folks start talking about stealing land (eminent domain) or instituting punitive taxes.

[Curly]

http://www.hcn.org/articles/sportsmens-bill-aims-to-open-inaccessible-public-lands?utm_source=wcn1&utm_medium=email

A bill every sportsmen should support.   

I don't have time right now to read all pages of this discussion, but I have to say I'm all for this bill.