Do You Realize Now What You Have Done?

[pianoman9701]

The anti's are playing the game way better than we are, bottom line we loose.

Yes, and they're not in this for the wolves. HSUS, DOW and others are in this to end hunting and livestock production. The wolves are a means to the end.

[thatdamguy]

The anti's are playing the game way better than we are, bottom line we loose.

Yes, and they're not in this for the wolves. HSUS, DOW and others are in this to end hunting and livestock production. The wolves are a means to the end.

 

Couldn't agree more. Here is a documentary explaining why it was never really about the wolf, it is about ending big game hunting and making farming and ranching unsustainable.

                                                                                                                      Not a valid vimeo URL

[wolfbait]

The misappropriated funds are just one aspect of the whole fiasco. The entire program was mishandled and continues to be. The residents of the NE part of this state are forced to suffer fools who have no skin in the game telling them they need to be employing non-lethal management tools to try and prevent losing their stock and pets, and very likely their kids, sooner or later. With 13+ confirmed packs within a hundred mile radius, it's time to start killing wolves and teaching them fear of man for the benefit of both the wolves and man. I don't have a problem with biological diversity. What I have a problem with is mindless regulation and lack of management to keep these things deep in the wilderness where they belong. They don't belong among humans ruining their livelihoods.

The anti's are playing the game way better than we are, bottom line we loose.

Yes, and they're not in this for the wolves. HSUS, DOW and others are in this to end hunting and livestock production. The wolves are a means to the end.

 

Couldn't agree more. Here is a documentary explaining why it was never really about the wolf, it is about ending big game hunting and making farming and ranching unsustainable.

                                                                                                                      Not a valid vimeo URL

The Fraud and Corruption of the wolf introduction, right down to bought judges.

That's another great video, That DG, thanks agin for posting.

[pianoman9701]

The anti's are playing the game way better than we are, bottom line we loose.

Yes, and they're not in this for the wolves. HSUS, DOW and others are in this to end hunting and livestock production. The wolves are a means to the end.

It's not just the "antis" doing it alone. They're getting a lot of support from the WDFW and USFWS.

[bobcat]

The parasite that's being discussed- first I'll say I have not read a whole lot about it, but I'm pretty sure it's a parasite that native wolves in Washington, Idaho, Montana, etc, had before wolves were eliminated from all these states, back in the early 1900's.

So why is it a big deal now? I don't get it. I know it's not something desirable and if we had a choice in the matter it would be better if it never existed. But it does! Kind of like saying the government is responsible if you get a mosquito bite.

It's silly to blame the governmental agencies for something which is just a part of nature.

[Curly]

But would the parasite spread as easily if so many wolves didn't exist? 

(And it is the government's fault that we have so many wolves, thus the government deserves some blame for the parasite).

[bobcat]

I don't see it that way. The wolves would have eventually re-established themselves here in Washington anyway, without anyone's help. In fact they already were here before the government even released wolves in Yellowstone. And there have always been plenty of wolves in Canada that could easily walk across the border at any time.

[JimmyHoffa]

The parasite that's being discussed- first I'll say I have not read a whole lot about it, but I'm pretty sure it's a parasite that native wolves in Washington, Idaho, Montana, etc, had before wolves were eliminated from all these states, back in the early 1900's.

So why is it a big deal now? I don't get it. I know it's not something desirable and if we had a choice in the matter it would be better if it never existed. But it does! Kind of like saying the government is responsible if you get a mosquito bite.

It's silly to blame the governmental agencies for something which is just a part of nature.

Small pox and polio were just part of nature too, should the government start bringing those back?

[Curly]

Well, the Yellowstone release and subsequent migration into WA definitely sped up the wolf recovery process in WA.  Who is to say how long it would have taken to get to the numbers of wolves we have today without the help of USFWS? 

[bobcat]

The parasite that's being discussed- first I'll say I have not read a whole lot about it, but I'm pretty sure it's a parasite that native wolves in Washington, Idaho, Montana, etc, had before wolves were eliminated from all these states, back in the early 1900's.

So why is it a big deal now? I don't get it. I know it's not something desirable and if we had a choice in the matter it would be better if it never existed. But it does! Kind of like saying the government is responsible if you get a mosquito bite.

It's silly to blame the governmental agencies for something which is just a part of nature.

Small pox and polio were just part of nature too, should the government start bringing those back?

Is small pox and polio covered under the Endangered Species Act?

[bobcat]

Well, the Yellowstone release and subsequent migration into WA definitely sped up the wolf recovery process in WA.  Who is to say how long it would have taken to get to the numbers of wolves we have today without the help of USFWS? 

So let's say they sped the process up by 100 years. Is it worse to deal with the wolves and the parasite now or 100 years from now? Does it matter?

[JimmyHoffa]

The parasite that's being discussed- first I'll say I have not read a whole lot about it, but I'm pretty sure it's a parasite that native wolves in Washington, Idaho, Montana, etc, had before wolves were eliminated from all these states, back in the early 1900's.

So why is it a big deal now? I don't get it. I know it's not something desirable and if we had a choice in the matter it would be better if it never existed. But it does! Kind of like saying the government is responsible if you get a mosquito bite.

It's silly to blame the governmental agencies for something which is just a part of nature.

Small pox and polio were just part of nature too, should the government start bringing those back?

Is small pox and polio covered under the Endangered Species Act?

Probably not until the 'best available science' says they should be.     Wolves are far from being an endangered species.

[pianoman9701]

The parasite that's being discussed- first I'll say I have not read a whole lot about it, but I'm pretty sure it's a parasite that native wolves in Washington, Idaho, Montana, etc, had before wolves were eliminated from all these states, back in the early 1900's.

So why is it a big deal now? I don't get it. I know it's not something desirable and if we had a choice in the matter it would be better if it never existed. But it does! Kind of like saying the government is responsible if you get a mosquito bite.

It's silly to blame the governmental agencies for something which is just a part of nature.

Small pox and polio were just part of nature too, should the government start bringing those back?

No. It didn't start showing up in the US until the 40s and it was pretty rare before the imported wolves started showing it.

[Curly]

Well, the Yellowstone release and subsequent migration into WA definitely sped up the wolf recovery process in WA.  Who is to say how long it would have taken to get to the numbers of wolves we have today without the help of USFWS? 

So let's say they sped the process up by 100 years. Is it worse to deal with the wolves and the parasite now or 100 years from now? Does it matter?

I think it is worse to deal with now.  Hunting would probably be outlawed in 100 years anyway.  Plus, aren't the wolves bigger that were released than the wolves that were traditionally here?  I'm not sure who to believe on that issue......I've heard conflicting reports, but it wouldn't surprise me if it was true. 

[bobcat]

I should clarify- I think the USFWS deserves the blame for the wolves, but not the WDFW. They had nothing to do with it and I'm sure they'd prefer not to have to deal with all these wolf issues.

But then it's hard to blame the USFWS as well, because they are simply following the endangered species act. But to that I would argue that if wolves need to be recovered so do bison. And they're not doing that.

The law definitely needs to be changed.

We eliminated wolves 100 years ago and sure didn't need to bring them back.

However, I honestly believe the wolves would have ended up here anyway, with the help of the USFWS or not.