I have done two years of Weyerhauser permits, one year with Vail and one year with St Helens. I did enjoy the lack of crowds that were normal to the St Helen's area.
I have hunted St Helens area since 1976, and it could be a zoo, especially Winston during modern elk, but deer hunting has been pretty bad last few years. Areas that used to have muddy, worn down deer trails was pretty much sterile.
Don't know if it has gotten any better.
Two years ago was my first time in Vail, but had heard the horror stories, and again, very limited people when I was up there.
This year going to try Green Diamond out of Shelton area.
As much as it pains me pay to access areas I used to have free run of, can't argue the lack of crowds and seemed to me those willing to fork out the cash to get access were certainly more "respectful" for lack of a better word...