Change the 24 caliber min in washington(added poll please vote)

[2MANY]

How about we stop shooting little deer and the WDFW starts planting hatchery deer.

[BULLBLASTER]

How about we stop shooting little deer and the WDFW starts planting hatchery deer.

Only deer with tails removed at the deer hatchery are legal game!

[Karl Blanchard]

How about we stop shooting little deer and the WDFW starts planting hatchery deer.

Only deer with tails removed at the deer hatchery are legal game!

  just another example of why 2MANY is in my top 5 most favorite huntwa poster!

[Bob33]

Youth should be able to shoot a gun they are comfortable with. The argument of more game will be wounded is nonsense in my opinion. A bad shot with a .243 caliber and a.223 caliber will have the same result!

Raise the caliber if youth are losing deer and don't let them hunt until they can handle a larger caliber.

New minimum caliber requirement... 375 hh or larger and only bullets weighing 300 grains can be used. 

Gearing up for opening day:

[Karl Blanchard]

Can you even build potato guns anymore or are they considered WMD's.  I know the ones we built were the opposite of safe

[Karl Blanchard]

Correction,  the things we attempted to launch and the gas and fluids we used to launch them were not safe

[Special T]

One more thing to chew on for the small bullet crowd.  I've shot about 40 deer in my hunting career and noted that not every one falls over dead in their tracks.  A fair number require tracking.  One needs a good blood trail or a lot of familiarity with tracks and being able to recognize precisely which track they should be following.

A .22 isn't going to give a blood trail worth a tinkers' damn and isn't fit for deer hunting.  Not everyone is an exceptional shot for placing bullets, nor are they a good, or above average shooter.   Let's not waste deer.   Some people can't or won't learn how to trail animals.

You don't have to have a blood trail to track an animal. The best outdoorsman are the ones that can track and read sign. Seems to be part of the skill set people overlook.

[Bob33]

Can you even build potato guns anymore or are they considered WMD's.  I know the ones we built were the opposite of safe

No kidding. Some of them have ruthless power.

[Lefthook]

This is a legal firearm for deer, bear, and elk:




But a 223 caliber rifle can't even be used for deer? It seems to me a change in the law might be a good thing.

I agree in general the 243 is a good minimum. But for me the deal is I already own a really nice Browning A bolt in 223 WSSM. It's light and compact and would be the perfect rifle for my daughters to hunt with for their first deer. I'd probably not let them shoot further than about 150 yards anyway.

It kills deer and antelope in Wyoming just fine so I see no reason why it wouldn't kill the just as dead in this state.

Quite a bit of this conversation has to do with youth hunting. If a parent is going to allow a child to hunt with that Glock I can see some serious changes in the law coming up.

[Gringo31]

Good discussion, by vote is to leave it the same.


I have a 12 year old that has harvested 4 deer.  They were shot with either a .243 or a 308 in AR-10.  I have hunted in WI where I took my trusty AR in 223.  I probably shot 6-8 deer with it and was using my coyote rounds 55 grain.  Our hunting party had normal calibers as well as a 220 swift.  We didn't lose any deer we hit but we did study bullet performance and damage done.  All said and done, I don't recommend the combo I was using on deer.  If you hit the bone of the shoulder, it fragged out and didn't have much penetration.  Those required a quick follow up 

I say leave it the same 

[Karl Blanchard]

Good discussion, by vote is to leave it the same.


I have a 12 year old that has harvested 4 deer.  They were shot with either a .243 or a 308 in AR-10.  I have hunted in WI where I took my trusty AR in 223.  I probably shot 6-8 deer with it and was using my coyote rounds 55 grain.  Our hunting party had normal calibers as well as a 220 swift.  We didn't lose any deer we hit but we did study bullet performance and damage done.  All said and done, I don't recommend the combo I was using on deer.  If you hit the bone of the shoulder, it fragged out and didn't have much penetration.  Those required a quick follow up 

I say leave it the same 

  I would counter that with poor bullet selection.  Undoubtedly a 60gr Nosler partition would have much better penetration.   

[JDHasty]

Good discussion, by vote is to leave it the same.


I have a 12 year old that has harvested 4 deer.  They were shot with either a .243 or a 308 in AR-10.  I have hunted in WI where I took my trusty AR in 223.  I probably shot 6-8 deer with it and was using my coyote rounds 55 grain.  Our hunting party had normal calibers as well as a 220 swift.  We didn't lose any deer we hit but we did study bullet performance and damage done.  All said and done, I don't recommend the combo I was using on deer.  If you hit the bone of the shoulder, it fragged out and didn't have much penetration.  Those required a quick follow up 

I say leave it the same 

As a kid in Montana, I have seen a LOT of deer shot w/everything from 22 LR to 220 Swift and what you are saying is so true.  The rimfire shooters were mostly brain shooters.  The 22-250 was and is extremely popular for deer and speed goat.  It looks like the law is still the same. 

Firearms
General Season
• There is no rifle or handgun caliber
limitation for the taking of big game
animals.
• Muzzleloaders, shotguns, archery
equipment, and crossbows are legal

[hunter399]

Well maybe I won't push so hard for it,but it was worth a try.I do think youth would benefit.I do have other calibers in a ar15 , and looking into more .I do think that most handguns they do allow are worst than a 223,If the military has used it for close to fifty years to kill people and it won't kill a deer in washington ,something is wrong.my self I would use it for a truck gun ,brush gun,places where I know my shot is under 150 yrds.Then use my 270 for hikeing,backpacking,mule deer,places I know I might shoot a little farther.But I do respect everbodys opinion, and a fun read of what everbody thinks,thanks for everybody's reply and input,and support.

[Bob33]

This was a good discussion and brought out a lot of interesting perspectives.

I think part of the resistance to change is resistance to change, and that's not always a bad thing. It is challenging to keep track or regulations changes, and the more they occur the more confusion it can create. A good example is what is a legal bull elk? The definition's changed several times in my life, and it seems that once I figure it out the definition changes again.  The regulations pamphlet is already too long and complicated.

I hunt with a friend who still thinks there is a minimum energy requirement for handguns (which went away many years ago.)

Unless there is a compelling reason, or a really strong argument for change, I tend to favor leaving things alone.

[elkboy]

Hunter399, I absolutely see where you are coming from. And in your hands, at the ranges you stated, a .223 centerfire rifle would be a fine rifle for deer.  I think elk are such a large step up from deer in terms of the required firepower that a separate caliber rule might be good for animals that size and larger. But how much do we really want to specify in terms of game law? I think anyone who knowingly chooses too light of a round or caliber for a given game animal will be more likely to hunt poorly in other ways, such as poor shot placement or failure to practice on the range, winding up with the same outcome of wounded and lost game. It is a difficult question.