Idaho F&G Proposal-Outlaw Trail Cameras

[bearpaw]

I think it's a mistake to take away two way communications from hunters. If you take away communications more hunters likely will not carry communications equipment and that could result in more individuals being lost or in a questionable situation without communication ability. I use communications on a daily basis in my guiding business, often times I have more than one hunter and place them in various locations or have them do hunts and pick them up at another location. Communications allows me to make sure my hunters are ok and helps me find them after hiking to different locations. It also helps me find my hunters to help them with downed or wounded game. In many instances two way communications have resulted in getting help to a location to help find wounded game that otherwise would not have been recovered. I also have my drop campers text me the location of their kills, increasingly more and more  hunters do not possess the physical ability to pack an elk back to camp.

I don't view myself as an old person but the truth is I am at the age where I'm not the same rugged hunter I once was and unforeseen health issues could happen and it's only going to get more possible every year. I'm hoping to guide hunters until I'm 70 or 80 but I have started texting or calling the other guides with my location frequently every day just in case something unforseen did happen. During the winter I'm often 20+ miles from my truck on snowmobile in waist deep snow and probably would have a hard time hiking out if I had a breakdown or mishap. In fact I have been rescued a couple times in the last few winters after mishaps.

My advice to these people laying around imagining how certain technology might be viewed unfairly is to actually get out and spend more time hunting by different methods so that rather than dreaming of ways technology might be viewed poorly, you may actually see how technology can be useful and make the woods safer for hunters! People are getting softer and less woodwise by the decade. When I first started outfitting 90% wanted to camp when hunting, now 90% want indoor accommodations and are truly miserable if camping in cold weather. Many hunters, especially older hunters or hunters new to the outdoors, need and want the safety of checking in frequently with two way communications.

[Bob33]

I think it's a mistake to take away two way communications from hunters. If you take away communications more hunters likely will not carry communications equipment and that could result in more individuals being lost or in a questionable situation without communication ability. I use communications on a daily basis in my guiding business, often times I have more than one hunter and place them in various locations or have them do hunts and pick them up at another location. Communications allows me to make sure my hunters are ok and helps me find them after hiking to different locations. It also helps me find my hunters to help them with downed or wounded game. In many instances two way communications have resulted in getting help to a location to help find wounded game that otherwise would not have been recovered. I also have my drop campers text me the location of their kills, increasingly more and more  hunters do not possess the physical ability to pack an elk back to camp.

I don't view myself as an old person but the truth is I am at the age where I'm not the same rugged hunter I once was and unforeseen health issues could happen and it's only going to get more possible every year. I'm hoping to guide hunters until I'm 70 or 80 but I have started texting or calling the other guides with my location frequently every day just in case something unforseen did happen. During the winter I'm often 20+ miles from my truck on snowmobile in waist deep snow and probably would have a hard time hiking out if I had a breakdown or mishap. In fact I have been rescued a couple times in the last few winters after mishaps.

My advice to these people laying around imagining how certain technology might be viewed unfairly is to actually get out and spend more time hunting by different methods so that rather than dreaming of ways technology might be viewed poorly, you may actually see how technology can be useful and make the woods safer for hunters! People are getting softer and less woodwise by the decade. When I first started outfitting 90% wanted to camp when hunting, now 90% want indoor accommodations and are truly miserable if camping in cold weather. Many hunters, especially older hunters or hunters new to the outdoors, need and want the safety of checking in frequently with two way communications.

None of that would be illegal with the proposed change. The use of electronic communications to "aid in the taking of game" would be the only restricted use.

[bearpaw]

I think it's a mistake to take away two way communications from hunters. If you take away communications more hunters likely will not carry communications equipment and that could result in more individuals being lost or in a questionable situation without communication ability. I use communications on a daily basis in my guiding business, often times I have more than one hunter and place them in various locations or have them do hunts and pick them up at another location. Communications allows me to make sure my hunters are ok and helps me find them after hiking to different locations. It also helps me find my hunters to help them with downed or wounded game. In many instances two way communications have resulted in getting help to a location to help find wounded game that otherwise would not have been recovered. I also have my drop campers text me the location of their kills, increasingly more and more  hunters do not possess the physical ability to pack an elk back to camp.

I don't view myself as an old person but the truth is I am at the age where I'm not the same rugged hunter I once was and unforeseen health issues could happen and it's only going to get more possible every year. I'm hoping to guide hunters until I'm 70 or 80 but I have started texting or calling the other guides with my location frequently every day just in case something unforseen did happen. During the winter I'm often 20+ miles from my truck on snowmobile in waist deep snow and probably would have a hard time hiking out if I had a breakdown or mishap. In fact I have been rescued a couple times in the last few winters after mishaps.

My advice to these people laying around imagining how certain technology might be viewed unfairly is to actually get out and spend more time hunting by different methods so that rather than dreaming of ways technology might be viewed poorly, you may actually see how technology can be useful and make the woods safer for hunters! People are getting softer and less woodwise by the decade. When I first started outfitting 90% wanted to camp when hunting, now 90% want indoor accommodations and are truly miserable if camping in cold weather. Many hunters, especially older hunters or hunters new to the outdoors, need and want the safety of checking in frequently with two way communications.

None of that would be illegal with the proposed change. The use of electronic communications to "aid in the taking of game" would be the only restricted use.

One point is that if you tell hunters they can't use communications then hunters may not carry communications. Additionally I don't want to have to argue with some jerk game warden about how my communications are being used. All the game wardens are not nice understanding folks, some are out to write every ticket they can and they delight in trying to write an outfitter a ticket. There are no doubt game wardens who would try to write a person if you used your radios or text while out hunting. I would rather keep two way communications wide open. Is there a biological issue. Has the general public complained. No and no, this again is dogooders dreaming up reasons to outlaw what they believe to be unfair or don't personally approve of.

I had a new young game warden in Montana who was going to write me up because my hunter took his tag with his horns to Australia rather than leaving it on the carcass at the meat locker. I had nothing to do with it but because I was the outfitter he was writing me a ticket. I only got out of it because my rancher called up the regional office and threatened to remove public access to a popular fishing stream through his property.

[Bob33]

I think it's a mistake to take away two way communications from hunters. If you take away communications more hunters likely will not carry communications equipment and that could result in more individuals being lost or in a questionable situation without communication ability. I use communications on a daily basis in my guiding business, often times I have more than one hunter and place them in various locations or have them do hunts and pick them up at another location. Communications allows me to make sure my hunters are ok and helps me find them after hiking to different locations. It also helps me find my hunters to help them with downed or wounded game. In many instances two way communications have resulted in getting help to a location to help find wounded game that otherwise would not have been recovered. I also have my drop campers text me the location of their kills, increasingly more and more  hunters do not possess the physical ability to pack an elk back to camp.

I don't view myself as an old person but the truth is I am at the age where I'm not the same rugged hunter I once was and unforeseen health issues could happen and it's only going to get more possible every year. I'm hoping to guide hunters until I'm 70 or 80 but I have started texting or calling the other guides with my location frequently every day just in case something unforseen did happen. During the winter I'm often 20+ miles from my truck on snowmobile in waist deep snow and probably would have a hard time hiking out if I had a breakdown or mishap. In fact I have been rescued a couple times in the last few winters after mishaps.

My advice to these people laying around imagining how certain technology might be viewed unfairly is to actually get out and spend more time hunting by different methods so that rather than dreaming of ways technology might be viewed poorly, you may actually see how technology can be useful and make the woods safer for hunters! People are getting softer and less woodwise by the decade. When I first started outfitting 90% wanted to camp when hunting, now 90% want indoor accommodations and are truly miserable if camping in cold weather. Many hunters, especially older hunters or hunters new to the outdoors, need and want the safety of checking in frequently with two way communications.

None of that would be illegal with the proposed change. The use of electronic communications to "aid in the taking of game" would be the only restricted use.

One point is that if you tell hunters they can't use communications then hunters may not carry communications. Additionally I don't want to have to argue with some jerk game warden about how my communications are being used. All the game wardens are not nice understanding folks, some are out to write every ticket they can and they delight in trying to write an outfitter a ticket. There are no doubt game wardens who would try to write a person if you used your radios or text while out hunting. I would rather keep two way communications wide open. Is there a biological issue. Has the general public complained. No and no, this again is dogooders dreaming up reasons to outlaw what they believe to be unfair or don't personally approve of.

I had a new young game warden in Montana who was going to write me up because my hunter took his tag with his horns to Australia rather than leaving it on the carcass at the meat locker. I had nothing to do with it but because I was the outfitter he was writing me a ticket. I only got out of it because my rancher called up the regional office and threatened to remove public access to a popular fishing stream through his property.

That could be.

Montana has the same regulation.

[bearpaw]

I think it's a mistake to take away two way communications from hunters. If you take away communications more hunters likely will not carry communications equipment and that could result in more individuals being lost or in a questionable situation without communication ability. I use communications on a daily basis in my guiding business, often times I have more than one hunter and place them in various locations or have them do hunts and pick them up at another location. Communications allows me to make sure my hunters are ok and helps me find them after hiking to different locations. It also helps me find my hunters to help them with downed or wounded game. In many instances two way communications have resulted in getting help to a location to help find wounded game that otherwise would not have been recovered. I also have my drop campers text me the location of their kills, increasingly more and more  hunters do not possess the physical ability to pack an elk back to camp.

I don't view myself as an old person but the truth is I am at the age where I'm not the same rugged hunter I once was and unforeseen health issues could happen and it's only going to get more possible every year. I'm hoping to guide hunters until I'm 70 or 80 but I have started texting or calling the other guides with my location frequently every day just in case something unforseen did happen. During the winter I'm often 20+ miles from my truck on snowmobile in waist deep snow and probably would have a hard time hiking out if I had a breakdown or mishap. In fact I have been rescued a couple times in the last few winters after mishaps.

My advice to these people laying around imagining how certain technology might be viewed unfairly is to actually get out and spend more time hunting by different methods so that rather than dreaming of ways technology might be viewed poorly, you may actually see how technology can be useful and make the woods safer for hunters! People are getting softer and less woodwise by the decade. When I first started outfitting 90% wanted to camp when hunting, now 90% want indoor accommodations and are truly miserable if camping in cold weather. Many hunters, especially older hunters or hunters new to the outdoors, need and want the safety of checking in frequently with two way communications.

None of that would be illegal with the proposed change. The use of electronic communications to "aid in the taking of game" would be the only restricted use.

One point is that if you tell hunters they can't use communications then hunters may not carry communications. Additionally I don't want to have to argue with some jerk game warden about how my communications are being used. All the game wardens are not nice understanding folks, some are out to write every ticket they can and they delight in trying to write an outfitter a ticket. There are no doubt game wardens who would try to write a person if you used your radios or text while out hunting. I would rather keep two way communications wide open. Is there a biological issue. Has the general public complained. No and no, this again is dogooders dreaming up reasons to outlaw what they believe to be unfair or don't personally approve of.

I had a new young game warden in Montana who was going to write me up because my hunter took his tag with his horns to Australia rather than leaving it on the carcass at the meat locker. I had nothing to do with it but because I was the outfitter he was writing me a ticket. I only got out of it because my rancher called up the regional office and threatened to remove public access to a popular fishing stream through his property.

That could be.

Montana has the same regulation.

Yes, we have to be very careful in MT, we get used to communicating casually in other states and it always worries me someone may try to say we are aiding the hunt somehow! I'm constantly reminding the other guides, they probably get tired of hearing me worry. 

[KFhunter]

Those types give a bad name to all the others who use common sense and good judgment.

[bearpaw]

Those types give a bad name to all the others who use common sense and good judgment.

Yes I know, most of the wardens are really good guys. But....

[Bob33]

Those types give a bad name to all the others who use common sense and good judgment.

Yes I know, most of the wardens are really good guys. But....

You need to develop some secret codes for communicating.

“Hey you guys - I’m getting ready to take a lunch break” means “Quick - bring the hunter! There’s a 5x5 over here!”

[KFhunter]

I was impressed with the game warden from Lincoln CO. whom I just met the other day in a hunters ED class.  He seemed like the type we want out in the field, 30yrs or so of service.  Hate to seem them older guys go, guys who are more like a traditional game warden than a police officer who happens to enforce game laws.   

[bearpaw]

Those types give a bad name to all the others who use common sense and good judgment.

Yes I know, most of the wardens are really good guys. But....

You need to develop some secret codes for communicating.

“Hey you guys - I’m getting ready to take a lunch break” means “Quick - bring the hunter! There’s a 5x5 over here!”

Like:  Hey I'm going to have a sandwich but you have the mustard, which way do I go to get the mustard? 

We try to follow all rules that way there isn't any worrying, but I still worry! 

[singleshot12]

Wow, just checked this thread out and I see a lot of opinions , heres another, just my  ....what the heck did we do to get our game 30, 40 or 50 years ago? Quick answer- WE HUNTED! I remember as a kid my dad and I sitting at the top of a draw in late Nov.or early Dec. in below zero temps watching to see what a Muley would do when spooked, I had to keep records of temperature, wind direction, moon phase, etc, etc, etc! Everything was written in journals. We would do the same in spring and fall. It taught us where deer hung out at different times of year, different temps, winter or summer range. I can tell you it made me a HUNTER. Til this day I don't use electronics, gadgets, or cameras to get my animals and none in our family do either and we do pretty good, I will not knock those that do, but really folks theres a lot to be said to getting out there and HUNTING the way it should be done(IMHO)....If hunting hadn't become so competitive, what it scores, and  commercialized (tv shows, equipment etc) maybe we would still be teaching our young to "HUNT".....just my 

Well said Bigmac!  People are so far removed from the natural world as it is. So why should hunters go down the same drain?

[singleshot12]

We try to follow all rules that way there isn't any worrying, but I still worry! 

I would think the main worry would be whether or not clients would fill their tag

[bearpaw]

I was impressed with the game warden from Lincoln CO. whom I just met the other day in a hunters ED class.  He seemed like the type we want out in the field, 30yrs or so of service.  Hate to seem them older guys go, guys who are more like a traditional game warden than a police officer who happens to enforce game laws.   

I'm amazed by the difference in new hires between the states. I get to meet a lot of the new wardens in Idaho because the local region head warden trains many of Idaho's new wardens. They are around for a year or two and then take a position elsewhere in the state, mostly good guys who are hunters themselves. In Washington I'm amazed by how many new hires are not even hunters! They really are more suited to be police than wardens.

[bearpaw]

We try to follow all rules that way there isn't any worrying, but I still worry! 

I would think the main worry would be whether or not clients would fill their tag

I've been an outfitter for a long time, longer than most, this is mostly because we try very hard to follow the rules. After being legal, the next most important issue is getting the hunters shot opportunities and showing them a good time.

[cem3434]

I was impressed with the game warden from Lincoln CO. whom I just met the other day in a hunters ED class.  He seemed like the type we want out in the field, 30yrs or so of service.  Hate to seem them older guys go, guys who are more like a traditional game warden than a police officer who happens to enforce game laws.   

Do you remember his name? I bumped into one up there about 2 years ago and he was a very good LEO and treated us with the same respect that we gave him. We talked about football (he was originally from Wisconsin) and he ever told us about a couple of other places to try. Overall, one of the best interactions I have had with a game warden.