Legal or not?

[ghosthunter]

https://www.leupold.com/night-vision-thermal-scopes/handheld/lto-tracker

[Fl0und3rz]

http://wdfw.wa.gov/help/questions/69/Can+I+use+laser+sights+or+night+vision+devices+to+hunt%3F

http://wdfw.wa.gov/help/questions/77/Can+I+hunt+bobcat%2C+raccoon+or+coyote+at+night+with+a+spotlight%3F

Thermal is considered night vision.

https://app.leg.wa.gov/rcw/default.aspx?cite=77.15.450

[lokidog]

Why would this not be legal? It's not a scope is it?

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

[Fl0und3rz]

Not legal for big game.

(1) A person is guilty of spotlighting big game in the second degree if the person hunts big game with the aid of a spotlight, other artificial light, or night vision equipment while in possession or control of a firearm, bow and arrow, or cross bow. For purposes of this section, "night vision equipment" includes electronic light amplification devices, thermal imaging devices, and other comparable equipment used to enhance night vision.

Legal for other game except during the specified times.

You can hunt bobcat, raccoon, or coyote at night with a spotlight during their open seasons. However, you cannot hunt them with a spotlight during September, October, or November in any area open to a modern firearm deer or elk season.

[lokidog]

So don't carry your gun while using it to find a downed animal. You can't legally shoot it in the dark anyways. It would not be illegal then.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

[Atroxus]

Not legal for big game.

(1) A person is guilty of spotlighting big game in the second degree if the person hunts big game with the aid of a spotlight, other artificial light, or night vision equipment while in possession or control of a firearm, bow and arrow, or cross bow. For purposes of this section, "night vision equipment" includes electronic light amplification devices, thermal imaging devices, and other comparable equipment used to enhance night vision.

Legal for other game except during the specified times.

You can hunt bobcat, raccoon, or coyote at night with a spotlight during their open seasons. However, you cannot hunt them with a spotlight during September, October, or November in any area open to a modern firearm deer or elk season.

Yikes, so if you shoot a big game animal just before dark, you can't legally use a light to follow the blood trail unless you go unarmed?     

[Special T]

If it's less than 4" barrel your not hunting...

[Stein]

It is clearly illegal for deer and elk - doesn't matter what time of day:

Can I use laser sights or night vision devices to hunt?
It is illegal to hunt deer and elk with the aid of infrared night vision equipment or with laser sights (not to include range finders) capable of projecting a beam onto the target while in possession or control of a firearm, bow and arrow, muzzleloading firearm or crossbow.

[lokidog]

It is clearly illegal for deer and elk - doesn't matter what time of day:

Can I use laser sights or night vision devices to hunt?
It is illegal to hunt deer and elk with the aid of infrared night vision equipment or with laser sights (not to include range finders) capable of projecting a beam onto the target while in possession or control of a firearm, bow and arrow, muzzleloading firearm or crossbow.

I still don't know why it would be illegal for recovery w/o a weapon present.  Would I get a ticket for no hunter orange if I recover my animal in the dark w/o wearing orange? I doubt it.

[Atroxus]

It is clearly illegal for deer and elk - doesn't matter what time of day:

Can I use laser sights or night vision devices to hunt?
It is illegal to hunt deer and elk with the aid of infrared night vision equipment or with laser sights (not to include range finders) capable of projecting a beam onto the target while in possession or control of a firearm, bow and arrow, muzzleloading firearm or crossbow.

I still don't know why it would be illegal for recovery w/o a weapon present.  Would I get a ticket for no hunter orange if I recover my animal in the dark w/o wearing orange? I doubt it.

The section below is what I was asking about. According to this if you shoot a big game animal just before dark, and use a flashlight(other artificial light) to follow the blood trail while carrying a weapon suitable for hunting, that you are guilty of "spotlighting big game".

(1) A person is guilty of spotlighting big game in the second degree if the person hunts big game with the aid of a spotlight, other artificial light, or night vision equipment while in possession or control of a firearm, bow and arrow, or cross bow. For purposes of this section, "night vision equipment" includes electronic light amplification devices, thermal imaging devices, and other comparable equipment used to enhance night vision.

[Bob33]

This is similar to the issue of using dogs to retrieve big game.

It is illegal to use thermal imaging devices to hunt big game; that's clear. The first issue then is whether or not you are “hunting”. Using dogs as an example: someone who just shot at and cripples a deer and then runs back to his truck, grabs his hound dog, and takes off with the dog and rifle in hot pursuit of the deer is likely going considered to be hunting with a dog. The man walking his dog who happens to find the same deer is not likely going to be considered hunting.

The definition of “to hunt” includes the word “effort” which implies an intentional act.

http://app.leg.wa.gov/RCW/default.aspx?cite=77.08.010

(62) "To hunt" and its derivatives means an effort to kill, injure, harass, harvest, or capture a wild animal or wild bird.

As to the argument that you aren’t hunting if only searching for a dead animal: how do you know it’s dead? If you know it is dead, then you most likely know where it is and don’t need a dog or thermal imaging device to find it.

There are certainly grey areas with this and other similar issues. I once shot at and mortally wounded an elk just at the end of legal shooting time, but it was still alive. I used a flashlight and searched for it in the dark to find and kill it.  Though technically illegal, I believe it was the correct decision. I’ve asked a few enforcement officers about it, and all expressed an opinion that if the animal was clearly likely to die in the night that hunting for it would be the right choice. However, every situation is different and every enforcement officer sees things a bit differently.

I have a thermal imaging device; they’re incredible tools and could make retrieval of game easier.

Would I use it? Well…

[heronblu]

It is clearly illegal for deer and elk - doesn't matter what time of day:

Can I use laser sights or night vision devices to hunt?
It is illegal to hunt deer and elk with the aid of infrared night vision equipment or with laser sights (not to include range finders) capable of projecting a beam onto the target while in possession or control of a firearm, bow and arrow, muzzleloading firearm or crossbow.

I still don't know why it would be illegal for recovery w/o a weapon present.  Would I get a ticket for no hunter orange if I recover my animal in the dark w/o wearing orange? I doubt it.

The section below is what I was asking about. According to this if you shoot a big game animal just before dark, and use a flashlight(other artificial light) to follow the blood trail while carrying a weapon suitable for hunting, that you are guilty of "spotlighting big game".

(1) A person is guilty of spotlighting big game in the second degree if the person hunts big game with the aid of a spotlight, other artificial light, or night vision equipment while in possession or control of a firearm, bow and arrow, or cross bow. For purposes of this section, "night vision equipment" includes electronic light amplification devices, thermal imaging devices, and other comparable equipment used to enhance night vision.

I think the key words are "hunts big game.." If you are retrieving an already killed animal, then you aren't hunting for it so you would still be in compliance as long as you shot it during legal hours without the use of a light.

[Bob33]

It is clearly illegal for deer and elk - doesn't matter what time of day:

Can I use laser sights or night vision devices to hunt?
It is illegal to hunt deer and elk with the aid of infrared night vision equipment or with laser sights (not to include range finders) capable of projecting a beam onto the target while in possession or control of a firearm, bow and arrow, muzzleloading firearm or crossbow.

I still don't know why it would be illegal for recovery w/o a weapon present.  Would I get a ticket for no hunter orange if I recover my animal in the dark w/o wearing orange? I doubt it.

The section below is what I was asking about. According to this if you shoot a big game animal just before dark, and use a flashlight(other artificial light) to follow the blood trail while carrying a weapon suitable for hunting, that you are guilty of "spotlighting big game".

(1) A person is guilty of spotlighting big game in the second degree if the person hunts big game with the aid of a spotlight, other artificial light, or night vision equipment while in possession or control of a firearm, bow and arrow, or cross bow. For purposes of this section, "night vision equipment" includes electronic light amplification devices, thermal imaging devices, and other comparable equipment used to enhance night vision.

I think the key words are "hunts big game.." If you are retrieving an already killed animal, then you aren't hunting for it so you would still be in compliance as long as you shot it during legal hours without the use of a light.

How do you know it's dead?

[KFhunter]

If you're scoping it with thermal and it gets out of it's bed and runs off, then you'd better go back to the truck 


You guys are making a mountain out of a mole hill, it's no different than using a flashlight to track down an animal you shot at last light. Don't take your hunting rifle, pistol for protection is fine.  You can't dispatch it after hunting hours is over even with your protection pistol.  You have to let it bed down and die.   

If it doesn't die then wait until the morning and shoot it, if it happened to be at the last day of the season and tomorrow morning the season is closed, and the animal clearly won't recover (shot out legs, immobile, mortally wounded can't move)  call a WDFW officer see if anything can be done. 

[Bob33]

If you're scoping it with thermal and it gets out of it's bed and runs off, then you'd better go back to the truck 

Lol. "I was just taking a picture, officer."

It's really too bad that tools like this can't be used legally; the same with dogs. Losing an animal that could otherwise have been retrieved is a real shame.

Here are some photos that I took earlier this year with my thermal device while playing around with it.

[Stein]

It is clearly illegal for deer and elk - doesn't matter what time of day:

Can I use laser sights or night vision devices to hunt?
It is illegal to hunt deer and elk with the aid of infrared night vision equipment or with laser sights (not to include range finders) capable of projecting a beam onto the target while in possession or control of a firearm, bow and arrow, muzzleloading firearm or crossbow.

I still don't know why it would be illegal for recovery w/o a weapon present.  Would I get a ticket for no hunter orange if I recover my animal in the dark w/o wearing orange? I doubt it.

I would give you at least a 95+% chance of getting a ticket.  Hunter's orange is probably the most written, least forgiven ticket there is.  You would have to try to make the case that hauling a deer out was not "hunting" which means you weren't making an effort to harvest a wild animal (paraphrasing the definition).

[Curly]

I agree that you wouldn't be cited packing out an animal while not wearing orange. You are no longer hunting once you've shot and are simply packing meat.

[bigtex]

It is clearly illegal for deer and elk - doesn't matter what time of day:

Can I use laser sights or night vision devices to hunt?
It is illegal to hunt deer and elk with the aid of infrared night vision equipment or with laser sights (not to include range finders) capable of projecting a beam onto the target while in possession or control of a firearm, bow and arrow, muzzleloading firearm or crossbow.

I still don't know why it would be illegal for recovery w/o a weapon present.  Would I get a ticket for no hunter orange if I recover my animal in the dark w/o wearing orange? I doubt it.

I would give you at least a 95+% chance of getting a ticket.  Hunter's orange is probably the most written, least forgiven ticket there is.  You would have to try to make the case that hauling a deer out was not "hunting" which means you weren't making an effort to harvest a wild animal (paraphrasing the definition).

Actually very few hunter orange ticket's are written. It almost always results in a verbal warning.

[Calvin Rayborn]

Nope