Berger bullets?

[Duckslayer89]

Anyone have first hand experience with the hunting vld?

[actionshooter]

I have killed my last 1/2dozen or so bucks with 7mm, 180gr VLD hunting bullets. They are not your typical hunting bullet, they do major damage and you pretty much wont find any jacket or core. But they are extremely accurate and the bottom line is everything I shot died where it was standing.   

[duckmen1]

That's the same luck we've had. Baseball size wound channels. Ruins some meat but animals don't go far. Quick recoveries. I like these bullets to put deer down quick.

[kselkhunter]

Yes. 168gr in 7mmRM. Quick kills on deer.  I have not tried on elk. I prefer Accubomd and Partition on those.

[Duckslayer89]

I'm looking at having some 308 reloads done for my kimber as I'm getting low on factory ammunition and high on nosler brass. I love the accubond but my buddy swears by bergers in his 7 Rem mag. Also been thinking about building a 7 Rem mag and trying to decide on 160 grain accubonds or 180 bergers. Primarily elk/deer/bear gun

[kselkhunter]

I only use 168gr Berger and Nosler 168gr ABLR in my 7mmRM. Great long range performance. And both absolutely hammer deer. I use the ABLR's for elk, when I'm not using the 35 Whelen. 

[W_Ellison2011]

You guys should try barnes bullets. They shoot really well through my 300 wby mag. Have a friend who hunts blacktails with a .338 win mag and barnes tsx bullets and loses very little meat with the bullets expanding perfectly and holding 95-100% weight.

[kselkhunter]

Yes I plan to load some 225gr Barnes TSX up next in my 35 Whelen next. But just helping Duckslayer on his Berger question.

[W_Ellison2011]

Nobody i knows shoots the vld hunting bullets for actual hunting sadly. I figured with the meat loss and huge wound channel talk maybe giving him an idea of another bullet to try for less meat loss with good expansion might be helpful. If he really loves the bergers then go for it. They have a really good high bc for shooting but they do tend to blow up from what i have heard.

[Duckslayer89]

Nobody i knows shoots the vld hunting bullets for actual hunting sadly. I figured with the meat loss and huge wound channel talk maybe giving him an idea of another bullet to try for less meat loss with good expansion might be helpful. If he really loves the bergers then go for it. They have a really good high bc for shooting but they do tend to blow up from what i have heard.

I use to shoot the sst out of my 338 and really didn't like how those blew up. Quartering towards me shot on a whitetail didn't even penetrate from like 60 yards and had to have a follow up shot. The Barnes TSX might be a good bullet for my 338 though to reload, I'm almost out of factory ammo for it too and it's a rare caliber hard to find. 338 RCM. Love it though. I don't know if a 308 can get a tsx to open up properly?

[kselkhunter]

Well the Bergers are designed to fracture and create more damage. For me it's been a mess. Like setting off a concussion grenade inside a deer.

Also for elk I prefer a round that holds together if I have to take a shouldering shot on elk. Hence the Accubond, partition, and now testing some Barnes TSX

[Duckslayer89]

I have killed my last 1/2dozen or so bucks with 7mm, 180gr VLD hunting bullets. They are not your typical hunting bullet, they do major damage and you pretty much wont find any jacket or core. But they are extremely accurate and the bottom line is everything I shot died where it was standing.   

I do like the idea of something dropping where you shoot it. With my 308 and accubonds there has hardly been any kind of blood trail on the last few deer. I hunt thick timber and it's hard to track them when it's getting dark and raining which is why I started thinking about the bergers

[kselkhunter]

Nobody i knows shoots the vld hunting bullets for actual hunting sadly. I figured with the meat loss and huge wound channel talk maybe giving him an idea of another bullet to try for less meat loss with good expansion might be helpful. If he really loves the bergers then go for it. They have a really good high bc for shooting but they do tend to blow up from what i have heard.

I use to shoot the sst out of my 338 and really didn't like how those blew up. Quartering towards me shot on a whitetail didn't even penetrate from like 60 yards and had to have a follow up shot. The Barnes TSX might be a good bullet for my 338 though to reload, I'm almost out of factory ammo for it too and it's a rare caliber hard to find. 338 RCM. Love it though. I don't know if a 308 can get a tsx to open up properly?

Advertised expansion velocity is usually 1800fps.  Even if assuming a higher 2000fps you should be fine. A 168gr 308 TSX should push 2700fps. Smaller options would be even faster. Unless you're looking for long range setup the Barnes should perform fine in 308.

[actionshooter]

I was originally a huge Accubond fan, and really still am, I started using the Bergers because that's what the gunsmith who built my rifle recommended (Rbros). I am super impressed with bullets accuracy, BC, and consistency. The 1st buck I killed I was shocked by the damage the bullets created, but I consistently am shooting 3/8" groups with the load.

With the way the deer go down and stay down, loosing a few pounds of meat isn't a big deal.

[Duckslayer89]

I was originally a huge Accubond fan, and really still am, I started using the Bergers because that's what the gunsmith who built my rifle recommended (Rbros). I am super impressed with bullets accuracy, BC, and consistency. The 1st buck I killed I was shocked by the damage the bullets created, but I consistently am shooting 3/8" groups with the load.

With the way the deer go down and stay down, loosing a few pounds of meat isn't a big deal.

I might have copper creek make me a sample pack of bullets in 308 with the Berger and see how the gun likes them. Any recommendations on what grain to use in a kimber mountain ascent in 308 Winchester? 1-10 twist I believe

[Mtnwalker]

I personally had 2 bad experiences with the bergers, as well as my good hunting buddy having a similar experience the same year. I shot a muley at about 200 yds w/ 7mm 168gr  and 2 out of 3 shots pencil holed and had same size exit as entrance. The next year I shot a small bull at 75 yds, same deal. Took off running like I missed, got lucky and put another one in the spine on the run. First shot was good behind the shoulder lung shot, but again pencil holed both lungs and out other side. I have taken a few deer and 1 elk between 600-750 yds and the bullets performed flawlessly, but I'm in the process of switching because I've had bad luck with close range performance

[Biggerhammer]

I will shoot a Deer or Elk at any angle at any distance with a Accubond. Wouldn't even think about doing the same with a Berger and I like Berger bullets for accuracy but can't stand how finicky they are for load development, particularly seating depth. 

[Crunchy]

I have been loading the Berger vlds for 4 or 5 years now.  Very accurate bullet.  I have killed a few deer and an elk with them, and nothing made it 25 yards from where it was shot.  Longest was just shy of 300 and that deer dropped in its tracks.

[BrownGoinDown]

Berger makes Burger....aka bloodshot... but I like a dead animal when I hit it and like all bullets if I shoot them where I’m supposed to then it doesn’t really matter. I shoot 210 vld’s out off my 300 RUM and I’ll never change.

[CaNINE]

I put a 140 VLD into a Montana Whitetail yesterday. DRT and no more meat damage than I've experienced with other bullet types. 

[idahohuntr]

I've loaded 140 gr bergers in my wife's 7mm-08...shot great, but performance on game was dismal.  Poor penetration, bullet seemed to just come apart.  Switched to barnes tsx and could not be happier with accuracy, performance on game, etc.  I've heard others say when they hear about problems with bergers it's always the 7mm...I know many people swear by them too.

[wsmnut]

One thing to be careful with shooting Bergers on game: make sure you are buying the hunting version.  Also I check the hollow points the dat before the hunt begins and randomly throughout in case I've damaged one somehow.  I'm shooting 190 grain Hunting VLD's out of a 300 WSM.  Very easy to get a great load.  Follow the Berger manual seating depth suggestions and you are MOA or better before you know it.
I've now killed 4 mule deer bucks and 2 bull elk with them.  All chest shots.  The deer were from 160 yards out to 300 yards.  Blood trails a blind man could follow.  None ran farther than 20 yards.  Fantastic wound channel.  Both elk at approximately 450 yards.  Same performance.  Breaking ribs and destroying lungs, etc.  neither went more than a few steps. 
     I had not recovered a Berger until just recently, when I shot an Idaho mule deer at 300 yards.  Deer reacted to the shot.  Walked away out of sight.  We figured out quickly which tracks were his, but no blood.  Unbelievable given my previous experience.  We finally found a speckle of blood and then the deer just around a corner.  Plenty of damage inside but not as much as previous experience and no exit wound.  During cleaning we found the lead core and found the jacket during skinning.
That broadside shot should have been another complete pass through.  Needless to say this was on my mind the next couple days while hunting elk.  Happily the shot on the elk performed flawlessly with a through and through that wrecked both lungs.
     They shoot fanastically well.  I'm going to think about this some more and do a bit of research.  My rifle also likes the 180gr TTSX....haven't tried the lighter weights in it but I will.

Good Luck!

[Stein]

Nobody i knows shoots the vld hunting bullets for actual hunting sadly. I figured with the meat loss and huge wound channel talk maybe giving him an idea of another bullet to try for less meat loss with good expansion might be helpful. If he really loves the bergers then go for it. They have a really good high bc for shooting but they do tend to blow up from what i have heard.

I use to shoot the sst out of my 338 and really didn't like how those blew up. Quartering towards me shot on a whitetail didn't even penetrate from like 60 yards and had to have a follow up shot. The Barnes TSX might be a good bullet for my 338 though to reload, I'm almost out of factory ammo for it too and it's a rare caliber hard to find. 338 RCM. Love it though. I don't know if a 308 can get a tsx to open up properly?

Advertised expansion velocity is usually 1800fps.  Even if assuming a higher 2000fps you should be fine. A 168gr 308 TSX should push 2700fps. Smaller options would be even faster. Unless you're looking for long range setup the Barnes should perform fine in 308.

  TSX in .30 cal is one of the most proven bullets out there.  Chart out your velocity to 1800 fps and see if the range is enough for what you are doing.

[kselkhunter]

This is the summary from Berger's website on how the Hunting VLDs are supposed to perform:

"The Hunting bullet line is made up of Match Grade bullets with quickly lethal terminal performance. These bullets penetrate through the first 2” to 5” of tissue and bone. Once deep inside the vitals it will shed 40% to 90% of its mass as fragments. This energy dump causes massive hydrostatic shock. This shock and the fragments produce tremendous internal tissue damage. The animal may not drop in its tracks but it can’t go far with this much internal damage. "

[h20hunter]

100% what I saw with my dads deer.

[The scout]

They are designed to put all the energy into the animal, and that's what they do. That being said I don't hunt with them

[JDHasty]

They are designed to put all the energy into the animal, and that's what they do. That being said I don't hunt with them

We had a PITA at our gun club who swore by them and made it his personal mission to convert the world to using them or SMK bullets.  Then some time ago he got on the monolithic bandwagon because of lead concerns, and now he has made it his personal mission to convert the world to using Barnes or other monolithic bullets.

Personally, I think he is more right than wrong with getting away from a bullet that fragments, and sends ~ 180 grains of lead all through the meat our family eats, but all my life I have shot Nosler Partitions that retain about 85-90% of their weight when recovered.  I am not interested in switching. 

As far as eating a big game animal shot with a bullet designed to blow up or fragment the way Berger fans claim they do, I wouldn't recommend it.   

[bighorn1]

I shoot 210 Berger's in my 30-378 and they shoot really well I did shoot accubonds but the Berger's on paper really tightened the group.