Major wdfw overhaul

[Mr Mykiss]

Follow the $.  Heck they don't even listen to the state supreme ct or voter initiatives.  Reality check.

No, you're right. Give up. You're getting what you deserve from WDFW.

I'm out.

[bearpaw]

Ummm...Spokane and Yakima doesn't do it for ya?

No it doesn't. If they want input from all hunters there should be meetings held in each corner of the state, not just the biggest cities where they get urban input.


Senate Ways & Means Committee
https://www.tvw.org/watch/?clientID=9375922947&eventID=2017011402&eventID=2017011402&autoStartStream=true

start watching at 53:30
listen to senator at 1:10:55

 

[Special T]

Should we send along our social security number and debit card with that?

Not sure if your serious or not... no I don't want that.

How are we supposed to build a coalition and organize if we cannot build a contact sheet?  Wouldn't you like hunting groups to sit tighter and hammer some benifishal stuff out? The Anti Groups do it.

I've already been given some information and I'm compiling on my own. It is going to happen... The question is do you want your club or Organization to be part of the solution.

 I applaud your effort T, however I do have issues with some of our organizations and their relationship with WDFW.

 Before I discuss those issues, can you tell us all, your long term plan and what you would like to see happen?

Thank you. We have to start some where. The only way we can build a coalition is to sit down with fellow sportsmen and thier groups and hammer out things we agree on.
Collecting this phone tree (for lack of a better term) comes in handy for 2 reasons. That are mutually beneficial, Political, and conservation/sportmanship

Conservation/sportmans ship
Most of us have something that drives us. Some love the setting wings over decoys, the bugal of an elk, the crashing of rams heads on a rock bluff. Some love thier method and want to share as much as they can about it. You see that passion on here about trapping, blackpowder, archery, and long range shooting.  We need to organize to help each other. Most people care about something specific but act locally because if all that is needed is manpower they can show up for half a day meet some people and lend a hand. Good communication and disemination of information is key

Here are 2 examples.
 How many of you on here remember the last min request from Dan McKinney from MDF needing help to repair some deer fencing off I90 near Ellensburg? I do. I don't belong to Me for live in Eburg but I posted it up on FB and alerted my friends and fellow sportsmen that live in the valley.  I don't remember how that emergency project worked out but it was a valuable opportunity.

The last couple of years I have worked hard to have a Traditional bow  only archery 3d shoot at SAB. I contacted Curt Brisket and some members of Traditional Bowhunters of Washington about the shoot. I had volunteers show up to a club they were not members and in one case a man who could not shoot that weekend but helped to setup on Friday.

. I've learned this through my work at Silver Arrow Bowmen. It is the least fun or sexy part of archery but doing the work of finding contacts and spreading the word is how you get stuff done. Trust me when I say this. I don't really want to compile this information. I don't see anyone else doing it and it needs to happen.

I'm not just a bow hunter. I hunt waterfowl, shoot my rifle and take my dog out and frustrate my self on Phesant.  I belive there are sportsmen like me that will help my related interests but timely communication is key.

Political.
I was not heavily in evolved with the Archery coalition but my Friend Ren Sarns Washington chair was and we talked about it plenty with other Bowmen from around the area.
There were a few issues related to archery that needs to be addressed. Lighted knocks, mechanical broad heads and some rule clarifications.  It took sitting down, a bunch of debate and wrangling. When TBW, WSAA, &WB petitioned the state as a unified block the WDFW took notice and made changes.  If you listen to complaints by the department they state hunters are giving them mixed messages and how are they to decifer if Joe 6packs idea on an issue are supported by a large amount of stake holders. When sports men band together  we can make changes. This is our weakness. I want to expand this model of success. I don't know how exactly it will work, or what kinds of issues we can move forward. I do know that a huge majority of hunters agree with more predator control. To me this is a starting point.

Desparage our political enemies,the anti hunting crowd, all you like pointing out thier flaws. They do one thing exceeding well. They are organised and coordinated.

I attended the northcades Griz introduction meeting in Skagit County... The one they didn't want to have, but were compelled to. CNW and Wolf Haven were there in the middle of the day to make thier case. I did not make it in time to be able to make public comment since it was during working hours. They were and were organised with statements of support and represented numbers to the County Commisioners and USFW.

Where was our organized responce?


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[Special T]

I agree the the meeting and input game is rigged against us. The folks from many of these non profits are paid to attend the meetings. If we are not winning with the current strategy then we need to change up how we deal with them.

Sportmens organizations need to network. Each have developed special relation ships with local legislators, Bios, enforcement, county commissioners ect. To capitalize on our experiences we need to meet discuss and build friendships to movehunting issues forward instead of playing in organized defence.

So I will address something that HP alluded to. We are a headstrong group. Each of us may feel slighted by XYZ organisation because of something they have done, or didn't do. Some of these same kinds of animosities  existed between the 3 archery Groups for whatever reason.
If they were able to get over the ribbings and condemnation of having Training Wheels, being Ludites, anal target shooters and work together other organization can work past those as well.


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[bigtex]

How about we adopt something like California has in county Fish and Game Commissions? These commissions have been around for about 100 years.

The commissions are essentially powerless (in terms of setting regs) but serve as an advisory for F&W issues in the county to the state Fish and Game Commission.

Additionally, 50% of fines generated from F&W cases go to the county F&G Commission who then disseminates it for F&W projects in the county.

[Mr Mykiss]

No it doesn't. If they want input from all hunters there should be meetings held in each corner of the state, not just the biggest cities where they get urban input.

So...you'd get more than the 7 people who came to Spokane if you held the meeting in Republic? C'mon now.
Yes I've watched the video, thanks.
So are you saying that it's futile and it doesn't make a difference to give input.
See the list of public meetings that we didn't attend?
http://wdfw.wa.gov/hunting/regulations/seasonsetting/
Below that see Public Comment on specific rule proposals will happen in February 2018??
Maybe comment in Feb??
Maybe call your local wildlife bio?? 

Ok, now I'm out.

[Southpole]

How about have the dept. come to us on the forum, that'd be a lot easier  or have someone print out threads like these, put them in a folder and send it to them.

[bobcat]

Why do we need to attend meetings? Nowadays everything can be done online. They are always asking for input through online surveys/questionnaires, and I usually give them feedback. It even seems that at least in a couple instances, they used my suggestions, although it could have just been a coincidence that what I asked for, I got when the new regulations/seasons were published. However, they haven't yet taken me seriously when I have asked them to force the tribal hunters to follow the same rules that we do.   

[bigtex]

No it doesn't. If they want input from all hunters there should be meetings held in each corner of the state, not just the biggest cities where they get urban input.

So...you'd get more than the 7 people who came to Spokane if you held the meeting in Republic? C'mon now.
Yes I've watched the video, thanks.
So are you saying that it's futile and it doesn't make a difference to give input.
See the list of public meetings that we didn't attend?
http://wdfw.wa.gov/hunting/regulations/seasonsetting/
Below that see Public Comment on specific rule proposals will happen in February 2018??
Maybe comment in Feb??
Maybe call your local wildlife bio?? 

Ok, now I'm out.

What's the department supposed to do, go to every county in the state? I don't know of a department in any state that does that. And if they did, the process would get even longer.

People will always complain about anything. Have a meeting in Colville, well *censored* why wasn't it in Chewelah, I don't want to drive to Colville.

[Bushcraft]

Interesting thread.

I’ve been patiently waiting to see how long it took before someone came up with the right answer before I chimed in. Not to take anything away from any of the other posts on this thread, but very few responses actually answered the gist of the question posed by the OP.
 
In short, to echo Humptulip’s excellent response, organizations that hunters say they want already exist AND are already doing extraordinary things for the benefit of sportsmen in this state (and beyond). As to what we can do moving forward, I and others are laying the groundwork that will further help all sportsmen unify and work together around common goals.

First, let’s discuss the organizations: Safari Club International and their local chapter network (SCI), Washingtonians for Wildlife Conservation (WWC) and Hunter’s Heritage Council (HHC).

There are six SCI chapters spread around the state that are heavily involved in both hunter advocacy and wildlife conservation.  Every single hunter in Washington State should be an SCI member.  After all, we are essentially the NRA for hunting and hunters and work hand in hand with other sportsmen's groups.  Contrary to the mistaken perception some may have of SCI as being a club for rich African hunters, SCI is made up of people from every walk of life and exists purely to drive hunter advocacy and wildlife conservation at the local, state, national and international level. SCI's leadership is extremely well connected politically (on both sides of the aisle) and is literally the 800 lb. political gorilla for the benefit ALL hunters. Didn't know that???  That's our fault!  Rank and file hunters may have not heard about us, or perhaps have that misconception thing I just mentioned, but I can absolutely guarantee that every U.S. Senator and Representative (and their staffs) and the higher ups in the various relevant federal and state agencies know who we are and what we do.  We have certainly come a long way since the late 70's when SCI started off as a social club, but we have a looooong way to go in terms getting the word out to the rank and file sportsmen. As a sitting Board member of SCI that serves on the Membership and Chapter Development Committee (and participate in a handful of other committees) and the Regional Representative for the Pacific Northwest, I am absolutely all ears for ANY positive input I could get from you all on how best to continue our membership growth and the legislative influence that comes with it. www.sci-washington.com  Feel free to shoot me a PM.  Join us and get involved!

And, as Bruce mentioned, a couple very influential “organizations of organizations” already exists for sportsmen: Washingtonians for Wildlife Conservation (WWC) and Hunter’s Heritage Council (HHC).  They are very closely aligned.  WWC mainly exists for education and public outreach whereas you can think of HHC an extremely effective political sledgehammer.  I am involved with each organization and a Board member of the latter.  Haven’t heard of us you say???  Again...that’s our fault.  And so, just like SCI, obviously we need to do a better job of getting the word out since the rank and file hunter may not really know about us.  So...that satisfies the answer to the question of Who hunters can turn to right now for help.  Our next meeting is on December 10th in Ellensburg.  If you are part of the leadership of any sportsmen related organization, please come join us!  Feel free to PM me for further details.

But what can be done to improve our political influence and bring sportsmen together as a larger, more unified coalition? Answer: I and others are actively laying the groundwork for a viable solution that I’m 100% confident all conservation-minded sportsmen will support.  Coincidentally, I sat down for a couple beers over dinner last night with the OP and filled him in on "The Plan".  He got it immediately and has agreed to help.  Special T, perhaps you can work with him to help assemble the info he and I discussed?

What is the plan you ask?  Instead of reinventing the wheel, we would essentially replicate what the fishing community established almost 3 decades ago: The Regional Fisheries Coalition (RFC) and it’s Regional Fisheries Enhancement Groups (RFEG’s).

Please take some time to look at this website. Substitute "fishing" with "hunting" while you are reading:
 http://regionalfisheriescoalition.org/about-us/

Then, take a look at their 2015 Annual Report: http://wdfw.wa.gov/publications/01777/wdfw01777.pdf  Again, substitute the words "fishing" with "hunting" when reading.  Reflect on how the different conservation-minded sportsmen's groups could work together on projects that would be mutually beneficial in their different sub-regions.

The beautiful part of this is that all of the people required to pull this off already exist within and among the various sportsmen and conservation groups around the state  (NRA, SCI, SCIF, NSSF, RMEF, RMGA, MDF, WSF, DU, WWA, Inland Northwest Wildlife Council, Silver Bowmen, Etc., Etc., Etc.)
 
And, the umbrella organization(s) already exist (Washingtonians for Wildlife Conservation and/or Hunter’s Heritage Council).

We are assembling and organizing all the leadership from all the different existing conservation groups to gel at a more local level (like the fishing community as done with RFEG’s).  It will be a unifying structure whereby hunter advocacy efforts would both be localized in accordance with local interests, but also as integral components of a much larger and more influential body.

This is happening.  The sportsmen’s groups you belong to need to be a part of it.  Let them know they need to get on board.

If you want to be part of the solution, please send me a PM.

Sincerely,

Allen R. Ernst

  Region 1 Representative
  Safari Club International
  www.sci-washington.com
  www.scifirstforhunters.com

  E-mail: allen.ernst@comcast.net
  Cell: 206.229.2519
  Fax: 206.237.2696

 

[pianoman9701]

I like the idea of a coalition, ST. You'd need to first start an organization that has a name that says what it is. WA Sporting Organization Coalition, for example.Come up with a mission statement that's clear and concise which basically says the organization's purpose is to combine the strength of as many individual orgs as possible to promote better hunting access, reform outdated and ineffective regulation, and represent sportsman to state agencies and the legislature in matters which affect the present and future of our sporting heritage. I would think that you'd have a list of all the separate organizations and on each issue, you'd confirm the support of each organization. There may be issues of which backcountry Anglers and the Elk Foundation won't both be on the same side. Then the organizations who do latch onto a specific "cause" for lack of a better word, would each contact their members to get involved - email or letters, attend meetings, protests, whatever is planned.

Is that something like you were thinking?

[pianoman9701]

Why do we need to attend meetings? Nowadays everything can be done online. They are always asking for input through online surveys/questionnaires, and I usually give them feedback. It even seems that at least in a couple instances, they used my suggestions, although it could have just been a coincidence that what I asked for, I got when the new regulations/seasons were published. However, they haven't yet taken me seriously when I have asked them to force the tribal hunters to follow the same rules that we do.   

Why would they? The have no power to affect changes in Federal treaties.

[Bushcraft]

I like the idea of a coalition, ST. You'd need to first start an organization that has a name that says what it is. WA Sporting Organization Coalition, for example.Come up with a mission statement that's clear and concise which basically says the organization's purpose is to combine the strength of as many individual orgs as possible to promote better hunting access, reform outdated and ineffective regulation, and represent sportsman to state agencies and the legislature in matters which affect the present and future of our sporting heritage. I would think that you'd have a list of all the separate organizations and on each issue, you'd confirm the support of each organization. There may be issues of which backcountry Anglers and the Elk Foundation won't both be on the same side. Then the organizations who do latch onto a specific "cause" for lack of a better word, would each contact their members to get involved - email or letters, attend meetings, protests, whatever is planned.

Is that something like you were thinking?

We may have posted at the same time.  Per my post just prior to yours, please note that those organizations already exist. But, we can do better. Join us!

[Special T]

How about have the dept. come to us on the forum, that'd be a lot easier  or have someone print out threads like these, put them in a folder and send it to them.

I think there is value in the WDFW coming on here to get the pulse of thier major stakeholder. The problem appears to be that they are unsure about a great many things. They don't really treat thier job like the private sector does and can't seem to relate. If you or I were hearing a lot of complaints, or didn't understand why a large portion of our customers were in revolt we would probably seek them out and just chat to try and get to source of the issue or some kind of well thought out remedy.

I think the department operates out of fear. They choose not to be proactive and engage. I belive that BECAUSE they don't actively engage a lot of false quasi truths get spread.
Cases In point some mayremeber WDFWinsider whom worked in the office. I think it was special permits or something.  He talked in general terms about the department, his job and general info about the Department. He was told to stop coming on here. When he was fired for "dating his boss"  he came back on here while looking for a job. He couldn't find one because had been blackmailed for talking about the department. I belive most of his discussions were professional in nature.

Big Tex hides his identity like it was a nuclear launch code. 90% of his responce s are educational in nature the other 10% are thought out responce s to posses off folks about infractions or rules.

The department appears to like it's insulation from us, and much of it has a hard time relating.

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[bobcat]

Why do we need to attend meetings? Nowadays everything can be done online. They are always asking for input through online surveys/questionnaires, and I usually give them feedback. It even seems that at least in a couple instances, they used my suggestions, although it could have just been a coincidence that what I asked for, I got when the new regulations/seasons were published. However, they haven't yet taken me seriously when I have asked them to force the tribal hunters to follow the same rules that we do.   

Why would they? The have no power to affect changes in Federal treaties.

They could do something if they wanted to. But they obviously don't. Not change the treaty, but some sort of co-management where the Yakama tribe isn't killing more than what is sustainable. I find it hard to believe the WDFW can do nothing to control the number of deer and elk killed by the Yakama tribe, when they DO have a say in how many bighorn sheep and mountain goat they are allowed to harvest.