Trump Administration Lifts Ban on Imports of Elephant Hunting Trophies

[JimmyHoffa]

Ivory is only banned for certain animals.  The times that elephant ivory is restricted makes it much more desirable for ivory mining in Siberia, where they dig up old mammoths.  Makes basically the same trinkets and potions in Asia with it.

[Dan-o]

I'm so glad as U.S. citizens we can manage another countries wildlife smh.  How about let's work on managing our wildlife.  Let's let them manage their own.  It's the U.S. citizen that goes and spends thousands of dollars to go shoot an elephant that gives us all a bad name! Kinda like the lion guy.  Lifting this ban will increase poaching and the black market imo

I'm delighted to have the opportunity to clear up a few of your misconceptions regarding licensed trophy hunting in Africa. So, these countries are poor. Take the southern white rhino. In 1960, there were 800 left. Today, there are over 20K living in the wild. Their recovery is due almost completely to breeding programs, habitat improvement, and anti-poaching patrols paid for with trophy hunting dollars. Look it up. The Northern white rhino hasn't been legally hunted for 40 years and faces extinction within 5 years. They can't afford the anti-poaching patrols necessary to protect them. Their habitat has been ruined by poverty, farming, and war. The success of the southern rhino is true of more than a dozen species across Africa. You seriously need to learn about conservation and how licensed hunting saves species if you're going to be a representative of our hunting culture. This is the tip of the iceberg.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Southern_white_rhinoceros

The White Rhino case study is (to me) a perfect example of why it is good for species to be legally hunted.

I think the parallels probably hold true for elephants.

Personally, I have no interest in shooting an elephant, but I think if someone goes over and legally takes one, he should be able to bring back what he wants.

[trophyhunt]

Agree w dan-o, I could never kill an elephant, they are intelligent animals.  And my grandma loved them, she’d come after me from the dead if I ever hunted one. I support all hunting and understand conservation, but just could never kill an elephant.

[Britt-dog]

Agree w dan-o, I could never kill an elephant, they are intelligent animals.  And my grandma loved them, she’d come after me from the dead if I ever hunted one. I support all hunting and understand conservation, but just could never kill an elephant.

Please quantify at what level of intelligence, you are no longer whiling to kill an animal. Bears are very intelligent, as are coyotes, the difference between them and say Horses and Elephants is people have attached emotion to horses and elephants. Go live with elephants for a few years and I bet your opinion of them will change.

[trophyhunt]

Agree w dan-o, I could never kill an elephant, they are intelligent animals.  And my grandma loved them, she’d come after me from the dead if I ever hunted one. I support all hunting and understand conservation, but just could never kill an elephant.

Please quantify at what level of intelligence, you are no longer whiling to kill an animal. Bears are very intelligent, as are coyotes, the difference between them and say Horses and Elephants is people have attached emotion to horses and elephants. Go live with elephants for a few years and I bet your opinion of them will change.

Honestly the older I get the more I think about the intelligence of animals. I think most hunters don’t live for the kill, it’s the hunt we need.  Bears are smart, I have killed a few of them, I’m now picky about which bear I’ll take.  Passed up a medium sized bear this past spring.  Elephants to me are just too cool, and remember, I said I’d never go against hunters rights even if I’ll never hunt that species. Coyotes are damn smart, but they kill a crap ton of small deer, and they will never be eaten by me, so they must die!   

[jackelope]

Agree w dan-o, I could never kill an elephant, they are intelligent animals.  And my grandma loved them, she’d come after me from the dead if I ever hunted one. I support all hunting and understand conservation, but just could never kill an elephant.

Please quantify at what level of intelligence, you are no longer whiling to kill an animal. Bears are very intelligent, as are coyotes, the difference between them and say Horses and Elephants is people have attached emotion to horses and elephants. Go live with elephants for a few years and I bet your opinion of them will change.

I’m not interested in killing one. That’s my level of non-interest. 100%. You keep posting asking folks to “quantify their reason”. Nobody needs to quantify anything. If they don’t want to, they don’t want to. I’ve never killed a bear either. Have little to no interest in it. Why? Just cuz. Reason enough for me.


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[Britt-dog]

Agree w dan-o, I could never kill an elephant, they are intelligent animals.  And my grandma loved them, she’d come after me from the dead if I ever hunted one. I support all hunting and understand conservation, but just could never kill an elephant.

Please quantify at what level of intelligence, you are no longer whiling to kill an animal. Bears are very intelligent, as are coyotes, the difference between them and say Horses and Elephants is people have attached emotion to horses and elephants. Go live with elephants for a few years and I bet your opinion of them will change.

I’m not interested in killing one. That’s my level of non-interest. 100%. You keep posting asking folks to “quantify their reason”. Nobody needs to quantify anything. If they don’t want to, they don’t want to. I’ve never killed a bear either. Have little to no interest in it. Why? Just cuz. Reason enough for me.


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So your saying you actually don't have an open mind, when it comes to this subject. In an effort to spur intelligent debate I have asked two posters in this thread to give the reasoning behind their opinions, or statements. I thought you were capable of that. I stand corrected.

[KFhunter]

I would like more people to kill bears in areas where deer are struggling to retain fawns, that's enough reason for me.  I understand not wanting to eat it, but I could give it away very quickly, I've had numerous people ask. 

[jackelope]

Agree w dan-o, I could never kill an elephant, they are intelligent animals.  And my grandma loved them, she’d come after me from the dead if I ever hunted one. I support all hunting and understand conservation, but just could never kill an elephant.

Please quantify at what level of intelligence, you are no longer whiling to kill an animal. Bears are very intelligent, as are coyotes, the difference between them and say Horses and Elephants is people have attached emotion to horses and elephants. Go live with elephants for a few years and I bet your opinion of them will change.

I’m not interested in killing one. That’s my level of non-interest. 100%. You keep posting asking folks to “quantify their reason”. Nobody needs to quantify anything. If they don’t want to, they don’t want to. I’ve never killed a bear either. Have little to no interest in it. Why? Just cuz. Reason enough for me.


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So your saying you actually don't have an open mind, when it comes to this subject. In an effort to spur intelligent debate I have asked two posters in this thread to give the reasoning behind their opinions, or statements. I thought you were capable of that. I stand corrected.

I have a very open mind. I’ve gone on bear hunts with friends. Glassed for bears for friends. Backpacked miles to show friends where bears live. I just don’t have any interest in shooting one myself. It’s not something up for debate for me personally. I don’t give a hoot what anyone else thinks. I’m not interested in shooting a bear. And it shouldn’t be. I’ll shoot lions, wolves, coyotes, elk, deer, blah blah blah. If a guy doesn’t want to shoot something, perfect! That’s his choice.
This specific topic is regarding elephants. We should probably try and keep it that way.

[Bob33]

Agree w dan-o, I could never kill an elephant, they are intelligent animals.  And my grandma loved them, she’d come after me from the dead if I ever hunted one. I support all hunting and understand conservation, but just could never kill an elephant.

Please quantify at what level of intelligence, you are no longer whiling to kill an animal. Bears are very intelligent, as are coyotes, the difference between them and say Horses and Elephants is people have attached emotion to horses and elephants. Go live with elephants for a few years and I bet your opinion of them will change.

I’m not interested in killing one. That’s my level of non-interest. 100%. You keep posting asking folks to “quantify their reason”. Nobody needs to quantify anything. If they don’t want to, they don’t want to. I’ve never killed a bear either. Have little to no interest in it. Why? Just cuz. Reason enough for me.


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So your saying you actually don't have an open mind, when it comes to this subject. In an effort to spur intelligent debate I have asked two posters in this thread to give the reasoning behind their opinions, or statements. I thought you were capable of that. I stand corrected.

Being capable of expressing the rationale for an opinion, and choosing to voluntarily do so are two differnt things. I thought most people would understand that. I stand corrected.

[Boss .300 winmag]

Just imagine the size of a bull elephant euro mount. 

I’ve had elephant jerky, tough but tasty.

I support all legal hunting, some species just aren’t for everyone. 

Mine is grizzlies, why kill one if you aren’t going to eat it.

[trophyhunt]

Agree w dan-o, I could never kill an elephant, they are intelligent animals.  And my grandma loved them, she’d come after me from the dead if I ever hunted one. I support all hunting and understand conservation, but just could never kill an elephant.

Please quantify at what level of intelligence, you are no longer whiling to kill an animal. Bears are very intelligent, as are coyotes, the difference between them and say Horses and Elephants is people have attached emotion to horses and elephants. Go live with elephants for a few years and I bet your opinion of them will change.

I’m not interested in killing one. That’s my level of non-interest. 100%. You keep posting asking folks to “quantify their reason”. Nobody needs to quantify anything. If they don’t want to, they don’t want to. I’ve never killed a bear either. Have little to no interest in it. Why? Just cuz. Reason enough for me.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

So your saying you actually don't have an open mind, when it comes to this subject. In an effort to spur intelligent debate I have asked two posters in this thread to give the reasoning behind their opinions, or statements. I thought you were capable of that. I stand corrected.

Just because we don’t want to kill elephants has nothing to do with having an open mind, you’ll never convince me to hunt and kill elephants. But if you want to, and if your ever in need of my vote so you can, you got it! I think your taking this personally.   

[jackelope]

Agree w dan-o, I could never kill an elephant, they are intelligent animals.  And my grandma loved them, she’d come after me from the dead if I ever hunted one. I support all hunting and understand conservation, but just could never kill an elephant.

Please quantify at what level of intelligence, you are no longer whiling to kill an animal. Bears are very intelligent, as are coyotes, the difference between them and say Horses and Elephants is people have attached emotion to horses and elephants. Go live with elephants for a few years and I bet your opinion of them will change.

I’m not interested in killing one. That’s my level of non-interest. 100%. You keep posting asking folks to “quantify their reason”. Nobody needs to quantify anything. If they don’t want to, they don’t want to. I’ve never killed a bear either. Have little to no interest in it. Why? Just cuz. Reason enough for me.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

So your saying you actually don't have an open mind, when it comes to this subject. In an effort to spur intelligent debate I have asked two posters in this thread to give the reasoning behind their opinions, or statements. I thought you were capable of that. I stand corrected.

Just because we don’t want to kill elephants has nothing to do with having an open mind, you’ll never convince me to hunt and kill elephants. But if you want to, and if your ever in need of my vote so you can, you got it! I think your taking this personally.   

Well said, sir!!


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[Britt-dog]

Agree w dan-o, I could never kill an elephant, they are intelligent animals.  And my grandma loved them, she’d come after me from the dead if I ever hunted one. I support all hunting and understand conservation, but just could never kill an elephant.

Please quantify at what level of intelligence, you are no longer whiling to kill an animal. Bears are very intelligent, as are coyotes, the difference between them and say Horses and Elephants is people have attached emotion to horses and elephants. Go live with elephants for a few years and I bet your opinion of them will change.

I’m not interested in killing one. That’s my level of non-interest. 100%. You keep posting asking folks to “quantify their reason”. Nobody needs to quantify anything. If they don’t want to, they don’t want to. I’ve never killed a bear either. Have little to no interest in it. Why? Just cuz. Reason enough for me.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

So your saying you actually don't have an open mind, when it comes to this subject. In an effort to spur intelligent debate I have asked two posters in this thread to give the reasoning behind their opinions, or statements. I thought you were capable of that. I stand corrected.

I have a very open mind. I’ve gone on bear hunts with friends. Glassed for bears for friends. Backpacked miles to show friends where bears live. I just don’t have any interest in shooting one myself. It’s not something up for debate for me personally. I don’t give a hoot what anyone else thinks. I’m not interested in shooting a bear. And it shouldn’t be. I’ll shoot lions, wolves, coyotes, elk, deer, blah blah blah. If a guy doesn’t want to shoot something, perfect! That’s his choice.
This specific topic is regarding elephants. We should probably try and keep it that way.

I wasn't trying to change the subject to bears, but trying to find a correlation between intelligent animals. Maybe a pig would have been a better choice.

The subject of this thread is the lifting of the ban on trophy ivory importation. There are a lot of uninformed people making comments and generalizations on the subject here and elsewhere. I'm just trying to get some of them to think a little deeper before making those statements or making up their mind.

I see many similarities between this subject, and deer/bear baiting, and hound hunting. Hunters who were apathetic to, or against hound hunting and bear baiting helped pass initiative 655.

The ban of trophy ivory importation effects almost none of us. The unorganized uninformed approach to subjects like this by hunters as a group will eventually affect us all in one way or another.

[Dan-o]

QUOTE FROM BRITT-DOG:
So your saying you actually don't have an open mind, when it comes to this subject. In an effort to spur intelligent debate I have asked two posters in this thread to give the reasoning behind their opinions, or statements. I thought you were capable of that. I stand corrected.

When you write stuff like this, it doesn't come off like you're trying to educate anyone.    It comes across very much like you want to argue.       

You basically said that Jackalope isn't capable of thinking at your level.    I've never met the man, but.........