Secondary Blacktail Rut?

[Whitenuckles]

 So.... Of course the main part of the rut on my cameras was the 4th-12th. Saw lots of action, bucks I've never seen before or even had pics of. So what i have read is that the secondary rut will start 28 day's later. Is that accurate? What do y'all think?

[Skyvalhunter]

Yea its in there somewhere. Depends on the does, as some even say theres later cycles

[boneaddict]

I find with muledeer and whitetail the cycles are closer together.  Closer to Thanksgiving for mules being when it starts to peak again.   My reasoning to justify what I see....the rut is a bellcurve, its not like everyone fires during the peak.  Bucks slow but don't come to complete stop.   There isn't a dead gap in between......Whitetails start later therefore goes later. 

[JakeLand]

Last night we watched a 2 point blacktail chasing a doe back and forth across hwy 2

[Whitenuckles]

Last night we watched a 2 point blacktail chasing a doe back and forth across hwy 2

I'm there with you. I see lots of small bucks. I had 8 bucks in front of my blind last friday all in the last 45 min of daylight. But all my big boys have seemed to disappear. When they were in "peak", there were 3 to 5 big bucks following a single doe. And it was happening at the same time on different parts of our property.
 Last year there was an early snow in the beginning of December.  I remember walking through the woods and being able to smell the rutty bucks that were in the area. About 30 min later I rounded a corner and a beautiful 5 point had his nose in her sweet spot. And being on a first time muzzy hunt. I did something wrong and my gun wouldn't fire. So I'm hoping to hit that timing again.

 I swear...... these Blacktail are the hardest animal I have ever hunted for.

[jackmaster]

Last night we watched a 2 point blacktail chasing a doe back and forth across hwy 2

I'm there with you. I see lots of small bucks. I had 8 bucks in front of my blind last friday all in the last 45 min of daylight. But all my big boys have seemed to disappear. When they were in "peak", there were 3 to 5 big bucks following a single doe. And it was happening at the same time on different parts of our property.
 Last year there was an early snow in the beginning of December.  I remember walking through the woods and being able to smell the rutty bucks that were in the area. About 30 min later I rounded a corner and a beautiful 5 point had his nose in her sweet spot. And being on a first time muzzy hunt. I did something wrong and my gun wouldn't fire. So I'm hoping to hit that timing again.

 I swear...... these Blacktail are the hardest animal I have ever hunted for.

pull the nipple out in the morning before you leave the house and make sure it's clean, never reuse a cap either, always put a new one on 

[Whitenuckles]

Last night we watched a 2 point blacktail chasing a doe back and forth across hwy 2

I'm there with you. I see lots of small bucks. I had 8 bucks in front of my blind last friday all in the last 45 min of daylight. But all my big boys have seemed to disappear. When they were in "peak", there were 3 to 5 big bucks following a single doe. And it was happening at the same time on different parts of our property.
 Last year there was an early snow in the beginning of December.  I remember walking through the woods and being able to smell the rutty bucks that were in the area. About 30 min later I rounded a corner and a beautiful 5 point had his nose in her sweet spot. And being on a first time muzzy hunt. I did something wrong and my gun wouldn't fire. So I'm hoping to hit that timing again.

 I swear...... these Blacktail are the hardest animal I have ever hunted for.

pull the nipple out in the morning before you leave the house and make sure it's clean, never reuse a cap either, always put a new one on 

I hope that was my problem. I did use the same cap for about 2 weeks.

[Axle]

Quite possibly the main reason BT bucks are running around trying to breed does 'out of the rut' is because there aren't enough does to breed.
I think my reply need s whole new thread though.

[Mallardmasher]

I watched a mid sized buck a couple days ago, run the does two yearling all over the place, no they are loners, and he has been with her for two days, following her every where.

After he chases her yearling off, does it force her to come into season?

[jackmaster]

Last night we watched a 2 point blacktail chasing a doe back and forth across hwy 2

I'm there with you. I see lots of small bucks. I had 8 bucks in front of my blind last friday all in the last 45 min of daylight. But all my big boys have seemed to disappear. When they were in "peak", there were 3 to 5 big bucks following a single doe. And it was happening at the same time on different parts of our property.
 Last year there was an early snow in the beginning of December.  I remember walking through the woods and being able to smell the rutty bucks that were in the area. About 30 min later I rounded a corner and a beautiful 5 point had his nose in her sweet spot. And being on a first time muzzy hunt. I did something wrong and my gun wouldn't fire. So I'm hoping to hit that timing again.

 I swear...... these Blacktail are the hardest animal I have ever hunted for.

pull the nipple out in the morning before you leave the house and make sure it's clean, never reuse a cap either, always put a new one on 

I hope that was my problem. I did use the same cap for about 2 weeks.

are you using pellets or loose powder? And yeah never use the same cap, once I decap it gets tossed!!

[Whitenuckles]

Last night we watched a 2 point blacktail chasing a doe back and forth across hwy 2

I'm there with you. I see lots of small bucks. I had 8 bucks in front of my blind last friday all in the last 45 min of daylight. But all my big boys have seemed to disappear. When they were in "peak", there were 3 to 5 big bucks following a single doe. And it was happening at the same time on different parts of our property.
 Last year there was an early snow in the beginning of December.  I remember walking through the woods and being able to smell the rutty bucks that were in the area. About 30 min later I rounded a corner and a beautiful 5 point had his nose in her sweet spot. And being on a first time muzzy hunt. I did something wrong and my gun wouldn't fire. So I'm hoping to hit that timing again.

 I swear...... these Blacktail are the hardest animal I have ever hunted for.

pull the nipple out in the morning before you leave the house and make sure it's clean, never reuse a cap either, always put a new one on 

I hope that was my problem. I did use the same cap for about 2 weeks.

are you using pellets or loose powder? And yeah never use the same cap, once I decap it gets tossed!!

3- 30 grain pellets. My gun seems to be more accurate with less powder. I tried up to 150 grains, it was shooting a 6 inch pattern at 100. Not cool.

[Whitenuckles]

Quite possibly the main reason BT bucks are running around trying to breed does 'out of the rut' is because there aren't enough does to breed.
I think my reply need s whole new thread though.

Could be. I have roughly 1.5 bucks to 1 doe on the property.  I don't know why. Last year we had a lot of cats. But only one hanging around this year.
 Another thing.... My wife and I walk the property almost everyday, all year long. These deer don't mind us at all. In fact 3 of the does next to the house let us pet them. Little bucks will let us walk only a few feet from them. And I have only harvested 3 deer off the property in 5 years. So why are the big boys so freaking hard to catch on there feet? What makes them so anal compared to the rest of them? It just dosent make any sense to me......

[Skyvalhunter]

Last night we watched a 2 point blacktail chasing a doe back and forth across hwy 2

He won't live long when the slope dopes start traveling up and down the highway

[kodiak 907]

Quite possibly the main reason BT bucks are running around trying to breed does 'out of the rut' is because there aren't enough does to breed.
I think my reply need s whole new thread though.

Around the area I hunt, this seems to be the case this year. Every doe has 2-3 bucks in the immediate area.

[fishnfur]

Quite possibly the main reason BT bucks are running around trying to breed does 'out of the rut' is because there aren't enough does to breed.
I think my reply need s whole new thread though.

Around the area I hunt, this seems to be the case this year. Every doe has 2-3 bucks in the immediate area.

In my mind, the  (observed) buck to doe ratio is skewed for two reasons: 

  - Lack of hunting pressure has allowed the buck to doe ratio to reach near equal proportions - 1/1.  It will likely never go higher than one to one.  Unbred does in the first couple of estrus periods (low buck to doe ratio) tend to produce buck offspring as a compensatory mechanism that should produce more bucks for the population.  Sounds like you're pretty close to max bucks per doe.

- Bucks are attracted to the increased activity and scent that a doe experiences just prior to her fertility phase.  A buck won't hang with a doe if she's not showing signs of getting hot, they go find one that is.  When there's a high buck to doe ratio, it makes sense to me that multiple bucks all hang with the hottie who's close to giving it up.  All the pregnant and in-between estrus period does are being boring and just sitting around at home.  Sounds like high school, huh?

[fishnfur]

BTW - 19 - 21 days was the cycle found by researchers in WA back in the 40s.  That is an average, and unless you know when a doe last went into heat, the number is less meaningful.  The average BT doe peak estrus (on the bell curve - as Bone pointed out) is somewhere around 7 - 10 Nov.  The next, possibly third cycle kicked in a a few days ago and is somewhere near peak (for un-bred does) right now.  28 day cycle is quoted by a lot of writers, but there are no statistics to support those numbers. 

[kodiak 907]

Quite possibly the main reason BT bucks are running around trying to breed does 'out of the rut' is because there aren't enough does to breed.
I think my reply need s whole new thread though.

Around the area I hunt, this seems to be the case this year. Every doe has 2-3 bucks in the immediate area.

In my mind, the  (observed) buck to doe ratio is skewed for two reasons: 

  - Lack of hunting pressure has allowed the buck to doe ratio to reach near equal proportions - 1/1.  It will likely never go higher than one to one.  Unbred does in the first couple of estrus periods (low buck to doe ratio) tend to produce buck offspring as a compensatory mechanism that should produce more bucks for the population.  Sounds like you're pretty close to max bucks per doe.

- Bucks are attracted to the increased activity and scent that a doe experiences just prior to her fertility phase.  A buck won't hang with a doe if she's not showing signs of getting hot, they go find one that is.  When there's a high buck to doe ratio, it makes sense to me that multiple bucks all hang with the hottie who's close to giving it up.  All the pregnant and in-between estrus period does are being boring and just sitting around at home.  Sounds like high school, huh?

Definitely agree, lots of large chunks of private ground helps to keep the numbers up also. The long tails are starting to show up on all my cams. The bucks must be better at eluding because all I find is doe cat kills.