Any other bowhunters want to throw up?

[jdb]

Whether we want to admit it or not overall population of the Yakima pmu is down significantly over the last couple years. We are still allowed late season so I don't see anything wrong with the 3-year cycle of letting the herb build back up. I also believe that should be Universal across the board and not just early archery as I think that's a pretty small Band-Aid for pretty big wound. This is coming from a guy who loves early archery season and despises having to hunt late archery. Backpacking in the sunshine and calling in Elk is the best thing ever and I'll still be doing it but I'll be looking for spikes.

show me the increases for us muzzleloaders in ride units?

So, you're for the substantial increase in cow tags for the muzzleloader and rifle guys? Your opinion is those new tags will tag out less cows than the OTC archery cow tag and build the herd back up?

Please don't take those as negatives just genuine guestions for me to gain more knowledge.

Jesus, keep reading all the responses. I already said I said a mistake and misspoke. I didn't delete the comments because the flow of the thread had already taken shape. I corrected and said the cow permits are still the same number but at least you have the option to hunt cows.
What else do you need from me?

you still have the option to hunt cows in the late season

[92xj]

Whether we want to admit it or not overall population of the Yakima pmu is down significantly over the last couple years. We are still allowed late season so I don't see anything wrong with the 3-year cycle of letting the herb build back up. I also believe that should be Universal across the board and not just early archery as I think that's a pretty small Band-Aid for pretty big wound. This is coming from a guy who loves early archery season and despises having to hunt late archery. Backpacking in the sunshine and calling in Elk is the best thing ever and I'll still be doing it but I'll be looking for spikes.

show me the increases for us muzzleloaders in ride units?

So, you're for the substantial increase in cow tags for the muzzleloader and rifle guys? Your opinion is those new tags will tag out less cows than the OTC archery cow tag and build the herd back up?

Please don't take those as negatives just genuine guestions for me to gain more knowledge.

Jesus, keep reading all the responses. I already said I said a mistake and misspoke. I didn't delete the comments because the flow of the thread had already taken shape. I corrected and said the cow permits are still the same number but at least you have the option to hunt cows.
What else do you need from me?

you still have the option to hunt cows in the late season

EDITED...
Not worth the time.

You people go support whatever you see fit and don't stick together with other hunters.
There will be a time when each group of weapons needs a helping hand from the other groups.  Will be very interested in if they get it.

[Oh Mah]

Muzzleloaders and rifle guys.
Are you going to support the change and be for the elimination of all cow tags and no permit cow tags for archery guys or are you going to support the bow hunters and reject the elimination of all cow tags?
Will hunters stick together or divide farther?

what is the big deal either way?no we don't want to pit any group against any other group.but if they rotate its fair,if they cut cow tags altogether that's fine too.rotate what you hunt with. 

[hughjorgan]

Whether we want to admit it or not overall population of the Yakima pmu is down significantly over the last couple years. We are still allowed late season so I don't see anything wrong with the 3-year cycle of letting the herb build back up. I also believe that should be Universal across the board and not just early archery as I think that's a pretty small Band-Aid for pretty big wound. This is coming from a guy who loves early archery season and despises having to hunt late archery. Backpacking in the sunshine and calling in Elk is the best thing ever and I'll still be doing it but I'll be looking for spikes.

show me the increases for us muzzleloaders in ride units?

So, you're for the substantial increase in cow tags for the muzzleloader and rifle guys? Your opinion is those new tags will tag out less cows than the OTC archery cow tag and build the herd back up?

Please don't take those as negatives just genuine guestions for me to gain more knowledge.

Jesus, keep reading all the responses. I already said I said a mistake and misspoke. I didn't delete the comments because the flow of the thread had already taken shape. I corrected and said the cow permits are still the same number but at least you have the option to hunt cows.
What else do you need from me?

you still have the option to hunt cows in the late season

Have you ever hunted the late season in the Nile? It is more crowded than the general rifle season in there. Way too crowded and like I said previously your hunting the local elk herd early and late.

[snake]

I find it hard to believe that the elk from the bumping are migrating to the cowiche.

Exactly, there are plenty of cows and bulls in all those units, early and late.  Anyone who knows elk and the lay of the land knows that.  I wouldn't take advice from someone in Mukilteo about the country over here.

[Skyvalhunter]

Low Blow, time out time

[dreamingbig]

I find it hard to believe that the elk from the bumping are migrating to the cowiche.

Exactly, there are plenty of cows and bulls in all those units, early and late.  Anyone who knows elk and the lay of the land knows that.  I wouldn't take advice from someone in Mukilteo about the country over here.

Ppffftttt.  1.  There isn’t a late season in any of those units with orange stripes.

2.  I live in Mukilteo not by choice.  It takes me 3 hours to get there and trust me... I know the land.  The elk don’t use the Nile like they use too because the surrounding units aren’t open.   Fact.  Not fake news.


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[dreamingbig]

I find it hard to believe that the elk from the bumping are migrating to the cowiche.

Exactly, there are plenty of cows and bulls in all those units, early and late.  Anyone who knows elk and the lay of the land knows that.  I wouldn't take advice from someone in Mukilteo about the country over here.

Forgot the part on migration.  The elk will migrate out of the bumping when the snow gets too deep.  They mostly go through the Bethel unit.  Both bumping and bethel are closed early and late for cows now.  Having an open unit in the Nile is like being at the zoo watching the animals behind the fence.  Gee thanks.

Whether they get to cowiche is dependent on snow fall but you can be damn sure elk migrate out of the open rimrock into cowiche.

You folks can lay claim to semantics but these proposed changes aren’t based on public scientific data that I am aware of...  did they include a presentation with herd decline somewhere?  The game management plan still shows Yakima sub herd as at objective.

Bottom line for me is that they are asking the archery community to once again bear the loss of harvest opportunity.  Why?  Because they can.  With 60%+ of the hunters as rifle hunters they carry the majority vote.  It is politics not science:

However I am really surprised they are forgoing the opportunity to sell 300 or 500 cow permits x 4 units.  That is some serious lost revenue.


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[Tbar]

I find it hard to believe that the elk from the bumping are migrating to the cowiche.

Exactly, there are plenty of cows and bulls in all those units, early and late.  Anyone who knows elk and the lay of the land knows that.  I wouldn't take advice from someone in Mukilteo about the country over here.

I would take advice from someone in Mukilteo.   

[snake]

I find it hard to believe that the elk from the bumping are migrating to the cowiche.

Exactly, there are plenty of cows and bulls in all those units, early and late.  Anyone who knows elk and the lay of the land knows that.  I wouldn't take advice from someone in Mukilteo about the country over here.

Forgot the part on migration.  The elk will migrate out of the bumping when the snow gets too deep.  They mostly go through the Bethel unit.  Both bumping and bethel are closed early and late for cows now.  Having an open unit in the Nile is like being at the zoo watching the animals behind the fence.  Gee thanks.

Whether they get to cowiche is dependent on snow fall but you can be damn sure elk migrate out of the open rimrock into cowiche.

You folks can lay claim to semantics but these proposed changes aren’t based on public scientific data that I am aware of...  did they include a presentation with herd decline somewhere?  The game management plan still shows Yakima sub herd as at objective.

Bottom line for me is that they are asking the archery community to once again bear the loss of harvest opportunity.  Why?  Because they can.  With 60%+ of the hunters as rifle hunters they carry the majority vote.  It is politics not science:

However I am really surprised they are forgoing the opportunity to sell 300 or 500 cow permits x 4 units.  That is some serious lost revenue.


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I am totally in agreement with you, even if your  migration info is a bit off. its all good.

[DVET253]

Little late to the discussion table fellas but I did voice my opposition to the changes proposed to the 300 units.

In my research I used WDFW's 2016 Trend report https://wdfw.wa.gov/publications/01875/wdfw01875.pdf pages 131-135, harvest stats and on the ground observations.

The trend report linked above mentions the herd is above management objective and failed to conduct surveys in the years prior (2014, 2015) due to mild winters, along with that harvest trends seem to stay around the 11% mark.

However, from time in the hills I will say that this past season left little to desire of the state. The Chinook fire displaced a lot of humans. The influx of which was seen in the Rimrock 364 unit, a few hunters, lots of displaced ORV parties and a massive 200+ person wedding which took place in Sleepy Park Meadows (1202) opening weekend early archery. 2 full days of tunes for the whole hillside. Along with that, the free-range cattle were still there during both weeks. This obviously had an impact on herd activity, and I suspect harvest was minimal.

Shooting back over to the 356-unit, reduced access into areas above the rattlesnake bridge (buck lake, nelson butte, McDaniel lake) has been an ongoing issue for a few years now. The unit holds many elk, however, the decline in access and the amount of prescribed fires during season in and around Timberwolf mountain coupled with natural fires in the vicinity, should support the '16 trend report data stating an increase of elk densities.  Not to forget, there are often sheep that free-range out on the timberwolf side, again another species elk don't want to compete with.

To me, my experiences and observations don't seem to correlate with the proposed changes.......

[dreamingbig]

 These guys sent in a lot of comments opposing the new elk season proposals!

They objected on grounds that the proposals are sexist.




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[Rainier10]

 
Spike lives matter!

[Skyvalhunter]

Especially as we get into the predator pit!!

[jstone]

These graphs remind me of my work. Our management likes to show lots a colorful graphs while they make you drink the cool aid