Scoutdog,
Based on the questions you asking and the areas you are looking at, it sounds like you are looking for an area like the rest of us. An area that you can find big, unpressured bulls that you can work and have a good "hunt" experience. Not trying to be negative here but I really don't think you're going to find what you are looking for in any of these permit areas. Any time you can drive in and cover most of the land by vehicle then the opportunity you're looking for is gone. From my experience it takes about 1 day, maybe 2 for elk to change their ways and patterns once they are hunted. My suggestion would be to either save your permit money and go with an outfitter out of state, or if you want to hunt west side find some areas that you can access without driving. Get behind some gates that allow public access and cover ground. Learn an area, and learn it well. Its going to take effort and time and you will hit some areas that aren't good. But eventually you will find your spot and it will be that much better once you do. They do exist, you just have to find them and get a little lucky.
I'm not saying the permits are bad ground, they serve a purpose and you can have good hunts in them. I've hunted a couple of them and had success in them, even had a couple of really fun hunts. But I have also had some good hunts outside those permit areas. In fact some of my more memorable hunts have been outside those areas, but we had to work for the area and the animals. Now those spots outside the permit areas are getting harder to find because of the extra pressure from displaced hunters from permit areas. So people who have their sweet spots are going to hold on to them even tighter.
Just my
