Huge reduction of special permits

[Karl Blanchard]

$111.90 for a deer and elk tag and a quality permit app for both. I pay more than that in almost every single state I apply in so for the opportunity to draw an incredible tag  (still a random draw system), it's an acceptable expendature for me even if I dont take advantage of otc opportunities. Drawing tags is like darts. The more you throw at the board, the more likely you are to get a bullseye. If you are playing the tag game in other states and aren't taking advantage of your residency then you are losing opportunities at killer hunts

[dreamingbig]

$111.90 for a deer and elk tag and a quality permit app for both. I pay more than that in almost every single state I apply in so for the opportunity to draw an incredible tag  (still a random draw system), it's an acceptable expendature for me even if I dont take advantage of otc opportunities. Drawing tags is like darts. The more you throw at the board, the more likely you are to get a bullseye. If you are playing the tag game in other states and aren't taking advantage of your residency then you are losing opportunities at killer hunts

Good point and will probably always buy the lottery ticket for special permits but my days of relying on OTC opportunities in WA are done.  Montana last year was a blast.  Idaho is fun too.  And you can shoot the wolves!

I will not be buying the cougar and bear piece.  Protest vs. lack of predator management.


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[Stein]

I think it depends on your budget.  If you can apply for every state, do.  If you can't, then it's hard to reason a way into applying in WA if you aren't going to hunt the general.

There are also several states with OTC or near OTC opportunities if you are willing to drive, so it's 100% possible to hunt far better options every year, put in for dream tags and never hunt WA.

The odds in WA are as low as the best elk hunts in the country and they aren't near the same quality - BEFORE the massive tag reductions.  Now, you have worse odds as a WA resident than places we dream of hunting as a NR.

I don't have enough in the budget for everything, so something has to go.  For me, that was WA this year which gave me the cash to get in draws where I have a better chance at a better tag.

[vandeman17]

$111.90 for a deer and elk tag and a quality permit app for both. I pay more than that in almost every single state I apply in so for the opportunity to draw an incredible tag  (still a random draw system), it's an acceptable expendature for me even if I dont take advantage of otc opportunities. Drawing tags is like darts. The more you throw at the board, the more likely you are to get a bullseye. If you are playing the tag game in other states and aren't taking advantage of your residency then you are losing opportunities at killer hunts

my comment was more to do with how much better general seasons are out of state after you strike out here

[beauhunter]

I was fortunate enough to draw a multiple season elk and deer this year. After paying for all my and the families special permit and hunting license fees I am into it over 900$ that's before I even set foot in the woods. Now a reduction of tags to put in for. Next season I am also looking elsewhere

[greenhead_killer]

This really blows, no other real way to say it. Having said that, there are still opportunities to be had here. The permit game will hopefully fluctuate over time and as resources are replenished, we will be back to more opportunity. I like hunting here, it can be very tough, but I’m comfortable and knowledgeable here. I also hunt out of state, but wa will always get some time from me, permits or not. I lose more than I’d like to, I think everyone does in this sad state, but you can’t win if you’re not playing. Like Karl said, eventually you hit the bullseye. Just have to keep playing and have a backup plan for when you actually do draw lol

[Karl Blanchard]

This really blows, no other real way to say it. Having said that, there are still opportunities to be had here. The permit game will hopefully fluctuate over time and as resources are replenished, we will be back to more opportunity. I like hunting here, it can be very tough, but I’m comfortable and knowledgeable here. I also hunt out of state, but wa will always get some time from me, permits or not. I lose more than I’d like to, I think everyone does in this sad state, but you can’t win if you’re not playing. Like Karl said, eventually you hit the bullseye. Just have to keep playing and have a backup plan for when you actually do draw lol

spot on. I'm the guy that pulled two quality bull tags in three years    we all scream for management but apparently only if it's a positive gain. If bull numbers are really down, then duh we need to cut tags. Of course theres a lot of speculation from me on that and endless other things that need addressing but tag allotments is part of the game.  If tags quadrupled next year would all the sky is falling folks eat crow? I bet not.  Numbers fluctuate and herd will increase. Tags will go back up and we will find something else to scream about

[Stein]

What are the factors that would lead to herd increases?  I would like to believe, but it seems like we are hoping on luck as I haven’t seen anything resembling a recovery plan. 

If you like hunting here and get what you are looking for, I’m honestly happy for you.  I hope you do well and have an awesome hunt.  I love seeing great reports and stories here.

I don’t have a long history and knowledge of areas in WA, so that investment in time and money is better spent elsewhere.  If I have two weeks a year to learn an area I am going to spend that in places that have a good outlook and the best odds at paying me back for many years.


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[Karl Blanchard]

Stein, to answer your questions I do believe they will rebound because they have in the past, and even in the last few years have increased.

I'd have to pull regs but our previous three year season cycle wdfw gave out literally thousands of cow permits along with general antlerless early and late cow seasons. They did this because our elk herds were bursting at the seams. Literally the largest they have ever been.  This isnt 20 years ago, this was like 4 years ago.  So we go to bang town on our resident elk populations, tribal guys double down on the jerky sales and then here comes winter of 2016/17. Winter kill was well above average and a metric crap ton of damage tags got filled.  Congdons alone thumped probably a hundo out of their orchards alone. 

But since then we have had mild winters. Habit has improved in some pretty key areas due to fires and some active logging going on up in bethel and bumping.  Cow numbers are on the climb and almost back to objectives. 

I still believe piss poor counting is to blame for the missing bulls.  They either counted too early when the snow wasnt hear or they didnt go high enough because I know for a fact a lot of bachelor groups were too fat and happy to push down when the snow did hit.  I was still seeing groups in those middle elevations where you dont normally see elk until April. 

Some of that is just guestimation based off of what I am personally seeing but I do not believe it's all doom and gloom.  Herds rise and fall and believe it or not I feel we are on the rise. 

And for the record, I spend less time actually hunting deer and elk in washington than the fast majority of you. I hunt almost exclusively out of state.  I still archery elk hunt because there is lots of them and it's a relatively easy freezer filler but I havent even hunted deer in a few years. I'm done depleting our mule deer populations.  I still apply for a few hunts though because like I said previously, it's a darts at the wall game. If you wanna get one to stick you need all the darts you can come up with.

Hope all that rambling made sense

[JimmyHoffa]

Is the recovery something that is actively going to be pursued?  I assume the conversation is mostly eastside related, so are OTC dates being reduced to allow more spike escapement?  It's just the bulls that have taken a big dip from what you guys have mentioned.

[Tbar]

Is the recovery something that is actively going to be pursued?  I assume the conversation is mostly eastside related, so are OTC dates being reduced to allow more spike escapement?  It's just the bulls that have taken a big dip from what you guys have mentioned.

Look for reduced objectives before recovery due to Timothy hay producers complaints.

[Karl Blanchard]

Hay production has almost zero to do with yakima gmu herd objectives or management plans/goals.  Kittitas yes, yakima no. 

[fishngamereaper]

Hay production has almost zero to do with yakima gmu herd objectives or management plans/goals.  Kittitas yes, yakima no.

Don't remind me..I used to buck that hay...man those where long summers. Only benefit was I got to hand feed it come winter time.

[BUTTER]

Dont forget the Indians. Heres another point that is disgusting. They cut the special permits but that cost for putting in is the same. We all pay,for oppurtunity that now is less and less every year. Obviously less animals but this chicken A$$ state did not cut anything that would insure a pay day. Why not cut the 8500 multi deer tags its all about revenue.

[outdooraddict]

hahah the multi season deer tag, antlerless tags, and the second deer tag  just cracks me up. id rather not fill my buck tag than give the state the moeny for a doe permit or the multi season permit. the thing people dont realize is "if you quit buying it, you dip into their slush fund" thus forces a change. but people dont view it that way, they will love to take your $6 antlerless permit fee,  and the $111 multiseason deer. dont get me started on the $70 "second deer tag"  what a joke.  all because "i get to hunt all three weapons or all 3 seasons"  i understand that logic a littel bit. but there are lots of things to hunt here, hunt deer with your bow and coyotes with your muzzy, or rifle, hunt birds with your shotgun etc.  lots of opprtuniies, but unitl people stand together, the state will continue to love your donations