Drone for preseason scouting

[capt.coho]

Alright, I don't own a drone or anything so keep the pitchforks in the barn for this, its purely a hypothetical.
I was considering getting a drone for pre season scouting. My rational is this. If i go in and check out every drainage i want to check, I'm going to be putting human pressure on elk. Whether i decide to hunt there or not, specifically on the wet side, you're applying pressure to animals. If I fly a drone in there, and I've never flown a drone period, I think I'm disturbing the animals a whole lot less. Roosies on the wet side don't tend to move all that much. If they have a drainage or an area they like they tend to stay in that area.  But, they act way differently if they've seen people that season as opposed to them never seeing anyone.
Looking for thoughts and opinions here. Again, wouldn't be doing it during season, strictly pre season.

[N7XW]

From the reg book:

 Using aircraft (WAC 220-413-070):
It is illegal to:
• Use an aircraft, including unmanned
aircraft to spot, locate, or report the
location of wildlife for the purpose of
hunting.

WAC:
WAC 220-413-070
Hunting with aid of aircraft, boats or other vehicles.
(1) It is unlawful to use aircraft, including unmanned aircraft, to spot, locate or report the location of wildlife for the purpose of hunting; except as authorized by a permit issued by the director.
(2) It is unlawful to hunt wildlife from a vehicle, aircraft, including unmanned aircraft, except as authorized by a permit issued by the director, or from a boat propelled by motor unless the motor of such boat has been completely shut off and its progress has ceased.
(3) It is unlawful to use a vehicle, aircraft, unmanned aircraft, or motor-propelled boat for the purpose of pursuing, concentrating, or harassing any wild animal or wild bird, except as authorized by the department to aid in addressing wildlife conflict.
(4) It is unlawful to hunt big game on the day one was airborne in an aircraft, except on a regularly scheduled commercial airline flight.
(5) It is unlawful to hunt game animals, game birds, or migratory birds on the day one has operated an unmanned aircraft.

Item 1 spells it out and doesn't specify a time between locating wildlife and hunting (ie out of season vs. in season)

[jackelope]

It's illegal #1, and you can effectively scout without putting excessive pressure on animals in a drainage.

[Ghost Hunter]

Is scouting defined as 'for the purpose of hunting'?  I would interpret it to be.  And if there is game there, are they being harassed?

https://apps.leg.wa.gov/WAC/default.aspx?cite=220-413-070

PDFWAC 220-413-070
Hunting with aid of aircraft, boats or other vehicles.
(1) It is unlawful to use aircraft, including unmanned aircraft, to spot, locate or report the location of wildlife for the purpose of hunting; except as authorized by a permit issued by the director.
(2) It is unlawful to hunt wildlife from a vehicle, aircraft, including unmanned aircraft, except as authorized by a permit issued by the director, or from a boat propelled by motor unless the motor of such boat has been completely shut off and its progress has ceased.
(3) It is unlawful to use a vehicle, aircraft, unmanned aircraft, or motor-propelled boat for the purpose of pursuing, concentrating, or harassing any wild animal or wild bird, except as authorized by the department to aid in addressing wildlife conflict.
(4) It is unlawful to hunt big game on the day one was airborne in an aircraft, except on a regularly scheduled commercial airline flight.
(5) It is unlawful to hunt game animals, game birds, or migratory birds on the day one has operated an unmanned aircraft.
[Statutory Authority: RCW 77.04.012, 77.04.013, 77.04.020, 77.04.055, 77.12.020, 77.12.040, 77.12.047, 77.12.150, 77.12.210, 77.12.240, 77.12.320, 77.12.570, 77.12.800, 77.15.245, 77.32.007, 77.32.050, 77.32.070, 77.32.090, 77.32.370, and 77.32.530. WSR 18-11-061 (Order 18-76), § 220-413-070, filed 5/11/18, effective 6/11/18. Statutory Authority: RCW 77.04.012, 77.04.013, 77.04.020, 77.04.055, and 77.12.047. WSR 17-05-112 (Order 17-04), recodified as § 220-413-070, filed 2/15/17, effective 3/18/17. Statutory Authority: RCW 77.12.040. WSR 82-04-034 (Order 177), § 232-12-057, filed 1/28/82; WSR 81-12-029 (Order 165), § 232-12-057, filed 6/1/81. Formerly WAC 232-12-150.]

[Bob33]

How would they prove that flying a drone in the summer was for the "purpose of hunting"?

[N7XW]

Is scouting defined as 'for the purpose of hunting'?  I would interpret it to be.  And if there is game there, are they being harassed?

I would say YES and YES.

[Special T]

Is scouting defined as 'for the purpose of hunting'?  I would interpret it to be.  And if there is game there, are they being harassed?

https://apps.leg.wa.gov/WAC/default.aspx?cite=220-413-070

PDFWAC 220-413-070
Hunting with aid of aircraft, boats or other vehicles.
(1) It is unlawful to use aircraft, including unmanned aircraft, to spot, locate or report the location of wildlife for the purpose of hunting; except as authorized by a permit issued by the director.
(2) It is unlawful to hunt wildlife from a vehicle, aircraft, including unmanned aircraft, except as authorized by a permit issued by the director, or from a boat propelled by motor unless the motor of such boat has been completely shut off and its progress has ceased.
(3) It is unlawful to use a vehicle, aircraft, unmanned aircraft, or motor-propelled boat for the purpose of pursuing, concentrating, or harassing any wild animal or wild bird, except as authorized by the department to aid in addressing wildlife conflict.
(4) It is unlawful to hunt big game on the day one was airborne in an aircraft, except on a regularly scheduled commercial airline flight.
(5) It is unlawful to hunt game animals, game birds, or migratory birds on the day one has operated an unmanned aircraft.
[Statutory Authority: RCW 77.04.012, 77.04.013, 77.04.020, 77.04.055, 77.12.020, 77.12.040, 77.12.047, 77.12.150, 77.12.210, 77.12.240, 77.12.320, 77.12.570, 77.12.800, 77.15.245, 77.32.007, 77.32.050, 77.32.070, 77.32.090, 77.32.370, and 77.32.530. WSR 18-11-061 (Order 18-76), § 220-413-070, filed 5/11/18, effective 6/11/18. Statutory Authority: RCW 77.04.012, 77.04.013, 77.04.020, 77.04.055, and 77.12.047. WSR 17-05-112 (Order 17-04), recodified as § 220-413-070, filed 2/15/17, effective 3/18/17. Statutory Authority: RCW 77.12.040. WSR 82-04-034 (Order 177), § 232-12-057, filed 1/28/82; WSR 81-12-029 (Order 165), § 232-12-057, filed 6/1/81. Formerly WAC 232-12-150.]

Point 5 is what I was thinking. If it's the week before or more I'm not sure how it would be any different than flying a plane and waiting a day.

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[N7XW]

How would they prove that flying a drone in the summer was for the "purpose of hunting"?

I doubt the authorities could prove it, but it would seem like an obvious intent.  If I had an expensive drone, I sure wouldn't go flying it in and around the woods.  I'd find a lot better location with less obstacles that could cause a crash.
 

[Bob33]

How would they prove that flying a drone in the summer was for the "purpose of hunting"?

I doubt the authorities could prove it, but it would seem like an obvious intent.  If I had an expensive drone, I sure wouldn't go flying it in and around the woods.  I'd find a lot better location with less obstacles that could cause a crash.
 

Why would it be obvious? There are plenty of people with drones who don't hunt.

[Ghost Hunter]

How would they prove that flying a drone in the summer was for the "purpose of hunting"?

Back to (3)?  I would find better options to use my time and resources.  Others can fight the battle.   

[N7XW]

How would they prove that flying a drone in the summer was for the "purpose of hunting"?

I doubt the authorities could prove it, but it would seem like an obvious intent.  If I had an expensive drone, I sure wouldn't go flying it in and around the woods.  I'd find a lot better location with less obstacles that could cause a crash.
 

Why would it be obvious? There are plenty of people with drones who don't hunt.

No doubt there are people that fly them that don't hunt.  But is it common for them to go fly them out in the middle of nowhere? 

[Bob33]

How would they prove that flying a drone in the summer was for the "purpose of hunting"?

Back to (3)?  I would find better options to use my time and resources.  Others can fight the battle.

Perhaps, although it is more or less harassing than someone motoring around the woods in an ATV to scout?

I don't plan to do it or necessarily endorse it, but I find it difficult to believe that someone could be successfully prosecuted for it if the activity occurred distinct from a time when hunting was legal.

[N7XW]

How would they prove that flying a drone in the summer was for the "purpose of hunting"?

Back to (3)?  I would find better options to use my time and resources.  Others can fight the battle.

Perhaps, although it is more or less harassing than someone motoring around the woods in an ATV to scout?

I don't plan to do it or necessarily endorse it, but I find it difficult to believe that someone could be successfully prosecuted for it if the activity occurred distinct from a time when hunting was legal.

Agreed

[bobcat]

It's pretty common for people to scout with airplanes. Doesn't seem to be an issue with that.

[capt.coho]

Like i said I've never even flown a drone before but if I'm a hundred plus feet in the air, spot bedded elk on a bench way up a drainage then move on, I feel like thats a damn sight better than hiking up there and blowing them out. And Like i said this is all preseason, week plus out from the opener. Whats the difference between that and wild life viewing?

[pianoman9701]

It's pretty common for people to scout with airplanes. Doesn't seem to be an issue with that.

The guy who had the Governor's elk tag a few years ago got in trouble for scouting from an aircraft, didn't he? Or, at least the guide got in trouble. 

[Bob33]

It's pretty common for people to scout with airplanes. Doesn't seem to be an issue with that.

The guy who had the Governor's elk tag a few years ago got in trouble for scouting from an aircraft, didn't he? Or, at least the guide got in trouble. 

I would think if a highly visible hunter kills a highly visible animal within a day of someone in his party flying in the same area the elk was killed, it would easier to connect the dots.

[Buckhunter24]

 My opinion is its a stupid idea and I wish it wasnt posted here to give others the same stupid idea.

[elkchaser54]

First off if you never have flown a drone,  you dont understand how noisy they are.  Yes they are electric but the tiny propellers are moving at such a high rate of speed that they produce lots of sound.  Unless your very high off the ground it will spook animals.  Then if you're that high you wont have any detail of your drainage that a google earth imagery could show. Also if you see that bedded elk and it gets up and runs away, I'd say that's a pretty easy case to prove Wildlife harassment.   Drones are also banned from wilderness areas of national forests.  Guys shooting 900 yards like it's nothing, chasing animals with drones, shooting from the truck, doesnt anyone care about fair chase and conservation anymore ? It seems like everyone just wants their facebook likes and to have their face out their with all the manufacturers pics.

[Moe the Sleaze]

Ah, the "technology drift".  First came smokeless powder, then came scopes and optics, then repeating rifles, then radios, then ATVs, then cellphones, then GPS, then HuntWa Forum....and I know I missed a few.  Now this. Drones. The inevitable march of progress.

 No thanks, it's not for me. I acknowledge your argument for non-harassment/pressure, but I still prefer to keep drones out of the woods.

I also still prefer paper maps. I do however, hunt with modern firearms occasionally. Call me a hypocrite if you want.

"Plus ce change, plus c'est la meme chose!"

[Moe the Sleaze]

Oh yeah, I'm not a trail cam guy either.

[N7XW]

First off if you never have flown a drone,  you dont understand how noisy they are.  Yes they are electric but the tiny propellers are moving at such a high rate of speed that they produce lots of sound.  Unless your very high off the ground it will spook animals.  Then if you're that high you wont have any detail of your drainage that a google earth imagery could show. Also if you see that bedded elk and it gets up and runs away, I'd say that's a pretty easy case to prove Wildlife harassment.   Drones are also banned from wilderness areas of national forests.  Guys shooting 900 yards like it's nothing, chasing animals with drones, shooting from the truck, doesnt anyone care about fair chase and conservation anymore ? It seems like everyone just wants their facebook likes and to have their face out their with all the manufacturers pics.

[CP]

 

[X-Force]

It’s illegal and that was the first response.

The guy was looking for guidance and got it. Why jump on the thread just to bash?

[Moe the Sleaze]

Hey X,
Perhaps you can find the answer to your question in your own signature line.
Respectfully,
Moe

[N7XW]

When does drone season start and what's the bag limit? 

[Platensek-po]

Pretty sure they are invasive. So I would guess it’s the same as coyote

[N7XW]

Pretty sure they are invasive. So I would guess it’s the same as coyote

[X-Force]

Hey X,
Perhaps you can find the answer to your question in your own signature line.
Respectfully,
Moe

Touché

 

[ganghis]

Why stop there?  Hook it up with an autopilot feature and an infrared camera as a payload.  Then use a satellite connection to beam the data straight to a mainframe where you use artificial intelligence algorithms to figure out if its an elk or not.  If so, it texts you a lat-long directly to your cell-phone.  Done!

Ha ha, just playin.  Not a huge fan of the idea though, but mainly because I hate seeing drones when I'm out in the woods (not that it happens very often).

[MADMAX]

Saw a guy doing it at oak creek one year for sheds
Laughed
Lady yelled at him and said that’s cheating

He put it away
 

[meatwhack]

Drones are pretty noisy you’d be surprised how many critters they spook.

[boneaddict]

When is enough enough with technology.

[The scout]

When is enough enough with technology.

  it would never cross my mind to use one for that, how lazy can you be.

[jstone]

 

[fishngamereaper]

Must be a mellennial thing.

[N7XW]

Must be a mellennial thing.

[Caseyd]

Must be a mellennial thing.

Flatbill helps keep sun out of eyes while looking at the remote 

[444Marlin]

Using drones are illegal for scouting.

But the best way to scout is to get some boots on the ground and find the game trails and reading sign and get in your pre-season conditioning, practice moving through the woods quietly and doing some old fashioned glassing.  All those things get your mind and body more prepared for finding game when the season comes around.

[jackson7]

Quote from: boneaddict on Today at 06:44:24 PM

    When is enough enough with technology.

Well said!