Were wolves imported into Washington on the downlow?

[idahohuntr]

Oh I know the methow isnt WA's first wolf pack, I was just using WDFW and CNW info.
We've had native wolves all along, wolves now made extinct or severely threatened by non-native wolves.

They assert that, not me.


Secondly, I do believe your family seen rapid expansion in Idaho and Montana, which just goes to prove my theory, Idaho and Montana were planted with wolves, that isnt in dispute.

Those packs where planted all across the state in desired wolf habitat areas, not in Boise ID. and not in east montana.  The wolves being spaced apart like that set the stage for a very rapid expansion.

WA did not have wolves planted according to you, therefore such rapid expansion would not be possible like it went down.




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WDFW "Confirmed" the "first" wolf pack, by state criteria, in that location.  I don't think WDFW staff would dispute what I'm saying...the first confirmed pack was very likely not the actual first pack (or packs) in WA. So I don't think its accurate to say you are just repeating their claim - because I don't think they would disagree with what I'm saying.  Its sort of like their minimum counts...they are always very clear they know there are more wolves, the minimum count was just the absolute count they personally observed. 

There were not wolves planted all across Idaho and Montana...pretty specific release locations...and all of them were hundreds of miles from where I've hunted way up in Northern Idaho...so unless they announced the original release locations and then inexplicably started releasing them all over the state but decided to keep those locations super secret...your theory still doesn't hold water.  Remember...POTUS showed up to personally release wolves, it wasn't any secret.

And last - nope, completely disagree.  Wolves don't have to be sprinkled or seeded all across these habitats to rapidly expand.  Good habitat and prey, and those suckers are off to the races.  They clearly can expand rapidly on their own just as they did in Idaho, Montana, and Wyoming. 

[Utah]

The wolves only had to walk across the Canadian border. No reason to think they needed any help to get into Washington.

So here is the rub. If they were so inclined to come from just across the border, why did the migrate from the Eastern border in a westerly fashion? Especially since they could have done so down the cascades so easily?

The whole thing stinks which is why I'll bet there are a lot of people who belive the department or feds had a hand in it.

They came outta Idaho too. Which prolly came from Canada or Montana.  Saw two wolves in the early 90's on the eastside of priest lake. Grizz were there too.

They did come down southerly via the cascades.

[idahohuntr]

Idahohunter, what is your opinion of CNW? What is your opinion of former wdfw employees working for them? Are you familiar with their approach regarding natural resources?

CNW - Not my cup of tea...I'm sure they have some decent staff and I'm sure they have staff and members I'd not be well aligned with. They claim to support hunting but I do not believe its a core concern of theirs.  One of their staff posts here occasionally and he seems reasonable.

My opinion of WDFW employees (former and current) is not real positive - its probably one of the worst run/managed/operated state f&w agencies in the west - so who they go work for once they leave WDFW isn't anything I care about.  I'm not that familiar with CNW's approach regarding natural resources - they probably have more influence on wolf issues than many other E. Wa orgs and citizens and I'm sure they've done projects that are beneficial to fish and wildlife...but I'm sure they have a lot of issues, projects, positions I would vehemently disagree with.

The real question...what's a guy in St. Maries worried about CNW for?  Not many CNW events in your neck of the woods!  Used to buy a lot of motorcycles and chainsaws from Charlies saw shop - I know its got a new name now, not sure if Eddie (Charlie's boy) still owns it or if he sold though?

[KFhunter]

I think I used to get my id snowmobile sticker there, used to ride all over there in the backcountry and nort of sandpoint enterprise?

Mt they closed some great areas used to ride too, fish creek. Epic area

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[Mudman]

If any of ya talked with the Ol timers who were here in W Wa ya would know they claim these are NOT the same wolves.  I know not many people to talk to as they have now passed but the Timber wolf was not the same.  Grey wolf is larger and more aggressive.  Invasive species as far as Im concerned.

[Skyvalhunter]

Don't have to go to the old timers to get that info

[Bango skank]

Don't have to go to the old timers to get that info

Also, being an "ol timer" doesnt automatically mean you know what youre talking about.  My grandma says all kinds of crazy crap.

[Jonathan_S]

 

[borntoslay]

Don't have to go to the old timers to get that info

Also, being an "ol timer" doesnt automatically mean you know what youre talking about.  My grandma says all kinds of crazy crap.

Exactly, alot of older guys I know are full of sh*/.


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[Bango skank]

Don't have to go to the old timers to get that info

Also, being an "ol timer" doesnt automatically mean you know what youre talking about.  My grandma says all kinds of crazy crap.

Exactly, alot of older guys I know are full of sh*/.


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If youre an idiot when youre 20, and an idiot when youre 40, youll still be an idiot when youre 70

[borntoslay]

Will one of the experts or ole timers clarify the "timber wolf" for me. From my understanding, only the gray wolf has ever inhabited North America. Just different size range depending on location...same as most animals.

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[KFhunter]

canis lupis occidentalis  =  our new wolves, very large subspecies of grey wolf.

canis lupis familiaris   =  domestic dogs

canis lupis lycaon   =  grey wolf from back east, Michigan area

canis lupis fuscus  =  Cascades wolf, listed as extinct, yet old timers say they've seen them, brown coloring, smaller wolves

"grey wolf"  can mean a lot of things if you drop off the subspecies designation.   



canis =  dog   
lupis = wolf   

"wolf dog"   

[teanawayslayer]

I’ve heard rumors over the years about the release of wolves. For instance in the teanaway. Truck and trailer pull up at the end of the pavement up the middle fork. Two wolves released. This coming from a guy who lives at the end of the road and a hunter. I wouldn’t put anything past Wdfw. Once again rumor and hear say. I’ve also heard from some old timers years ago in the gpw. Running into a guy doing an article on the wolves in there. My buddies have hunted the area by horse since the 60’s. They saw wolves back then. Not a lot but they were there.

[Bango skank]

I find it funny how "old timers" sightings are always taken for granted as credible.  Look at how many people right now say they see wolves and grizz and dont know what the hell theyre talking about.  These same people will be "old timers" one day.

[boneaddict]

Its just a designation generally noting someone who has been around the block a time or two, experience, been there done that. Just as there is a designation for young pup, wet behind the ears, tenderfoot, greenhorn, etc.   There most certainly are idiots that become old....


I couldnt tell you the difference if there is one.  Big is big.   Face to face, pretty incredible machine.