Ladder Test how-to

[7mmfan]

Alight well you guys are shattering my grandiose plans of a perfect ladder test now. Shooting out past 400 is basically undoable within any kind of an acceptable drive of where I am. I don't know that I could provide any consistency at that range with this setup anyway. I'm just trying to get a load that is accurate for this rifle.

I don't have the time to shoot 5 shoot groups in .2 gr increments, and then fiddle with seating depth on half a dozen loads. It's just not in the cards. This is one of about 3 weekend days I have available to do this until like the middle of August so I'm trying to make the best use of my time.

Explain some of these other methods for refining the loads prior to heading out to me so I can evaluate and maybe implement them over the next couple days. I'll watch the Sadderlee videos tonight after kiddos bedtime, but if someone can give me a rudimentary breakdown it would be appreciated.

[jasnt]

At that range you'd be better off with an optimum charge weight test (OCW). 3-5 shots, pick your most accurate and either refine it with tighter weight variance OCW test, or go straight to a seating depth test. A 300yd ladder test might just confuse you, cause it did me. At 600yds a ladder test starts to separate and clear up for me. Like mentioned above, the further the better for ladder tests.

 

I also have success using a chrono and picking a few loads with low SD and then looking at groups to confirm.  That helped a bunch as it removed the shooter, wind and other variables.

This is my favorite method personally

[Jonathan_S]

If I had 3 days between now and August, this is what I would do.

Day 1: load up 4-5 shot groups in .5 grain increments up to max., shoot and choose the most accurate charge weight.

Day 2: Shoot another 10-20 to confirm, if Day 1: results weren't quite to standard I'd load several depths of the same charge

Day 3: Shoot the best Day 2 depth again to confirm


In all reality for someone who shoots that seldom (not a knock) you shouldn't be shooting at game far enough for ES to really matter. Load up something that shoots about MOA and go kill stuff this fall. It ain't that complicated BUT there is no way to have a super abbreviated but also ultra precise handloading recipe without getting somewhat lucky in only three shooting sessions 

[Jonathan_S]

Last thought: if I already had a workable rifle/ammunition setup, I wouldn't try and get a new one for hunting season in only three crammed sessions.

[7mmfan]

So basically what I’ve been doing. Alright you’ve given me some stuff to think about.

On that last thought. I have another rifle that’s dialed so I can will fall back on that most likely. This rifle is a project so to speak. I have a load that shoots just a little worse than MOA that I killed two animals with last year, so I feel ok using that out to a couple hundred yards, but I want better.

[Jonathan_S]

  you can do some serious elk and deer killing with a 1 - 1.5 MOA weapon.

[7mmfan]

I agree with that. I'm just so used to my other rifle that's sub
.5 that anything over 1 seems ridiculous. I may just need to adjust my expectations.

[hogslayer]

What combo are you shooting?

[7mmfan]

140 Accubond and Varget

[Magnum_Willys]

Had good luck with quickload .  Need a confirmed velocity, barrel length and cartridge data   . 
To really dial in get case capacity by weighing empty brass and brass full of water   

[Buckjunkie]

If I had 3 days between now and August, this is what I would do.

Day 1: load up 4-5 shot groups in .5 grain increments up to max., shoot and choose the most accurate charge weight.

Day 2: Shoot another 10-20 to confirm, if Day 1: results weren't quite to standard I'd load several depths of the same charge

Day 3: Shoot the best Day 2 depth again to confirm


In all reality for someone who shoots that seldom (not a knock) you shouldn't be shooting at game far enough for ES to really matter. Load up something that shoots about MOA and go kill stuff this fall. It ain't that complicated BUT there is no way to have a super abbreviated but also ultra precise handloading recipe without getting somewhat lucky in only three shooting sessions 

This sounds like a recipe for throat erosion before you find a load.

I would start by searching forums like Long Range Forum for loads with your Cartridge and bullet. You will see patterns + or - a grain. Start bullet seating .020 off lands and grooves for conventional bullets and .090 for solid copper/monoliths.

Run a ladder group around that load at 300+ yards. One shot 5 minutes apart. Find a cluster and re-load the middle load from the cluster in groups of 3 with seating depths closer and further from lands and grooves.

Keep everything constant. Brass (new or fired #of times).

You are trying to eliminate variables.

My .02 cents

[Jonathan_S]

  Throat erosion from 50-75 shots on a weapon that hasn't even printed better than MOA doesn't sound like much of a loss to me.

Throat erosion hasn't proven itself to be the Boogeyman that the more anal retentive make it out to be (personal opinion).

[bullfisher]

Alight well you guys are shattering my grandiose plans of a perfect ladder test now. Shooting out past 400 is basically undoable within any kind of an acceptable drive of where I am. I don't know that I could provide any consistency at that range with this setup anyway. I'm just trying to get a load that is accurate for this rifle.

I don't have the time to shoot 5 shoot groups in .2 gr increments, and then fiddle with seating depth on half a dozen loads. It's just not in the cards. This is one of about 3 weekend days I have available to do this until like the middle of August so I'm trying to make the best use of my time.

Explain some of these other methods for refining the loads prior to heading out to me so I can evaluate and maybe implement them over the next couple days. I'll watch the Sadderlee videos tonight after kiddos bedtime, but if someone can give me a rudimentary breakdown it would be appreciated.

If you don't have enough range to ladder test, or enough time to OCW test, then you'll have to velocity string test or satterlee test as mentioned above. The satterlee test can be hard to weed through if your chrony is finicky, scale inaccurate, powder stability, ect.. Thats why its easier at .5grn or higher increments. Honestly though, I end up loading and shooting just as much with a satterlee test as a .3grn OCW test. But maybe someone else has had better luck. The easiest short range test for me has been a .3grn OCW test. You can load a box of 3 shot groups or a couple boxes of 5 shot. Cool barrel between groups and tighten a seating depth test later.

[Magnum_Willys]

The easiest short range test for me has been a .3grn OCW test. You can load a box of 3 shot groups or a couple boxes of 5 shot. Cool barrel between groups and tighten a seating depth test later.

    Do this and triangulate the shots and use center of them as a ladder at the same time.    I always start out with Quickload expected optimum charge weight and try to disprove it. 

[Buckjunkie]

Throat erosion from 50-75 shots on a weapon that hasn't even printed better than MOA doesn't sound like much of a loss to me.

Throat erosion hasn't proven itself to be the Boogeyman that the more anal retentive make it out to be (personal opinion).

Why are you asking for advice if you know so much?