Master Hunters VOICE LOUD AND CLEAR!!!

[Skyvalhunter]

Well said Billy. Except a few of the MH hunts you will lose your points but those. Like the any elk or 3 point or better hunts where a hunter has the chance of taking a bull.

[KillBilly]

I have heard several times...that you know unethical and snobbish MH's  I challenge some of you to list the names of the supposed MH's that think they are the god of the Hunt. I know alot of MH's and none of them are like that. I also could compile a list of Non MH's that I consider to be as skilled and ethical as any MH I've ever met. It is not the name you should be dwelling on. It is not hunt opportunities you should be dwelling on. The question is, What can we do for Washington to help preserve the Sanctity of the hunt for our children and their children. MH is a beginning not the end, it is not perfect and neither are any of us. If all of the MH's dropped out today, so you would accept us again, it would make a huge negative impact on hunting in this state. If you all joined us unselfishly, we could make progress like you only dream about now...

[billythekidrock]

Well said Billy. Except a few of the MH hunts you will lose your points but those. Like the any elk or 3 point or better hunts where a hunter has the chance of taking a bull.

Yes, you will lose your points on the bull hunt and any elk hunt but most of those are not damage hunts. Just hunts in sensitive areas.

[Slider]

If we have too many moose? Or problem Moose? Then maybe a couple more permits should be given out? There Rocket Science!!! 

[bbarnes]

This is what i posted

HOW ABOUT THE PUMAS PLAIN'S TAG AT MOUNT SAINT HELEN'S THIS IS FEDRAL LAND AND SHOULD BE ACCESSABLE TO ANYONE WHO PAY'S TAX .THIS IS NOTHING LESS THAN DESCRIMANATION TO THE 200 THOUSAND PLUS HUNTERS WHO BUY TAG'S IN THIS STATE. THERE NEED'S TO BE A CLASS ACTION LAW SUIT OVER THIS.B BARNES KEEPING PUBLIC LANDS PUBLIC FOR EVERYONE NOT JUST STATE EMPLOYEES WHO TAKE THE COURSE ONLINE AT WORK WHILE WE PAY THERE WAGE.

If the land owner want"s the wildlife off there property number 1 DON'T BUILD WHERE THE WILDLIFE LIVE'S.Number 2 give a person who ask permission a chance to hunt the property.Number 3 with the money the WDFW pays out to these land owners, it would be cheaper to pay for a fence and build it to keep the animals out.Finally number 4 if the program taught ethics, these M H wouldn't be hunting these animals at this time of year because it's not fair chase.Get a clue people hunting is now a Hobie not a way of life, or to say guess what i shot three elk and deer this year.
           
Let's talk some reality here for instance Weyco wants wildlife off there property.If they were forced by the lawmakers to create habitat and meadow areas for these animals,and quit spraying down the land with chemicals comparable to ajent orange they wouldn't need control hunts.The timber owners need to realize that resource is becoming worthless,times have changed. We in the construction trades are using different building methods and materials.What damage are the animals causing who was there first and who lost controll of the recourse in the first place.Where else in the U S A do they have this type of M H program anywhere? Does this program take into consideration people of lesser intelligence handicapped or hearing impaired.The WDFW mission statement says ensure effective use of current and future financial resources in order to meet the needs of the state's fish and wildlife resource for
the benefit of the public.How is the M H program benefiting the public because the public is all off us not 1280 out of 277,000 hunters in this state.Ive also heard rumors that the deer and elk in the state of washington,will be opening a casino soon because they are loosing there land just like the Indians. :stirthepot:Does this get closer to the point,do M H have a have more rights to Federal land than other tax payers.B Barnes keeping the public land public.

Billy the point I'm trying to make here is it discriminates against all of us sportsman.
Everyone isn't eligible for this program,and myself i promote equal opportunity.The WDFW will sell hunting licences to felons, but they cant be a part of this.WE all pay taxes but we all cant hunt the same places,to me this is turning into some private     
hunting ranch.I don't think that hunters as a hole support this. :bdid:WE as outdoor
people should promote all of the ethics and rules,and educate each other.Its Hard to support this program, when the state tax payers own the animals.Myself and my group have spent thousands of dollars,giving out t shirts ,stickers putting floats in parades
and putting on tours for law makers to show the problems in the state, and to raise awareness of the problems were facing.B Barnes keeping the public lands public and the wildlife.

Your still not addressing the discrimination of the program against 277.000 hunters.Hunting Federal land that everyone should be able to hunt.Also isn't picking up the woods every outdoorsmans responsibility.This is nothing but a free labor pool for the state to have the M H Volunteering, while they the WDFW do nothing and get paid with benefits from our tax dollars.Last but not least when in the woods hunting you had better know the rules and regs or prepare to have the book thrown at you.
B Barnes keeping the public lands public.     

M H you still have not addressed the issue of hunting on Federal land,the program was set up for damage issues  and private property issues.It's turned into a reward program its unethical and theres no fair chase.I agree with furbearer 365 about the problem's at mt saint helen's it is overpursuit.The problems lie with The WDFW have they talked to the M H, about improving there image with the public.Let's talk a little biology i personally helped count the dead elk last year on the mud flow.The volunteers cut the femur bones looked in them,and then they would say yep they died of starvation.To me that left many unanswered questions #1 there were no predators eating these animals #2 The smelled funny #3 there were no skin,blood,urine,organ or any other samples taken.You would have thought there would be a toxicology test,taken with the timber company's spraying chemicals.Let's now talk law enforcement myself and many members of my group,have made countless trip over the last 3 years to Olimpia, to support them and try to get more dollars.Our volunteer hours are in the ten's of thousands,doing projects for the Forest Service the DNR and WDFW over the years.This was the right thing to do,and we certainly didn't need any reward or special privilege.Did i mention i spent out pocket over the last 2 years,over 10,000 dollars feeding the animals we all enjoy seeing and hunting.Still not asking for special privileges or extra hunting opportunity's.BBarnes keeping public lands public.

Since i have been involved on this web site,and by the way IT'S A GREAT ONE i have tried to raise awareness.Also i have tried to let outdoorsman know of upcoming events things that are affecting our opportunity's and getting people engaged so our opportunity's aren't taken from us.The problem i see is united we stand and divided we fall.What I'm trying to say is opportunity is going away and no one wants to help out theres no team work or togetherness.Its iii or me me me well theres no i in team and
there will be opportunity,if we continue to look out only for our self's.You've got to think past yourself and include everyone else,my way of thinking is EVERYONE should have the same opportunities that i have had.The M H program should be like a eagle scout in the boy scouts, there no extras just a self satisfaction to you archived something that most thought couldn't be done.My hats off to the over achievers in life,that's something that i have personally chosen thoughout my life to be.In closing I'm still not and wont ever ask for opportunities over others because i choose to stand united BBarnes keeping public lands public.

Back to my point THINK PAST YOURSELF.

This subject seems to be getting allot of attention, now all someone needs to do is post all the opportunity's.I want to see this years reg opportunity's posted then the real debate will follow.Post the unit the time allowed, time of year and total days the
M H get verse the rest of the 277,000 hunters paying the bills here.B Barnes keeping the public lands public and still not asking for any extra opportunity's


P.S. we need to hear the stories


I would still like to know why the M H gets, to hunt the pumas plains and others don't?
I would also like to point out that i have been respectfull of others on this site.Futher more any one who knows me would vouce for the dollars spent ,and the efforts that have been put foward.As far as ethics go check out my website.As for blowing hot air i would like to say i brougt some great points to the table and recignized people for there accomplisments.B Barnes keeping the public lands public and still not asking for any extra opportunity's.



Link:  http://www.mtsainthelensrescue.com/

[Goldeneye]

>
                       HOW ABOUT THE PUMAS PLAIN'S TAG AT MOUNT SAINT HELEN'S THIS IS FEDRAL LAND AND SHOULD BE ACCESSABLE TO ANYONE WHO PAY'S TAX .THIS IS NOTHING LESS THAN DESCRIMANATION TO THE 200 THOUSAND PLUS HUNTERS WHO BUY TAG'S IN THIS STATE. THERE NEED'S TO BE A CLASS ACTION LAW SUIT OVER THIS.B BARNES KEEPING PUBLIC LANDS PUBLIC FOR EVERYONE NOT JUST STATE EMPLOYEES WHO TAKE THE COURSE ONLINE AT WORK WHILE WE PAY THERE WAGE.

bbarnes,

  I am a card holder in the MHE program and have been for many years.  I'm not going to comment about the bulk of your note because I don't think it would do much good.  One thing I do take exception to is your accusation above that states "PUBLIC LANDS PUBLIC FOR EVERYONE NOT JUST STATE EMPLOYEES WHO TAKE THE COURSE ONLINE AT WORK WHILE WE PAY THERE WAGE".  First off, I'm not a state employee, you do not pay my wages, I studied for this course often after putting in a 12 to 14 hour days at work and passed it after I felt I knew the material which is extensive.  Also, the course is not an on-line course as you state in your posting.  It is not a cake walk by any means.  Like many people I donate about a 100 hours a year to various conservation work for the state and Ducks Unlimited. So, to sum it up, don't try to lump all of us into one convenient bucket.  That just won't float.

[Little Dave]

HOW ABOUT THE PUMAS PLAIN'S TAG AT MOUNT SAINT HELEN'S THIS IS FEDRAL LAND AND SHOULD BE ACCESSABLE TO ANYONE WHO PAY'S TAX .THIS IS NOTHING LESS THAN DESCRIMANATION TO THE 200 THOUSAND PLUS HUNTERS WHO BUY TAG'S IN THIS STATE.

I would still like to know why the M H gets, to hunt the pumas plains and others don't?

The "Elk area 5063 - Pumice Plain" is entirely within the boundary of the National Volcanic Monument managed by Gifford Pinchot National Forest.  So any access issue concerning permission to enter the land is determined by the forest service.

Elk in this state are considered to be property of the state whether the elk is on public or private property.  Also, hunting in Washington is considered a privilege, not a right.  The privilege to hunt is regulated by the WDFW and tribal agencies with treaty rights as an exception to state regulations.

The entire Elk area 5063 - Pumice Plain is between the tourist viewpoint at Johnston Ridge and the volcano.  What I recall about this area is that the plain is in full public view.  So the situation here is that we have a hunt happening at one of the states top tourist destinations... an elk being loaded up for the ride home in the same parking lot.  Whether having a MH certification or not, good idea to promote a positive image of hunting when you hunt in a theatre like this.

[KillBilly]

The "Elk area 5063 - Pumice Plain" is entirely within the boundary of the National Volcanic Monument managed by Gifford Pinchot National Forest.  So any access issue concerning permission to enter the land is determined by the forest service.

Elk in this state are considered to be property of the state whether the elk is on public or private property.  Also, hunting in Washington is considered a privilege, not a right.  The privilege to hunt is regulated by the WDFW and tribal agencies with treaty rights as an exception to state regulations.

The entire Elk area 5063 - Pumice Plain is between the tourist viewpoint at Johnston Ridge and the volcano.  What I recall about this area is that the plain is in full public view.  So the situation here is that we have a hunt happening at one of the states top tourist destinations... an elk being loaded up for the ride home in the same parking lot.  Whether having a MH certification or not, good idea to promote a positive image of hunting when you hunt in a theatre like this.

Well stated

[buckhorn2]

We have talked about the master hunters and the common hunter but what about the hunters with disabilities how do they fit in. I have a good friend who has a disability card and every year he comes over and we try to figure what hunt would be best for him to put in for. He works and has little time off so he has to hunt the west side and he has to have help if he gets to hunt. WE got to talking about opportunity and disability verses master hunter came up. He brought a 2007 hunting regulation to show me the new direction the state is going. In 2007 masterhunters had 35 hunts to put in for with 440 permits to put in for including the second elk tag that did;nt effect points. Disabled hunters had 15 to choose from with 83 permits to choose from and 10 hunts were westside. In 2009 master hunters had 36 hunts to put in for with 572 permits avalable many of the hunts not effecting accumulated points. The disabled hunter this year has 13 hunts to choose from with only 6 on the west side with 26 permits available and only 63 permits for the whole state for the disabled. It sure sounds unfair to my friend they took all the hunts away that were close to our area and he does;nt know what to do. Can they maybe start a master hunting program for the disabled so he would have some hunting opportunity or maybe the master hunters could earn more points by taking a handicapped person hunting anyway my friend thinks the state just took him right out of elk hunting. Pumice plains is going to come back on us there are to many eyes on that hunt.

[workstohunt]

The Pumice plains hunt is for MH because that is all the WDFW could get. They wanted it open to all hunters (to control elk populations) but the NFS (WHO DOESNT CARE ABOUT HUNTERS) said NO WAY. NFS wants no one off trail period. SOOO the compromise was to let a limited amount of master hunters on a trail basis hunt the area.
All of this was explained in the master hunter informational meeting OPEN TO THE PUBLIC for those that had enough of a concern to attend and be informed and ask questions, instead of trashing someone on a web site that does'nt agree with ther point of view.
QUIT WHINING!!!! it's getting really old.

[WAcoyotehunter]

Hunters with disabilities can put in for lots of hunts and get special permission to drive into closed road areas.  That helps them quite a lot as well.  

[KillzElk]

Yes very true on the Disabled Hunter Road Access Entry Program 100%.. They should have First Rights to any hunt that would be easy for them, I feel putting a smile on there face for happiness should be #1.. 

Thank You.
http://wdfw.wa.gov/outreach/access/accessibility/roadaccess.htm

[Bob33]

Hunters with disabilities are also welcome to become Master Hunters.  While not all Master Hunter hunts would be a good fit, I'm sure that any Master Hunter worthy of the name would go out of his way to help someone with a disability.

[bearhunter59]

I didn't realize that enrolling in the MH program automatically proves your ethics and makes you a higher caliber individual than myself.

Enrolling in the program doesn't prove anything to anyone.  Completing the course and getting state certification, in the eyes of the WDFW and other Master Hunters, does.

Here's a question for those of you complaining about the "advantages" the Master Hunters get....why haven't you bothered trying to become a Master Hunter?  If you feel that master hunters have a better chance of drawing a moose tag and harvesting one, then why not become a Master Hunter?  Instead of standing outside the clubhouse, complaining about the advantages of being a club member, why not try joining the club?  Seems like that would be an easy solution to your complaint.  My guess is because you miss the major point of the Master Hunter program, which is promoting high ethics and conservationism amongst the hunting community.  It is NOT about the "extra hunting opportunities"...that is just one of the benefits of the program,(which a majority of the Master Hunters will never be selected to take advantage of).  Instead of being jealous, try joining the club...

[Caretaker]

MH program in part exists to assist land owners to lesson crop damage.  Land owners needed a method to keep yahoo's off their property who violated their rules (driving on fields, leaving trash behind, churning tires on their driveways, cutting fences to gain vehicle access etc) at the same time controlling damage caused by wildlife.  It's these reasons that many hunting opportunities have been ruined for the general public.  No, the program is not perfected and their is a few of these folks in the program, that I will agree.  But it has improved the last few years and many have been kicked out of the program for violations.  I do not agree that is is discriminatory, if anyone has been discriminated against it's the public hunting opportunities ruined by unethical yahoo's.

My two cents.