Cougar populations in Washington?

[Kain]

http://www.biggamehunt.net/sections/Mountain_Lion/Big_Cats_Are_Back_11040212.html

"The Colorado Division of Wildlife won't give an estimate of the cougar population within it's borders but a conservative estimate by several knowledgeable individuals puts the population at approximately three thousand. Hornocker's mountain lion/cougar study in Idaho showed the average cougar killed one mule deer per week or fifty deer per year. That means that Colorado's cat population is taking 150,000 mule deer from a total estimated population of 300,000 deer. Hunters presently harvest between 40,000-50,000 per year. In 1963 Colorado's deer harvest was 147,000 mule deer so the cougar has replaced the hunter as the number one predator on the Colorado mule deer population."

Holy crap!  Anyone know what the estimated numbers are for Washington?

[bowhunterforever]

  Thats alot of dead deer. Wonder what the numbers are here?

[saylean]

It doesnt seem hard to find tracks thats for sure. Heres an elk I found last year hunting...

[Cougeyes]

You gotta remember that it's just not deer though, they kill elk and other species as well so the effects on one given species may not be as great as we think. Or as that study may elude to.

[OneHorn]

i can tell you theres way to many and its dumb that we cant hunt them with dogs. i wonder how many people have to be killed this year for them to allow us to hunt them with dogs again.

[boneaddict]

Not just being loud and obnoxiuos but I used to find (inthe last three years or so , a ton of cougar sign.  It was kinda scary really.  This spring, almost none.  Lots of wolf stuff though.  I have found more wolf than cat.  I serious wonder if there is a correlation.  

[OneHorn]

this turkey season i have seen at least 5 different sets of cats track that were all within a mile of eachother. I think it was 2 years ago that fishunt247 and my dad had 2 cougars stalk them while they were callin in a couple toms.

[Kain]

http://wdfw.wa.gov/wlm/living/cougars.htm

"Cougars occur throughout Washington where suitable cover and prey are found. The cougar population for the year 2002 was estimated to be 2,400 to 3,500 animals. Statewide, the cougar population is likely declining. The Department of Fish and Wildlife has nine management zones around the state designated for “maintain” or “decline,” and adjusts harvest levels accordingly."

Thats 120,000-175,000 deer or elk per year.

Hunters, poachers, wolves, bobcats, coyotes, bears, cougars, cars, and nature.  If you were not a predator hunter before you might want to give it a try.  Deer and elk hunting will be much better if we thin them out a little.

[saylean]

2002 the high est. for cougs was 3500...I bet there is more nowadays, so lets say 4000 cougs..

times 52 weeks a year (1 deer or elk per week)

208,000 animals...

[Kain]

Not just being loud and obnoxiuos but I used to find (inthe last three years or so , a ton of cougar sign.  It was kinda scary really.  This spring, almost none.  Lots of wolf stuff though.  I have found more wolf than cat.  I serious wonder if there is a correlation.  

I seems unlikely they would kill the cougars but just drive them out of the area.  Your area having less might account for others seeing more.  Even if the population is declining the new changes in the regulations might turn that around within a year.  Interesting.

[boneaddict]

Kind of what I was figuring.   I doubted they actually get many, especially in these areas as they are highly timbered.  Did figure they'd push them out, and if the deer are gone, no reason for the cats to be there as well.

[elksnout]

One of my employees saw a huge cat just north of Chinook, Wa while on a clam digging trip last weekend. He said it was about 50 yards off of the pavement in a cow pasture.

[Armadillo]

Saw one today while out scouting. Walked up on it while it was laying down in the bottom of a swampy gully with a creek just off the skid road. I'll admit that I dont know anything about cougar behavior but would there be a reason for the thing to be laying down near a noisy creek? maybe it was just trying to stay outta sight while I passed on the road? I saw the form plain as day from about 50 yards thru the thick brush but I had to glass it for a few minutes before I saw any movement that told it was indeed an animal. It just looked like a yellowish orangy blob that was out of place. At this point I still couldnt ID it for sure, either it was a deer or a coug. I saw a tail flick so I kept watching but as I shifted my weight to my right foot it caused a rock to grate really loudly and thru my glass I saw the face of the cat whip up from behind a bush but it didnt look right at me it was looking towards my right then it burst forth and ran in that direction. Very cool experience, what a rush!. I have been seeing quite a few kitty tracks lately

[littlebuf]

its kinda funny you said " the cougar has replaced the hunter as the top predator" when it was probably the other way around if you think about it, the cougars were the top predator well before we showed up  that being said if i see a cat its going down. i like being on top 

[Kain]

its kinda funny you said " the cougar has replaced the hunter as the top predator" when it was probably the other way around if you think about it, the cougars were the top predator well before we showed up  that being said if i see a cat its going down. i like being on top 

I didnt say that, that was a quote from the article I posted a link to.

 But I think the point was that the lack of management allowed the balance to get out of control.  These game departments seem to be constantly playing catch up to their decisions.  Just look at the new regs here in this state.  They say the cougar population is declining due to an over harvest on females.  So they make a drastic change to whole program.  Now I think almost everyone here can tell you right away that this will have a dramatic effect on the number of cougars harvested.  So what happens in two years when the population is not only growing it goes back up to out of control levels. 

"Females average more offspring per litter in their first years of reproduction, and then decrease in future litters (Logan et al. 1996)."- http://www.uwsp.edu/wildlife/carnivore/Mountain%20Lion%20Natural%20History_files/Mountain%20Lion%20Natural%20History_copy(1).htm

By this study a "growing" population can grow faster than a stable population. (if that makes sense)  They could have reduced the bag limit to 1 cougar and removed August from the season.  That would have reduced the number of animals harvested in a controlled manor.  But in three years they will have more damage permits given out to try and get the problem under control when they could have let the general population of hunters have hunting opportunities the whole time and still kept the cougar populations stable.