Washington Counties Call for Extended Cougar Season, as Cats Decimate Elk Calves

[bearpaw]

Washington Counties Call for Extended Cougar Season, as Cats Decimate Elk Calves

https://www.fieldandstream.com/conservation/cougars-decimate-washington-elk-calves/

[hunter399]

I believe this is in one other topic.
But anyway ,WDFW tried to raise quotas like a year ago,and inslee said no.
Artical is mostly about the Blues,but I would argue that quotas need to be raised to the 22% instead of 16% harvest rate they are now,statewide.
The Blues,along with many areas of Washington have wolves,needed regulations,seasons,ect ,ect are not being addressed. Along with many other issues.

[Cougartail]

Unless they allow dogs there should be no quotas. Because of the difficulty hunting them it will self regulate. At 2000 to 2500 animas a 16% harvest would be hard to obtain.

Having hunted predators for almost 40 years I  can't  believe the amount of sign I see these days and still no cougar. Go figure.

[fireweed]

Everyone on this forum needs to get their facts straight.  Follow the science!.  Don't you know that cougars self-regulate and do not overpopulate nor impact game populations.  It's a proven fact.

http://westernwildlife.org/cougar-outreach-project/faqs/#overpopulate

(stop throwing things at me, I'm being tongue-in-cheek)

[bearpaw]

Everyone on this forum needs to get their facts straight.  Follow the science!.  Don't you know that cougars self-regulate and do not overpopulate nor impact game populations.  It's a proven fact.

http://westernwildlife.org/cougar-outreach-project/faqs/#overpopulate

(stop throwing things at me, I'm being tongue-in-cheek)

You are correct, they do self regulate when they run out of food 

[Farmer72]

it is all BS. If you look at the numbers that each of the 2 articles linked above show they dont add up. Mainly 2 statements jump out at me.

these 2 from the western wildlife outreach:

Cougars’ social structure and their status as a top-tier predators translates into low population numbers of resident cougars, approximately four (4) cougars per 100 square miles.

Cougars rarely cause substantial declines in prey populations. Cougars co-evolved with their prey over millennia and there is no evidence that predation by cougars limits the growth of healthy elk and deer populations. There are rare situations where cougars impact a prey population’s growth rate, such as when prey numbers fall to critically low levels. However, most often other factors cause deer and elk population declines, such as habitat loss, changes in habitat quality, disease, weather, hunter harvest, road kills, and poaching.

and this one from field and stream plus the harvest numbers from 2020 for deer:

A Blue Mountains cougar research project that concluded in 2013 found densities of 3.02 mature cats per 38.6 square miles.

Looks like the mature cats per 100 sq. miles are a bit off. Also when the cougars dont change deer populations but hunting does. Based off the numbers of one deer kill every 7-10 days equating to 36 deer per cougar and the estimate of 2000 cougars equaling 72,000 deer total and the 2020 deer harvest reports stating hunting took just under 30,000 deer.

I know this is singing to the choir but just more proof decisions are not being made off of the science.

[msg]

Please send me all of your spare books. Especially the one by Capstick called Death in The Tall Grass. I need all the ammo I can get if attacked by a cougar. Imagine that, almost 50 years of hunting and never thought to carry a book for protection from cats!

[birddogdad]

someone should save this article , 10 years from now the article will be same and using wolves in headline i wager..

[JeepWrangler]

01/12/2022
03:47pm

WDFW Cougar Zone Closure Hotline stated:

"All GMU's are currently open to Cougar Hunting"

[bigmacc]

Everyone on this forum needs to get their facts straight.  Follow the science!.  Don't you know that cougars self-regulate and do not overpopulate nor impact game populations.  It's a proven fact.

http://westernwildlife.org/cougar-outreach-project/faqs/#overpopulate

(stop throwing things at me, I'm being tongue-in-cheek)

You are correct, ya right, they do self regulate when they run out of food 

This is true, a friend of mine has seen 4, yes FOUR cats on his 900 acres over the last two weeks, they are 4 different cats, 2 have collars,( different colors) and the other 2 are a big fella and one that looks juvenile. Yep no predator problem in this state.

[Buzzsaw461]

 

Everyone on this forum needs to get their facts straight.  Follow the science!.  Don't you know that cougars self-regulate and do not overpopulate nor impact game populations.  It's a proven fact.

http://westernwildlife.org/cougar-outreach-project/faqs/#overpopulate

(stop throwing things at me, I'm being tongue-in-cheek)

You are correct, they do self regulate when they run out of food 

[KFhunter]

Not just calves either 

https://purehoneyus.com/video-man-discovers-mountain-lion-devouring-elk-on-his-back-porch/

[hunter399]

Everyone on this forum needs to get their facts straight.  Follow the science!.  Don't you know that cougars self-regulate and do not overpopulate nor impact game populations.  It's a proven fact.

http://westernwildlife.org/cougar-outreach-project/faqs/#overpopulate

(stop throwing things at me, I'm being tongue-in-cheek)

You are correct, they do self regulate when they run out of food 

That's funny, all predators self regulate when the food is gone.
Coyote and wolves the same,litter size,or eating there litter.
Or whatever.

[Platensek-po]

Can you get the location of collared cats from wdfw like you can with elk?? Asking for a friend

[sixgun_symphony]

We simply must get more hunters to vote or we lose hunting.

 There should be voter registration drive tables at every gun show and sportsman's show.

[Iveexcaped3]

I think the thing that’s frustrating that you see all over the forum and online is everyone complaining about there not being deer or elk because of predators but yet like wrangler noted not a single county has filled quota. If we pred hunt like opening day the quota should be filled first week.

[sixgun_symphony]

I think the thing that’s frustrating that you see all over the forum and online is everyone complaining about there not being deer or elk because of predators but yet like wrangler noted not a single county has filled quota. If we pred hunt like opening day the quota should be filled first week.

 Hunting with hounds is really the only effective method for reducing wildcats. That and trapping, which we are not allowed to do either.

 Hunters need to start paying attention to politics, because politics will not ignore hunting/trapping. BTW, they're about to pass some gun control legislation in Olympia. 

[jrebel]

I think the thing that’s frustrating that you see all over the forum and online is everyone complaining about there not being deer or elk because of predators but yet like wrangler noted not a single county has filled quota. If we pred hunt like opening day the quota should be filled first week.

Have you ever hunted cougars without hounds?   How many have you seen in the wild?   Take opening day of modern deer or elk as the example……all those hunters in the field.  The majority have a cougar and bear tag and would gladly fill them….yet very few get taken yearly.   These predators are not easy to hunt and even harder to kill.  I’ve seen two live cougars in the field in all my years of hunting.   Both were moving and I never got a shot.   

My point is…..it’s not as easy as you make it out to be.   If it were, we wouldn’t have a predator problem. 

[huntnnw]

Its hard to hunt cats without hounds, but you cant compare sightings with October versus say Jan atleast in most of E WA. With snowfall in the mountains driving animals down you drastically reduce the area cats are not going to be. You increase your chances  if you just get out and hunt them. Problem is very very few are willing to get out in December, January and February and really put the time in. It has low percentage odds and doesnt appeal to many to be out that time of year and really is a very boring hunt.

[Humptulips]

I'll just add on the west side we have this thing called brush. Cougar are hard to see and they disappear fast.
I have been very close to cougar two times this year. One so close I could smell him/her. Never laid eyes on either one.

[trophyhunt]

Not just calves either 

https://purehoneyus.com/video-man-discovers-mountain-lion-devouring-elk-on-his-back-porch/

Why don't people just put the phone away and pull out their gun instead!!!  Maybe they did after the short video, I can only hope they had the sense to kill that cat.

[Karl Blanchard]

As others have mentioned,  cat killing is just plain hard. Vast majority of hunters can't even consistently kill deer and elk which are 100x easier to take than cats. Even guys who are pretty savvy predator callers struggle with cats. I've seen probably 2 dozen cats over the years and have yet to connect. Most have been during turkey season. The rest have been at a distance glassing or at night in the headlights. I called one in for a buddy once and had a few almosts but still missing one of my own. Its just flat out really hard.

[Cougartail]

As others have mentioned,  cat killing is just plain hard. Vast majority of hunters can't even consistently kill deer and elk which are 100x easier to take than cats. Even gu :bash:ys who are pretty savvy predator callers struggle with cats. I've seen probably 2 dozen cats over the years and have yet to connect. Most have been during turkey season. The rest have been at a distance glassing or at night in the headlights. I called one in for a buddy once and had a few almosts but still missing one of my own. Its just flat out really hard.

The only cougar that I could have killed was one I called in at night with a thermal scope. All the rest of them were moving at a high rate of speed.

[meatwhack]

I could’ve pretty easily killed two if I’d have had a rifle in the rig with me but both were during archery season and I couldn’t quite get close enough with a bow. I’ve seen a hand full more glassing that were way too far away to do anything about and then several at night over the years. I really think if they removed the quota and opened it up at night a substantial dent could be made in them in most areas.

[BreezyBear]

I've come across a few in August while bear hunting, seems like a no brainer for it to open August 1st 

[huntnnw]

The very first year hounds could not be used I was bear hunting and missed a cat at 380 yards fast forward 40 days later mule deer hunting I shot a big tom at 200 yards watching me eat lunch. I have yet to get a shot at a cat before or after that year! I have seen some and shoulda killed one last year.

[hunter399]

Seen a few,never presented with a shot,or no gun,or not cougar season , So it just never lines up.
Most the ones I have seen are crossing a road like ,LIGHTING!!!!

But I did see one that sticks out.
A younger me.......
I worked in the woods,you had to be at job site at 3 or 4 in the mourning. Behind closed gate ,Maybe 7-8 miles from the gate ,Driving along came around a switchback,Dead deer laying right in the middle of road. With a big cat standing right over it. The cat jumped up on the bank and stood there like national geographic . I left went to work,came back out deer was still laying there. Came back in the mourning deer had been dragged off the road .On the downhill side into the thick stuff,I never went and looked ,maybe it was the cat or a bear smelled and dragged it off the road,I will never know.
About a week later ,I was driving out very close to where the deer had been killed in the road. I was driving the main line and looked down one of the spur roads ,seen something moving in the road down there ,out the corner of my eye driving by. I stop and backed up and looked and watched for a few minutes. I look down there and it was like three or four small cats playing in the road. And I remember the sun was setting but not dark yet. And I watched them for maybe a few minutes. Then again I look up on the bank of the road down there. Big moma just laying  up there watching her kids playing in the road. Last I seen them,I drove off and let them be.

We where not allowed to hunt,or have a gun,most the time I did,but just a pistol for personal protection.

[buckfvr]

Reclassification for cougar and wolf as predators, same season and rules as coyote.  Even at that it takes forever to see significant gains.

[hunter399]

Reclassification for cougar and wolf as predators, same season and rules as coyote.  Even at that it takes forever to see significant gains.

I do agree.
The old anti-hunters would fall off there composting toilets so fast. 

[meatwhack]

For cougars that’s a change that they definitely have the ability to do and I think it would be the biggest difference we could have without hounds.