Oak creek open up for natives

[pianoman9701]

I do not believe it is "Native Bashing" just for someone to disagree that they have "rights" to hunt and kill whatever they want basically.  Its ok to think something is wrong even if its legal.

The point is you're blaming the wrong people. Congress and the President gave treaty rights to Native tribes. They didn't just show up and demand them. Blame the gov't., not the Tribes.

If there were a lotto and you won exclusive rights to sheds or year-round elk hunting or unlimited crabbing or snagging chums or something else you love to hunt or fish, would you turn it down? I doubt it. If our government allows Native people to harvest antlers and elk at Oak Creek and you don't like it, talk to your duly-elected government.

[KFhunter]

Ratified treaties are the law of the land, equal to our constitution in power.

But a lot of our current issues is previous lawsuits, which look more like reparations than proper interpretation of law

[pianoman9701]

Ratified treaties are the law of the land, equal to our constitution in power.

But a lot of our current issues is previous lawsuits, which look more like reparations than proper interpretation of law

Again, those lawsuits have to do with previously ceded lands...to do with treaties. Regardless of whether it's treaties or judicial ruling, it's the government which gives them those rights. They don't just claim them.

[idahohuntr]

Congress and the President gave treaty rights to Native tribes.

This is not correct and clarification here may help in understanding some of these tribal issues...treaty rights are often referred to as 'reserved' rights....rights the Tribes have always had (pre-dating US Gov't) and which are so important to them they explicitly reserved them at the time they ceded other rights/interests/claims to broad swaths of land.

But a lot of our current issues is previous lawsuits, which look more like reparations than proper interpretation of law

I disagree.  Federal Indian law and interpretation of treaties is generally well reasoned/supported by the case law.  Obviously reasonable people can come to different conclusions on any individual case...but collectively I would not view any broad set of rulings as reparations...I think that view is more common from folks who forget the hundred-ish years treaty rights were ignored or even criminalized. 

[pianoman9701]

Congress and the President gave treaty rights to Native tribes.

This is not correct and clarification here may help in understanding some of these tribal issues...treaty rights are often referred to as 'reserved' rights....rights the Tribes have always had (pre-dating US Gov't) and which are so important to them they explicitly reserved them at the time they ceded other rights/interests/claims to broad swaths of land.

But a lot of our current issues is previous lawsuits, which look more like reparations than proper interpretation of law

I disagree.  Federal Indian law and interpretation of treaties is generally well reasoned/supported by the case law.  Obviously reasonable people can come to different conclusions on any individual case...but collectively I would not view any broad set of rulings as reparations...I think that view is more common from folks who forget the hundred-ish years treaty rights were ignored or even criminalized.

You missed my point, which is that either by treaty or judicial decision, the government is responsible for Native resource rights. The tribes don't just decide something is theirs and take it.

[trophyhunt]

Do we know if theres any truth to the OP

I personally wasn’t there to talk to the guys at the gate, but from this thread it sounds like it’s no secret, and falls in line with what I was told. 

[nwmein199]

Do we know if theres any truth to the OP

I personally wasn’t there to talk to the guys at the gate, but from this thread it sounds like it’s no secret, and falls in line with what I was told.

So the answer to the question is "No"...there is no truth or evidence to support the claims OP made.

I was told it was only Eskimos being allowed in the gate at Oak Creek feeding station.

[fishngamereaper]

Back in the day when I was helping feed the elk in the eburg area I had keys to the gates. I rolled through the gate one day and there was a handful of people trying to get pics of some welfare elk...they asked what I was doing... told them elk love alfalfa and I was going to lure them in and shoot the biggest bull...the reaction was priceless...thank goodness the internet didn't exist back then..

[phildobaggins]

Back in the day when I was helping feed the elk in the eburg area I had keys to the gates. I rolled through the gate one day and there was a handful of people trying to get pics of some welfare elk...they asked what I was doing... told them elk love alfalfa and I was going to lure them in and shoot the biggest bull...the reaction was priceless...thank goodness the internet didn't exist back then..

I love that.

[snake]

I do not believe it is "Native Bashing" just for someone to disagree that they have "rights" to hunt and kill whatever they want basically.  Its ok to think something is wrong even if its legal.

The point is you're blaming the wrong people. Congress and the President gave treaty rights to Native tribes. They didn't just show up and demand them. Blame the gov't., not the Tribes.

If there were a lotto and you won exclusive rights to sheds or year-round elk hunting or unlimited crabbing or snagging chums or something else you love to hunt or fish, would you turn it down? I doubt it. If our government allows Native people to harvest antlers and elk at Oak Creek and you don't like it, talk to your duly-elected government.

Yes boss, I understand how it all works and how it came to be so. I still stand by my post. These "rights" are being greatly abused by many in the tribe and that's a fact. Its not native bashing.

[trophyhunt]

I do not believe it is "Native Bashing" just for someone to disagree that they have "rights" to hunt and kill whatever they want basically.  Its ok to think something is wrong even if its legal.

The point is you're blaming the wrong people. Congress and the President gave treaty rights to Native tribes. They didn't just show up and demand them. Blame the gov't., not the Tribes.

If there were a lotto and you won exclusive rights to sheds or year-round elk hunting or unlimited crabbing or snagging chums or something else you love to hunt or fish, would you turn it down? I doubt it. If our government allows Native people to harvest antlers and elk at Oak Creek and you don't like it, talk to your duly-elected government.

Yes boss, I understand how it all works and how it came to be so. I still stand by my post. These "rights" are being greatly abused by many in the tribe and that's a fact. Its not native bashing.

I don’t know man, you have proof?? The CNN fact checkers need more than just hearsay!!

[LDennis24]

Literally a half dozen threads on hear going back to 2008 when Bone wanted to strangle some people over trying to shoot elk in the Oak Creek wildlife area.  This is old news and will continue until folks stop ranting on internet forums about fairness and actually do the dirty work of fighting for the change through legal means.

[trophyhunt]

Literally a half dozen threads on hear going back to 2008 when Bone wanted to strangle some people over trying to shoot elk in the Oak Creek wildlife area.  This is old news and will continue until folks stop ranting on internet forums about fairness and actually do the dirty work of fighting for the change through legal means.

thats right, it’s happening and we all know it, but people still ask for proof. What a joke.

[trophyhunt]

Dennis, there is no fight, that’s the truth. In fact, all we can do is bitch about it, and this is a hunting forum, it’s gonna come up.  The natives would most likely get a kick out of non natives losing all our hunting rights, the chance that they will ever lose theirs is zero. 

[rtspring]

Here is whats sad!!! We are arguing about stupid antlers cause “we” have put such a value on them in the first dang place!!!

Hunters, Hunting Community is a dog eat dog world.  Always has been always will be.