Action Bedding Question??

[jrebel]

I have a buddy that had a custom rifle put together with an remington action he had on hand.  New barrel, new stock, etc, etc..... and the thing shoots like absolute garbage.  He has $3200 in the build and in my humble opinion, it is a boat anchor. 

I am not a gunsmith, but I have been around guns for quite a while and seen the good and the bad.  I think I know a thing or two....so my questions are:

Should the bedded action have any bedding in contact with the barrel.  This rifle is bedded approx 1" past the threaded shank of the rifle.  It is a carbon fiber barrel and the steal before the carbon is not free floated.  Is this normal?  Could this be the cause of it's inaccuracy?  Custom loads with ES of 8 and SD of 4.4 will not shoot sub 3 MOA at 100 yards.  GARBAGE..... 


Thanks for you input. 

[JimmyHoffa]

I think many bedding jobs go about an inch forward of the action on the chamber.  Seen a few go about as far as the chamber might extend.

[jrebel]

I think many bedding jobs go about an inch forward of the action on the chamber.  Seen a few go about as far as the chamber might extend.

That's pretty much what this is.....the length of the chamber.  I don't know what to make of it.....I'm confident in my reloading and this rifle is garbage.  This is the second rifle this friend has had built...semi custom....that doesn't shoot well.  Two different smiths, two different actions and both no good.  I'm not sure what to make of it...

I can tell you this.....my factory savages will shoot circles around these semi customs and for 1/2 to 1/3 the price.  Frustrating....but I'm not throwing another grain of powder at this rifle.   

[Mtnwalker]

Inch past the lug is fairly standard from what I've seen. If you're sure the scope or mounts aren't the issue then sounds like that gun needs to go back to the smith for some warranty work.

[Magnum_Willys]

Bedding is normal.  You sure its not the scope?
Your “Custom loads” aren’t made for that rifle. 
Have you tried developing  for that rifle? 

A rifle can be a tack driver or a scattergun depending on the ammo.

[hunter399]

Bedding is normal.  You sure its not the scope?
Your “Custom loads” aren’t made for that rifle. 
Have you tried developing  for that rifle? 

A rifle can be a tack driver or a scattergun depending on the ammo.

I was thinking same.
What bullet
What caliber.
Powder
Coal
Barrel harmonic is not good or something.
Muzzle break,free floated.
Spill all the beans!!!!!

[Buckjunkie]

I don’t remember ever seeing a rifle that went from 3” groups to sub MOA without re-barreling. So if that is your goal, I would contact the barrel manufacturer and tell them what you are experiencing and see what they do. They should at a minimum give you a new barrel.

Developing loads is expensive and components are hard to find, so spending more money getting the rifle in order is likely the least expensive route.

[jrebel]

Inch past the lug is fairly standard from what I've seen. If you're sure the scope or mounts aren't the issue then sounds like that gun needs to go back to the smith for some warranty work.

Put my brand new zeis on it to make sure the scope was not the problem  Torqued the rail to spec. and the scope is not the issue.  Checked and torqued the action screws, cleaned, the whole works.....still shoots like garbage.  I told my buddy that spending another dime on it, at this point, is a wasted dime.  I can usually work a decent load in 25-50 rounds.  A great load after tweaking in way less than 100 rounds.  We are 150 rounds into this and I think I'm done. 

I don't own this chambering so I started from scratch. 

- uniform / deburr flash whole,
- Anneal brass
- Full length size to .002 of chamber based on a fired case.
- trim, deburr, chamfer
- ladder test with 0.5 grains of powder through the spectrum looking for pressure. 
- Best node was ES of 21 with 1.5 grains of powder (three shots), picked the middle load.
- Seat to mag length which depending on the bullet put me at 0.02 to 0.08 off the lands to start

I have tried hammer hunters, accubonds and ELD-X bullets with weights ranging from 174 to 212 grains.  Notta....nothing....I could get tighter groups with 12 gauge at 100 yards.      Some sarcasm.....but you get my point. 

It's a 300 RUM with 1:10 twist 24" proof barrel. 

In comparison....my new project was a 338 lapua factory savage.  I use the same process with all my reloading and it is shooting 1/2" or better MOA.  It was a new chambering for me and it likes to shoot.  Same with all my rifles..... 

Bedding is normal.  You sure its not the scope?
Your “Custom loads” aren’t made for that rifle. 
Have you tried developing  for that rifle? 

A rifle can be a tack driver or a scattergun depending on the ammo.

I was thinking same.
What bullet
What caliber.
Powder
Coal
Barrel harmonic is not good or something.
Muzzle break,free floated.
Spill all the beans!!!!!

Primarily have been using H1000.  Switched from my buddies jug to mine to confirm powder wasn't the issue.  Played a little with 4832SC and retumbo to find the same groups. 

[Karl Blanchard]

Haha. I only laugh because out of the dozens of custom guns I've done load development on the one big problem child I had was a 300 rum proof carbon built by one of the premier rifle builders in the game. 3 powder, bullet combos later I got it to hold 3/4 minute. Same thing too. Maybe not 3 moa but a solid 2 moa a lot of the time. Finally told the guy "hey you can just run the hell out of this thing at a very repeatable sub moa or you can send it back but I'm done."

[Fidelk]

Maybe test it with quality factory ammo. I bought a Remington 700 Long Range (.300 Win Mag) for around $600. Starting with a cold barrel and waiting 2 minutes or so between shots, it will print a bench rest 3 shot group at 300 yards under an inch with 180 gr. Barnes VOR-TX factory loads. Tried several other factory loads (including Nosler and Hornady) but it prefers the Barnes.

Has a Burris 2-10x42 scope which almost allows me to see the bullseye on the target at that distance. I would go nuts with a setup that cost $3200 but didn't deliver. It's bedded and the heavy barrel is free floated. For an inexpensive production rifle it is awesome. Just got lucky in buying what I did.......I wouldn't know how to build an accurate rifle. The suggestion to return to smith for warranty work, if available, would be a starting point, along with factory ammo.

[hunter399]

Only thing I can think of is.
And it's gonna sound CRAZY!!!
Load three rounds to the same length as factory.
Or start backing up your coal.
Depending on how the chamber is cut.
That bullet might need a jump to the rifling,instead of being so close to it.
Some rifles like weird stuff.
I know it's crazy talk ,but I have seen some calibers shoot better with some bullet jump.
Just looking at Google it looks like 3.6 is standard for that caliber, Whatever your COAL is split the difference,load like 5 rounds and test it.

[OltHunter]

Try the setup free floated on a stock rem 700 if you have one to rule it out.

Also double check a go/no go if you have it.

I just bedded by build, defiance action and proof sendero carbon, and in all my research, you shouldn't go past the lug when you have a proof sendero. The main thing is to bed up to the parallel section of the barrel, which in the proofs is behind the lug.

I'm with you to suspect bedding and free float all the way to the front of the lug. I know McMillian doesn't even recommend bedding unless accuracy is not up to your standards.

If a stock, free float stock, produces better results, you found your answer. If it still shoots garbage, try some factory loads to confirm like other mentioned.

[crabcreekhunter]

My suggestion would be to drop it into another remington stock if one is laying around or borrow one that is not bedded and if that doesnt clear anything up, I'd send the barrel back to the smith or proof.  Those are your last two variables that would cause that huge of a spread at 100 yards. 

[b23]

Doesn't the gunsmith that built it have any kind of accuracy guarantee?  If it shoots that bad, the smith would be getting it back.

[jrebel]

Doesn't the gunsmith that built it have any kind of accuracy guarantee?  If it shoots that bad, the smith would be getting it back.

Well....one would think that would be the case.  This rifle has been back to the smith twice now and keeps coming back with problems.  The first time I saw the rifle, it wouldn't chamber a round.  It would pick it up from from the magazine, push it forward but would not seat the head of the round in the bolt face.  Thinking there may be an issue with the head space, I took the ejector and firing pin out of the bolt to make sure the bold face was the correct size.  I then used a live round to see if it would chamber after being placed in the bolt.....it chambered fine.  It would not chamber it had to feed the round though.  Hope that makes sense.....

Next step was to slide the round in the chamber and push the bolt up against to find out where it was hitting and why it wasn't picking up the round.  Long story short, the bolt face was not centered in the bolt.  Now, we are talking literally thousandths of an inch...but enough to keep it from chambering a round.  The smith turned out a rifle that wouldn't even chamber a round.....  

Two months later after the bold face was milled out filled and re-milled to spec, it now chambers a round.  My guess is, we are not dealing with a trued action and that is as much the problem as anything.  This smith is a joke.....and I wouldn't take anything to him.  I have seen some of his rifles and they are amazing shooters...though one of them had to go back to him three times before it would shoot.  I have also seen this kind of work.  I feel my buddy got taken advantage of and is ultimately SOL. 

My advise today was stop sinking money into this rifle.  He could buy a Browning Xbolt max long range for 1/3 of what he has into this one and have a rifle that shoots sub MOA.  Sucks...but is better than putting one more cent into this rifle.  He could part this rifle out and probably pay for 2/3 the browning.