First oversize of 09' !

[boneaddict]

thats another good example.

[Hoytstaffshooter83]

Just let it go guys, he is never going to see the long term affects and worse yet he doesn't care. He is a short sighted, narrow minded, get mine while I can personality that is only interested in a quick paycheck. Anyone that compares catching trout plants to oversize sturgeon clearly has no clue!

It was in no  way a comparison.. my point was I also dont agree with some things people do but if they are doing it 100% legal and its fun to them I let them enjoy it,not bash them... why do I post pics? I dont think anything is wrong with that.. as far as this argument goes, you dont agree with me, thats fine.. you ask why would I fish for them if I love sturg fishing so much?  thats the reason.. nothing is more fun to catch..... its okay if its incidental... or what about in august after they have spawned? I also fish for them during those times of the year, how about the fall up at the dam? some days we hook as many oversize as keepers on very small baits...  where do you draw the line? IMO keepig large keepers is just as bad but no one ever says anything about that... a 55-60 in fish is damn close to breeding age/size maybe 1-2 years away.. but  you and everyone on here has no issue with keeping those, if you think the state of the fishery is as bad as it is, then why dont you release anything over say 53 in? that way they to can  start to breed in the next few years? personally I think the keeper fishery has a big effect as well, how many large almost breeding size fish are killed every year by sportsmen? a hell of lot more then the oversize I hook.... since we only get 5 a year and thats not many, id be all for a C & R fishery for 5 years or so.... sturg is great meat but we have plenty of other fish  that taste just as well, and they are still a blast to C & R.. so how about that? no one suggests that.. its just oversize fishing is the whole problem with our fishery.... how about 15 years ago when it was 2 a day from 3-6 ft...... how many females were killed back then? its not one thing that makes it a problem, we have to look at the whole picture....... if studies were done that conclusively said the sport fishery in the summer has a impact I would stop and wait till august to fish for them.... thats my right and I  dont think I am wrong in that stance.. you can disagree and you will and thats fine..... If I thought I was hurting the fish I wouldnt go after them...... as it stands I do and do it with the most care you can have for these fish.... if you want to worry about people, worry about the ones without the appropriate gear and knowledge to get these fish  landed in a timely manner....

[Hoytstaffshooter83]

Couple legit questions here:
- Why doesn't the F/G shut down sturgeon fishing during the spawn?
- Does the length of the fight play a major role in the stress level as it does in other fish? 
- Is 20-30 minutes a long fight, average, short for sturgeon of that size?

I totally understand the ethical argument but it seems like he's within the law in fishing for em, and he seems like he's handling them responsibily or at least trying to minimize the stress.  Is there any objective data that shows mortality associated with this?  Again, I understand the concerns but if it is so impactful on what is known to be such a fragile (as some one put so well) fishery why is it even legal?

Not tryin to take sides.... truly tryin to better understand.

 - Why doesn't the F/G shut down sturgeon fishing during the spawn? -I guess I don't understand that question, the season is closed for most breeding age fish, fish over 54" long. There are also select areas closed altogether during the spawn upstream.
- Does the length of the fight play a major role in the stress level as it does in other fish? It does in all fish
- Is 20-30 minutes a long fight, average, short for sturgeon of that size? I doubt someone when they say it only takes that long to land on oversized fish.

You can doubt it all you want.. here is a video of a 7 ftr being landed by my buddy last year in 9 minutes....... 

 

[robodad]

we should support those that do it even if its wrong, right ??

 To each his own, not me. Just because WDFW condones it doesn't make it right, there are several subjects that I don't agree with WDFW on, but thats just me.

I think were on the same page in this matter, and it's good to know that it's ok for me to have my own opinion about certain subjects even if you don't agree with them.

So are you to the point that banning the targeting of oversized sturgeon should be an option ??

[Dmanmastertracker]

 I guess maybe I wasn't specific enough. One of the programs WDFW is cutting back on is the hatchery fish program, there are hatchery raised sturgeon in this equation that will likely be reduced in number over the next few years. That also means that there will be less studies done on survival. If you are going to wait around for the next survival study to come you, you may very well wait until they are extinct. Groups from Oregon have been pressuring both ODFW and WDFW to revive the studies, with no success. I still see it was said that nothing was done illegally here, I still believe that in one of the original post's, one of the fishermen fully admitted to fishing past quitting time, after already having boated six oversize fish. One of which somehow was mysteriously measured at 8.5' completely underwater, which would be the only legal way to measure that fish . Spin it like a load of laundry if you want.

[popeshawnpaul]

Is it really legal if you are specifically targeting fish outside the legal range?  Using full size shad that a legal fish won't or can't eat.

If I troll a herring in a closed salmon area and claim I'm lingcod fishing is it legal?  If I'm on a jury I'm finding that person guilty because we all know what they are doing.   

None of my comments here specifically address this post.  Just rhetorical thoughts.

[M_ray]

Yeah ok Hoyt you are right I guess it's not illeagal to be an arrogant either!

[walt]

Intentionally targeting protected fish because its fun and not technically "illegal" is still wrong.  I know in Montana they had to change the regs because some shady guides were "incidentally" catching bull trout while fishing the Blackfoot.  (with 6" streamers of course.)  Now they can ticket you for targeting those fish.  Not a bad idea in my book.

[WDFW Hates ME!!!]

I think i have expressed my opinion on this subject already and it didn't get anywhere.
So they are cutting back on hatchery programs for sturgeon, do you think that the natural spawners will be even more important then??? Of course not because hooking them doesn't hurt them at all, not one bit.

[shoot-em-dead]

Just out of curiosity, I heard that the studies done on sturgeon are based on guesses of how many fish might be in the river and that no number could be accurately obtained due to sturgeon hugging the bottom and not showing up on fish finders. I am not trying to be a smart arse but it is a legit question. I have been on some nice boats with some good fish finders and have only seen a few show up on the screen while we cant keep them off the hook. Another thought is a thread I seen on the Hunting-Washington site of a few pics of thousands of sturgeon that had been caught in a pool of water as the tide went out so how many more does the ocean hold? To panic and say we are going to loose this fish sounds totally absurd to me but like I said I am not an expert. I will say however that sturgeon are one tough fish and to even think for a minute that they are harmed by catching them is BS. I have caught keepers and beat them over the head to kill them and slit there gills to bleed them out and they are still very much alive when I get home to fillet them. I have only caught one oversize and I don't even see how it would be possible to take one out of the water. They are big and one little twitch from one could really hurt.

[Jackjr]

Looks like a blast

[WDFW Hates ME!!!]

Shoot-em-dead there are studies that show when females are fought for an extended period of time they reabsorb there eggs and do not spawn that year, or the next as they do not spawn every year.

That picture you saw was of the puget sound. And it is nice that you THINK there is no shortage of sturgeon. I am not a bio, and i do not to pretend to be one, but there are studies and people that want to twist facts to fit there needs (convincing themselves they are being ethical to make money). I do not have a stake in it, i fish for sturgeon 3-4 days a year now because i just don't make the time to, but i would like to see future generations catch fish. and just because you think it is o.k. must mean there are enought fish to go around...

[shoot-em-dead]

I didn't say that I think there are more fish. I asked if what I heard was true or not. That the figures were accurate or just made up. I enjoy fishing for them just like everyone else but if they are endangered then you had better believe I would never go after them again.

[cohoho]

I have been reading alot of this and probably have something to do with the simple question I asked in the beginning about fishing for them at night, like Catfishing back east.  He is doing what is legal is he not?  Unethical? Come on, I agree with most of you about maybe the way he makes post and arguments might be pretty brash.  What everyone believes - really doesn't change what is going to happen, people are excited and trilled with the ideal of landing a 6 foot plus fish.  As long as Fish and Game keep it open, fishing for the big guys will occur, some will be on the river alot more than others, thus will catch more fish.  Is it OK cause I go down there on weekends and catch a few per season any different than someone living there and taking clients out for their adrenaline fix or their once in a lifetime adventure?  When TV shows started showing folks catching these over sized I was determined to start fishing for them, right then and there.  I go for Keepers but mostly catch the shakers, unless Robodad is one the boat...  and a few times already this year we hooked and brought in a couple big keepers 50 plus, and a couple oversized out of water where folks stated the big ones don't go..  I have yet to fish the dam area and target the Oversized.  Will I, yes, sometime in the future during the summer....  I guess I haven't been here long enough or know what is currently going on with that species, but alot of your arguments have gotten me wanting to start exploring data on these fish. One thing, it is to easy to become a guide within this state for Sturgeon, (USCG Six Pac License, A state Non-game license a couple minor things and bam your a guide).  You add that to really crappy spring Salmon fishing (sorry, I can only judge it by what I have seen so far, and what I am used to) then you got guys bailing to where their bills are paid from.  Booking is really easy for Sturgeon also, high success rate compared to Salmon and the chance for folks to catch monsters and your booked fully for the duration of the season.  A few of you have great information, but until more than the folks on this site see the whole picture and there are studies, it will not change.  I am not defending Hoyt nor other guides, but there are alot of them, I have called a quite a few for information and most state do you want Oversized or eaters?  And the conversation quickly turns to how big are the oversized..etc.... There is no way I will quit fishing for these fish until I hear concrete information that states they are in trouble, I might not catch too many over sized but I have and will continue on occasion, then what I am an unethical person too...  So is it the same as someone that only hunts for the biggest Elk, Deer or Bear, I mean the littler ones eat just as good right?  I think some of you have Sturgeon envy.....

[robodad]

I think some of you have Sturgeon envy.....     

Indeed !!!