What would you do?

[Humptulips]

Coyotes, Hasn't been a limit for a long time= Do they have a HUGE effect on deer?  IMHO, No.

Wrong. Studies have shown that coyotes are the biggest killer of deer fawns. In one study....... and there have been quite a few......

"Later, Miller went on to conduct a second study in Southwest Georgia on 2 sections of land.  One section of 11,000 acres, 23 coyotes and 3 bobcats were trapped and on another 7,000 acres no trapping was done. The results were staggering.  In the trapped area, 2 out of every 3 does had fawns. In contrast, in the un-trapped area only 1 out of 28 does had fawns."

My Opinion is wrong?       it's just an opinion..... opinion's are neither right or wrong.

Sorry, did not script it properly. HUGE meaning HUGE, like 10,s of 1'000's


Anyhoo, the point was we have a slim chance of changing our predator kill numbers.

I reject the notion that we cannot change our predator kill numbers. WE could but there has to be the political will to do so. I'm sorry that I don't have an easy answer to this problem but I think we could start by framing the problem better as a result of poor or no predator management.
I think we could start with a better estimate of predator populations and an estimate of how many ungulates, since we are talking deer here it takes to service that predator population. Then an allocation needs to be made for predators, and hunters to decide whether our ungulate population can even supply that number. Is our ungulate population going to increase, decrease or be stable based on those numbers? If there is support for more deer and given the pressures on the population it is not going to increase, more harvest of predators should be supported. Put simply an analyses of the carrying capacity which is usually associated with ungulates but should have equal standing when determining predator harvest.
I really don't see that equation being considered now.

[hunter399]

I know the management talk is getting heated here...

If predator seasons stays the same as current.
Everyone hunted predators like deer and Elk .
We wouldn't have a predator problem.

The other subject of APR.
I know it's a turn off for most.
The way I see it,you for APR or draw only for the whole state.
Otherwise we just keep declining till hunting is gone all together.

APR we may extend our OTC seasons.

Permit only ,has benefits as well, control over tag limits ect.

We can't allow ungulate population to dip to low, anti-hunters will eat us alive.

My opinion both need to be applied now for certain areas.

[Pacific Ghost]

I offered an idea earlier for Blacktail that basically only concerned the areas close to me. However, from a statewide deer herd perspective (and elk as well), I agree that the number one problem is predator management and control. Black bear hunting opportunity should be maximized, starting with the rightful return of the spring season next year. Cougar hunting should be year round, with no bag limit, in all areas, until the statewide allowed amount is harvested. Certain areas need some kind of extra help, such as hound pursuit, to get the population back under control. As far as wolves, and now maybe grizzlies; we don't need them. We thrived for a long time without them. There are plenty of wolves in North America without any in Washington State. They are not endangered just because they don't exist now exactly where they once did. If the left wants to re-wild this state, how about they start with removing themselves. There were about 6 million residents in WA in the year 2000, and now we are approaching 8 Million. Blue has moved in and red has moved out. If you are one of King County's 2.3 million residents, please pack up and go to a blue state. If you're not a lefty, then choose one of the other 38 counties. Once you're all gone, we will re-wild the entirety of King Co into a sanctuary. Then we can get on with correctly managing our fish and game. I guarantee you the deer herds, along with the rest of our wildlife, will be much better off.

[Stein]

If everyone goes out and starts laying it to the cougars, the commission will shut that down.  They are already looking to trim predator hunting at the current low rates, if they double I can't imagine a situation where they wouldn't address that.

[hughjorgan]

So if we go to permit only; how many more cougars will NOT be killed or bears for that matter from opportunistic rifle hunters during modern, muzzleloader and archery season because we limited the amount of people?

Also how are you going to retain or recruit more people into hunting when you can’t hunt every year? Are you going to be able to recruit a new generation into hunting by implementing such a policy?

Is improving habitat not a way to increase the size of the pie that were all fighting for a sliver of?

[Barodir393]

Some ideas without changing seasons:

Start with getting more animal overpasses and underpasses over larger highways and trains to allow more movement of animals for genetic diversity and hopefully save a thousand animal lives a year.

Introduce a program that if you opened up your land to "Feel free to hunt" (minimum 20 acres) you would get 1 preference point per year you open it. Might increase point creep but should hopefully increase overall opportunity.

One season change:

Open back up spring bear and be aggressive with the permits at the start.

[mcrawfordaf]

Start with getting more animal overpasses and underpasses over larger highways and trains to allow more movement of animals for genetic diversity and hopefully save a thousand animal lives a year.

Great idea IMO. THe majority of these that have been implemented are very successful.