Seeking Advice on Purchase of a Used, Light SUV

[ivarhusa]

I am not the "bean counter" some of you are, but my intention is to estimate the difference in gas (operating) cost for whatever several car-buying options I have, and factor that into the price I am willing to pay for a vehicle.  I wish I knew reliably about ALL operating costs, maintenance included, but "gas" is one good factor to know about.  I hear about "reliability" for the Toyota's, so I would "take a little off" the gu-estimated operating cost for that line.

I drive about 15,000 miles per year.  Taking what I hope is a conservative value for an average gas cost for the next 5 years of $3.50 per gallon, I come up with an annual gas cost of $2,386 for a "base-line" value of 22 mpg. Now, to compare all other MPG options to this, I come up with:

• 20 mpg costs me $238 per year more
• 18 mpg costs me 530 per year more
• 16 mpg costs me $894 per year more
• 14 mpg costs me $1363 per year more

If I assume a 5% annual discount rate and a five year life of my investment, I get these values for the "premium to be paid" for accepting less than 22 mpg (and that was an arbitrary "good" number to shoot for):

• 20 mpg will add $1,033 to the "cost" of my "new" vehicle.
• 18 mpg will add $2,295 to the "cost" of my "new" vehicle.
• 16 mpg will add $3,874 to the "cost" of my "new" vehicle.
• 14 mpg will add $5,903 to the "cost" of my "new" vehicle.

These numbers suggest how much of a "good deal" I would need to get in order to cover the additional gas expense. How am I doing, bean counters?  (Is 5% a useful number?  Is 5 years a realistic time frame?) These 'costs' can also be offset by differential 'perceived utility'. I should be willing to pay more for added cargo volume, or ground clearance. (Yeah, I am leaning away from the CRV-class of vehicle, as nice as they are for most roads.)

As for tracking MPG week-to-week, I don't do it.  I don't figure it provides enough insight into possible maintenance needs to justify the effort.  How many times a year do you need reminding that your Land Cruiser gets 12 mpg in the city? (As mine did.)

Ivar

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[jackelope]

if you pick a vehicle i can tell you how much 15k/30k/etc services cost...maintenance intervals, etc.
if you're looking at 4 runner-cherokee and other like sized 6 cylinder powered vehicles, you should expect 16-18mpg normal driving and low 20's on the highway.
what do you mean by this statement?

As for tracking MPG week-to-week, I don't do it.  I don't figure it provides enough insight into possible maintenance needs to justify the effort.

[JackOfAllTrades]

Yeah, we heard from the 'Yota' fans.

Not quite indestructable. Good bang for the buck for many versions. True offroaders hate the later models with IFS.

I'm a Ford guy, and since you said that you're not a bean counter, then my choice is a full sized truck. (4x4 PowerStrokeDiesel)  I almost bought a Dodge Cummins but they didn't offer zero percent financing at the time.

I say full sized because you've got so much more room to haul gear and game.

Sure, my truck costs more, (hell, the engine was a $5,000 option), but it does average 17.5mpg and has gotten up to 21mpg on the freeway. (I've kept a log book since day one.) Will tow my 30' camp trailer up any paved hill. Towing, I get about 15mpg when running across the passes. So, if you think you'd ever want to get a camp trailer for your hunting excursions then you need to think bigger rig.

All that said, the wife has had Jeep Cherokees for the last 12 years. Love'm! Very capable rig. I'm sure there are supporters for Nissan Pathfinder out there too. Also capable rigs.

If you're on a budget...
My son loves his older good running Bronco II.  TURNS ON A FRIGGIN DIME. With a little lift and set of good tires, these go anywhere you need to. Make sure you stay away from any carburated versions.  Can't rule out an early Explorer. The later model Ex's sit too low. Ford's 4.0L was a good engine. Stay away from anything that says Cheby S10.

If you aren't thinking about a full sized truck or are willing to sway away from an SUV, then a Dodge Dakota would be worth looking at. V8 versions, the rear end is a weak link.

My  
-Steve

[ivarhusa]

what do you mean by this statement?

As for tracking MPG week-to-week, I don't do it.  I don't figure it provides enough insight into possible maintenance needs to justify the effort.

I believe MPG data are useful when picking a vehicle, but once you own the vehicle, there isn't much you can do to affect it.  So why measure miles drive and fuel consumed? In days gone by, decreasing mileage tended to indicate a tuneup was due.  But these days we  have much longer maintenance intervals, because the electronic ignition is so reliable and effective. (For what it is worth, I also don't balance my checkbook.  Go figure.)

[whacker1]

Like Ice we have a Ford Explorer.  I don't take it hunting, but over the last couple of crazy winters we have had in Spokane it has been put through the test both in clearance, holding the road, etc.  I like it a lot.  4.0 litre v6 at 220 horsepower. 

My other rig is a 97 F150, which barely has more horsepower.  This is the rig that goes hunting.

[EastWaViking]

Nissan xterra's are pretty nice and built on a frontier frame so they have good clearance.  That might be my next rig.

[oneezreiter]

I have had 2 ford explorers with the 4L, and have had great luck with both of them.  I had a Jeep Liberty and hated it, gas milage was horrible.  I averaged only 13 mpg. 

[Wanttohuntmore]

I had a Jeep Liberty and hated it, gas milage was horrible.  I averaged only 13 mpg. 

I'm amazed that was all you got with the Liberty.  What kind of driving was it?  My in-laws avg around 18 with theres, and get low 20's on the highway.  I also had 3 jeep cherokees, 2 with the 4.0, and one of the old 2.5 4 cyl.  All of them got over 200K miles, engines were fantastic in all of them, I'd even venture to say I would trust one of them over any Toyota.  They did have quirks though, the brakes sucked in them, and the water pumps on the 4.0's give out.  Spent 5 hours waitin for a tow truck on Vantage hill in 95 degree weather.  All we had to drink was warm beer, seriously.  Needless to say, my wife and dog were happy, I was thirsty.....

[cully]

Something wrong with that liberty, should be around 17-18mpg. ivarhusa toys, nissans and jeeps are all great vehicles and will last beyond 200k-300k with proper maint. I saw the jeep dealership here in town with some great sales on the liberty's. May not be as capable as some other models but I doubt there is anything out there with the longevity, features and capabilities for 13-14k.

[jackelope]

i worked in the service dept at the jeep dealership for +/- 7 years and if a liberty was only getting 13mpg there was either something wrong with the car or your math.
they are great cars, 2nd in reliability to the cherokees and wranglers IMO. the  3.7L is a good motor for a liberty sized vehicle. my wife's grand cherokee has a 3.7 in it and that car is too big and it's a gutless turd. it's too bad the 2.8CRD diesel in the liberty turned out to have some issues because it is an awesome powerplant for that vehicle.


4.0L water pumps go south, but so do pretty much a lot of water pumps. usually they give some warning by making some noise or a slow leak or something along those lines...5.2 v8 water pumps went bad more often than the 4.0 inline 6 did.

[Skyvalhunter]

Is that because so much of that surpentine belt rides on the water pump thus causing extra pressure on the bearings?

[cully]

ya, waterpumps, radiators and starters do give out on jeeps around 100k, all can be bought aftermarket for around a $100 each and are easy fixes if you are mechanically inclined. I really wouldn't let that deter you since we are taking around 100k miles! All vehicles need replacement parts with that many miles.

[jackelope]

Is that because so much of that surpentine belt rides on the water pump thus causing extra pressure on the bearings?

the bearings fail making them piss out of the peehole in the bottom of the pump. we used to see a lot of water pumps go south after a belt was replaced...but that's not strictly jeeps...that'll happen everywhere. water pumps leak out of the peehole on the bottom of the pump because the bearings get loose, wears on the internal seals and lets them leak.

[ivarhusa]

I am paying attention, guys.  I had "the talk" with my wife about a new vehicle, and if it comes out of "my money" she is OK with it.  So, I am officially (or at least openly) looking to buy.

Ivar

[JackOfAllTrades]

Do you do have an Excel spreadsheet, too?

While I'm not a 'Bean Counter' in the profession, I don't keep a spread sheet current, but I do keep a log book in the console of the truck. Every fillup I calculate the fuel economy. I've done that since the first tankful of fuel in 2004 for my truck. I know when I've been driving hard, I know when I've fueled up with a substandard batch of fuel. I know when there's a transition from summer to winter diesel. I could tell the difference after a couple of engine modifications. Keeping logs, either in spread sheet or a log book can yeild a lot of information about how your vehicle is performing.

-Steve