308 load development imr 4064 vs varget

[craigapphunt]

Specifically for 168-180 gr bullets. Anyone ran an experiment or just noticed if the two powders are nearly interchangeable or have you had luck with one over the other? Im aware of the inherent differences in the two powders as far as temp stability and fouling ect. Im more interested in accuracy. I have a dozen 168s and a dozen 175s to test over either powder.

[jrebel]

Never used 4064....but Varget has always been a very nice powder for the .308.  We loaded 150's over varget and had great accuracy in our .308. 

[TommyH]

Sorry I’m no help cause I haven’t been able to find any of that stuff lately. so i went with what was available .. IMR4320, 5 at 43.5 gr. 5 at 44gr. and 5 at 44.5  with 168 eldms, was getting pretty good groups at 100 and punched steel out to 300.  About out of that 4320 now so I’ll be on the look out for either of the 4064 or varget so let us know what you go with and how it groups. 

[jrebel]

Sorry I’m no help cause I haven’t been able to find any of that stuff lately. so i went with what was available .. IMR4320, 5 at 43.5 gr. 5 at 44gr. and 5 at 44.5  with 168 eldms, was getting pretty good groups at 100 and punched steel out to 300.  About out of that 4320 now so I’ll be on the look out for either of the 4064 or varget so let us know what you go with and how it groups. 

Lots of online stores have Varget in stock.  Also seen quite a few with fee shipping or free hazmat.  Prices are as good as I have seen in 5 years too with some online stores. 

[OltHunter]

Go 4064 if you have a short barrel as it's a bit faster. It was very stable and accurate from my 308 with a 20" barrel. Varget will work great, probably give you a great round, but it will be about almost 50 fps slower, if that matters. And this was all my experience. And this was 165 Accubonds. 4065 was my most accurate load. If you have it, worth a shot. Going up to 175, varget starts to get more interesting. Longer barrel, heavier bullets, I'd lean varget. just my experience with those 2 powders.

[craigapphunt]

Go 4064 if you have a short barrel as it's a bit faster. It was very stable and accurate from my 308 with a 20" barrel. Varget will work great, probably give you a great round, but it will be about almost 50 fps slower, if that matters. And this was all my experience. And this was 165 Accubonds. 4065 was my most accurate load. If you have it, worth a shot. Going up to 175, varget starts to get more interesting. Longer barrel, heavier bullets, I'd lean varget. just my experience with those 2 powders.

As it turns out mine is 20" . Not to mention I have alot more 4064 than varget. Have you seen better velocity with varget and 175s in short barrels as well?

[jrebel]

The burn rates are so similar / close.....any increase in speed would be negligible.  If your worried about the 20" barrel and need a faster powder, you could look at H335 or H4895.  Only way to know what your gun likes is to run some bullets down the pipe. 

[craigapphunt]

The burn rates are so similar / close.....any increase in speed would be negligible.  If your worried about the 20" barrel and need a faster powder, you could look at H335 or H4895.  Only way to know what your gun likes is to run some bullets down the pipe.

Priority is definitely accuracy first but if I can get a few more fps why not. I'm debating whether or not to split the twelve bullet in each weight in two groups of three running both powders or just pick one powder or the other for all twelve in both weights if that makes any sense. My only concern about trying both powders in both is I only get to try two charge weights.

[jrebel]

The burn rates are so similar / close.....any increase in speed would be negligible.  If your worried about the 20" barrel and need a faster powder, you could look at H335 or H4895.  Only way to know what your gun likes is to run some bullets down the pipe.

Priority is definitely accuracy first but if I can get a few more fps why not. I'm debating whether or not to split the twelve bullet in each weight in two groups of three running both powders or just pick one powder or the other for all twelve in both weights if that makes any sense. My only concern about trying both powders in both is I only get to try two charge weights.

Why so few bullets to try? 

Run a ladder test in 1 grain increments to see what your velocities will be.  Stop at pressure and back down.  Pay attention to your groupings with the shots and see if it produces a noticeable node.  Load 3 rounds and shoot for groups.

Are the two bullets same bullet / manufacturer, just different weights? 

We worked a load for my father in laws .270 last week and had a sub MOA group in less than 12 rounds.  That said, they were with bullets I am very familiar with but the process is still the same. 

[HereDuckyDucky]

I’ve tries both, but Varget has always been the secret sauce for .308.

RW

[OltHunter]

Go 4064 if you have a short barrel as it's a bit faster. It was very stable and accurate from my 308 with a 20" barrel. Varget will work great, probably give you a great round, but it will be about almost 50 fps slower, if that matters. And this was all my experience. And this was 165 Accubonds. 4065 was my most accurate load. If you have it, worth a shot. Going up to 175, varget starts to get more interesting. Longer barrel, heavier bullets, I'd lean varget. just my experience with those 2 powders.

As it turns out mine is 20" . Not to mention I have alot more 4064 than varget. Have you seen better velocity with varget and 175s in short barrels as well?

I haven't tried 175's at all.

I can't find my notes on heavier, I believe 190's were 2420 fps with varget. I haven't tried 4064 on anything over 165.

I'm at 2750 fps with the 165s.

[craigapphunt]

The burn rates are so similar / close.....any increase in speed would be negligible.  If your worried about the 20" barrel and need a faster powder, you could look at H335 or H4895.  Only way to know what your gun likes is to run some bullets down the pipe.

Priority is definitely accuracy first but if I can get a few more fps why not. I'm debating whether or not to split the twelve bullet in each weight in two groups of three running both powders or just pick one powder or the other for all twelve in both weights if that makes any sense. My only concern about trying both powders in both is I only get to try two charge weights.

Why so few bullets to try? 


I ordered a few samples packs that come in 12. The 3 I'm gonna test are all sierra tmk in 155 168 and 175. The 155s are getting 8208 xbr.